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Type 2 Reversible

E

Ellen67

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When I had my blood test on thur to see if I am getting diabetes the nurse said all type 2 diabetes is reversible. How true is this especially if you have a strong family history as I do? She said the main thing is to cut iyt
 
Many type 2 are able to put their condition into remission so long as their pancreas is still putting out insulin, in fact most of us put out huge amounts. Genetics does play a part but diet can make a huge difference and let’s face it we often eat the way our families eat.

Get your actual numbers not just a “fine” or “bit high” or whatever when you get the results, you are entitled to them.

If you do have diabetes or are heading that way then you can help yourself. But not by avoiding fat. Carbs are what causes us the problems. Being overweight makes things worse but having diabetes can cause you to gain weight. Bit of a chicken and egg scenario. Nhs is fixated on eating fat makes you fat and it just isn’t true.

Simplistically put - Eating more energy than you can use and storing it instead makes you fat. As diabetics we can’t process carbs properly and have huge amounts of insulin floating about trying to do so. We end up with unusable sugar from those carbs in our blood and insulin is a fat storing hormone, so ....it stores the unused carbs/sugar/glucose as body fat.

Controlling the carbs> controlling the blood sugars>controlling the weight.

Have a read of these links for more explanations and ideas how to do it

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Can I suggest you take a good look at low carb high fat methods of eating (keto is just a version of this). It helps many of us lose significant amounts of weight, if desired, keep our numbers down and for some even eliminate medications and achieve remission and reduce or improve complications. Try clicking these links for more detailed explanations that are well worth readings


https://www.diabetes.co.uk/forum/blog/jokalsbeek.401801/ for info including low carb made simple


And https://www.diabetes.co.uk/forum/category/success-stories-and-testimonials.43/ to show it really works and for motivation


and https://www.diabetes.co.uk/forum/threads/what-have-you-eaten-today.75781/ for food ideas


also https://www.dietdoctor.com/ for more food ideas and general info of carb content of foods. Lots of other websites for recipes out there too. Just use the term low carb or keto with whatever you fancy.


Also it’s very important to be able to check for yourself what’s happening so you can make the necessary adjustments day to day and meal by meal rather than wait 3,6 or even 12 months and then have no idea what had what effect. Getting a blood glucose meter is the only way to do this (no matter what contradictory advice you may have heard - it’s usually budget based rather than anything more scientific). Please ask if you want any guidance on this.



IMPORTANT FOR ANYONE ON MEDS CONSIDERING LOWERING CARBS: if you lower your carbs then any glucose lowering meds may need to be adjusted accordingly to make sure you aren’t taking more than your new diet requires. It can cause a hypo if you have more gliclazide or insulin etc (this is not relevant for metformin on its own) than your new carb intake requires. Keep a close eye on your numbers and ideally do this with your dr. Please don’t be put off by an ill informed out dated rubbishing of low carb diets or being told you should eat carbs to match meds, it should be the other way around.
 
Ellen67 said:
When I had my blood test on thur to see if I am getting diabetes the nurse said all type 2 diabetes is reversible. How true is this especially if you have a strong family history as I do? She said the main thing is to cut iyt
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Hello @Ellen67,

I agree with what @HSSS has said above.

There is a very good chance that T2 diabetes is reversible, should you be diagnosed with it. I would hesitate, though, to say it is reversible for all (depending on your insulin production and the lifestyle you adopt).

I was diagnosed with an HbA1c of 100, which is very high, and have a strong family history of diabetes (father, paternal grandfather, maternal grandmother) and succeeded in getting my blood sugars down to non-diabetic levels within three months after diagnosis (where it has stayed for the last three and half years) by going low carb. So, it can be done.

Feel free to ask any questions you may have. There are lots of knowledgeable, friendly, and helpful people on this forum who will be more than happy to help.
 
Nurses seem to be very digital in their opinions - even I would be hesitant to agree with such a sweeping statement, but for many type twos reporting on various parts of the internet, plus some I've met face to face, type two diabetes just becomes irrelevant if you reduce the foods you eat that cause the problems.
Foods with high amounts of starches and sugars, concocted dishes with the same components will all cause your blood glucose to rise for varying amounts of time.
Low carb foods can supply nourishment and variety, and swapping over to fat burning rather than using glucose for energy seems to suit many people very well indeed.
 
I’m only two weeks post diagnosis but I really feel that language like “remission” or “well managed” are better than reversal. It’s not curable (yet), and while plenty of people can go for decades, sometimes assisted with medication and sometimes just with diet and exercise, others can do exactly the same and be blindsided with sudden high levels that progress onto all the nasty complications. If, fate willing, I’m ever able to get my glucose down to muggle levels and sustain it, I personally won’t consider I’m cured or that I’ve “reversed” it, as I could be one plate of pasta away from where I am now, or worse.

Sorry for the grossness of this analogy and I know it’s not perfect, but someone with herpes can go for years and years without an outbreak, but that doesn’t mean they don’t have herpes anymore.
 
Ellen67 said:
the nurse said all type 2 diabetes is reversible.
Click to expand...

If by reversible you mean reversing the trend in your BG numbers from going up to going down then yes that is achievable quite easily.

Beyond that, getting into a debate about what the exact meaning of reversible is, will likely make your head explode
 
Ellen67 said:
When I had my blood test on thur to see if I am getting diabetes the nurse said all type 2 diabetes is reversible. How true is this especially if you have a strong family history as I do? She said the main thing is to cut iyt
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Thank you all for your input I must say the nurse wound me up a bit by saying it can be reversed if you cut out carbs until I said all my dad's side are t2 diabetic my mums side t1 diabetic she then went quiet. Whatever my results I think I'm going that way so want to try and re jig my diet. Any suggestions on what ceral can i have for breakfast as can't stomach eggs first thing and suggestion for lunch without bread
 
You could always have what I had for breakfast and lunch today................

................nothing. Works a treat.
 
Ellen67 said:
Any suggestions on what ceral can i have for breakfast as can't stomach eggs first thing and suggestion for lunch without bread
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Skip breakfast entirely and extend your overnight fast? and as for lunch just have what you would have put inside the sandwich without the bread.. or make a sandwich of ham slices and cheese slices (or for variety cheese slices and ham slices).
 
There are quite a few low carb breakfast cereal/granola/muesli recipes on the web, but you would need to prepare them yourself.
And there are a few lower carb breakfast cereal/granola/muesli packs in supermarkets, but these are rarely actually low carb, and are usually v expensive.

I have made this several times for my husband. It is delicious (think better than crunchy nut cornflakes), high in calories and the ingredients are expensive.
https://www.ditchthecarbs.com/grain-free-cinnamon-crunch/
Personally, I avoid any cereal-like product at breakfast. They do me no favours whatsoever, and often trigger cravings for carby stuff.
 
Adm_Mad said:
I’m only two weeks post diagnosis but I really feel that language like “remission” or “well managed” are better than reversal. It’s not curable (yet),...
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I agree. It's true that many of us T2s can reverse our symptoms (i.e.the increase in blood glucose) by adapting our diet and/or exercising more and/or using medication and sticking to it, but we can't currently reverse the diabetes itself that caused the harmful symptoms.

Apart from anything else, if it becomes common 'wisdom' that diabetes is reversible, then non-diabetic people ("muggles"
) might be less likely to make healthy lifestyle adjustments to avoid getting diabetes in the first place, on the assumption that if they do get it they can simply reverse it. Duh, no.

Even saying that you can reverse the symptoms doesn't make it clear that the symptoms will only stay reversed as long as you maintain the adapted diet/exercise/medication.

One final point is that if T2 is trivialised then it will take the pressure of the food industry to do a bit more to help.

p.s. Apologies to all those who already done this subject to death. Just wanted to chip in my tuppence worth. Feel free to tldr;
 
I disagree it should be kept a secret. Vociferously

Alternative to your points generations of families who have been told its progressive and drugs will be more and more relied on and complications are to be expected will learn that this is not a foregone conclusion and even some long term diabetics can vastly improve their lot by changing their diet

Food manufacturers will be forced to reduce carbs and offer better alternatives

People will know which foods send them down the path to diabetes and can avoid stepping that way in the first place.

Telling people they can help themselves, as much as if not more than drugs in many cases, is not trivialising it in any way shape or form.

It’s not reversible as in a cure. It’s controllable as in normal levels and no symptoms as long as the management is maintained.
 
The nurse is almost right though. Many Type 2 can gain control (reverse is misleading it’s not a cure) by cutting out carbs no matter how many of their family have it. Even type 1 get some benefits from it. Not sure why that would wind you up.
 
Ellen67 said:
When I had my blood test on thur to see if I am getting diabetes the nurse said all type 2 diabetes is reversible. How true is this especially if you have a strong family history as I do? She said the main thing is to cut iyt
Click to expand...
This depends on definitions, such as is reversal below 48 mmol or 42 mmol (I believe the latter, some go with the former). How many HbA1c's does the person have to have in an unbroken row (I believe 3). There are other considerations such as can drugs also be part of a reversal. What is called "normal" eating and drinking, some believe eating normally is being able to eat foods such as doughnuts, milk chocolates, chips and the like (I do not believe this is normal for the human genotype, I think wholefoods is where its at for the majority of calories).

Remission is what I favour, as it is effectively the cessation of the condition, which could come back if the things done to achieve cessation are not adhered to. Reversed implies a cure. Both terms are within the remit of the NHS to describe someone with Type 2 who has done well with diabetes.

I think one often overlooked area is mental reversal. By this I mean blood glucose numbers maybe in the normal range for non-diabetics and other metrics might be great, but is the person accepting of the alternative choices needed to stay well, as witnessed at Christmas and Easter. I personally had no issues at these times, where I know many of my peers on this site really suffered - I believe one has to make peace with this situation to be truly reversed or in remission, but this is nuanced as I focus on physical goals so I have more in common with how the performance world views "extra curricula" foods, in addition to being put off due to be so ill initiallly.
 
If you are not taking diabetic drugs then you could just miss breakfast out. On the days I eat, because I can't eat eggs first thing I have a mix of chia seeds and milled flaxseed with a little oatbran, made with water and coconut milk, then I add cinnamon and cream.
I didn't like the texture of chia porridge, so I tried different versions, starting with 18g of oatbran. I'm down to 10g oatbran and more flaxseed now and my breakfast, which includes a milky coffee, is about 17g of carbs.
Alternatives are bacon with mushrooms and/or avocado, Greek yogurt with a few berries (note that real Greek yogurt from whole milk is lower carb than most others), or just some cheese.
 
Greek yoghurt and berries.
A fake porridge made from coconut flour and milk, maybe mixing in flaxseeds chia seeds etc.
Bacon
Last nights left overs. This morning was leftover roast dinner. It’s only convention and western conditioning that means there are “special foods” for breakfast.
 
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I think you should feel lucky that you have found a nurse who believes that cutting down carbs is a positive step toward diabetes control. Most still think a balanced diet including lots of good carbs is the only way to do it.
 

Hi @Ellen67
I'm reading this on a platform that doesn't show members details, so sorry if this info is given elsewhere. Have you had T2 confirmed? If not, a C-peptide blood test may be worth requesting, to rule out your Mum's side's T1 tendencies?

My understanding is that some T2s eventually stop producing insulin and then need to inject it. In those cases, 'remission' or 'reversal' will be difficult. So the d nurse over-simplified, imo.

Best wishes
 
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