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So I Made a Mistake or Two

R

Raygower

Active Member
Messages
33
Location
Gloucester
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Treatment type
Diet only
Dislikes
Doctors
As I’ve been lurking for a while, and more recently, poking the odd oar in, I thought it high time to introduce myself properly.

I was diagnosed with type 2 Diabetes early this year, having made the mistake of accepting my new doctor’s invitation to go for a ‘Well man’s MOT’.

I also have a long history of Ulcerative Colitis.
Any colitis sufferer can tell you, colitis is the cause of everything, from septic arthritus, to being run over by a truck. We know because the next phrase used by the doctor after 'What seems to be the problem?', is ‘It’s the colitis.’ So, even though it is not mentioned in 'The Talk', even as a possibility (brain tumours and throat cancer are sexier?), diagnosis of Diabetes, or any other condition, can never be a surprise.
Besides, at the time of my 'The Talk', Diabetes was irrelevant. Most of the red stuff trickling down my legs wasn't mine!

20 years and a yard of innards later, we are mostly over that problem. Nothing that can't be sanforized by a tablespoon of TCP.
But it does mean a little care has to be taken with diet. I cannot, for instance, become a disciple/zealot of LCHF, or of fasting. It has taken 40 years on a 'See Food' diet to reach the safety of 13 stone. Even at that porky size, I’m a long way from being Michelin Man (I’m 6 feet 4). I can still lose a stone inside a week, when I don’t want and that leads to reaching for the TCP, or worse.
It does not mean I can not change my diet, or anything else, just means moderation, even experiment with a few alternatives. What killed the colitis taking up a pipe. My GP said it helped reduce stress levels, (but only after he retired).

So far we seem to have been passably successful. My A1C is down from the low 60’s to the mid 40’s and with my sugar readings averaging 6.5 I’m hopeful of another drop next week.
 
Raygower said:
As I’ve been lurking for a while, and more recently, poking the odd oar in, I thought it high time to introduce myself properly.

I was diagnosed with type 2 Diabetes early this year, having made the mistake of accepting my new doctor’s invitation to go for a ‘Well man’s MOT’.

I also have a long history of Ulcerative Colitis.
Any colitis sufferer can tell you, colitis is the cause of everything, from septic arthritus, to being run over by a truck. We know because the next phrase used by the doctor after 'What seems to be the problem?', is ‘It’s the colitis.’ So, even though it is not mentioned in 'The Talk', even as a possibility (brain tumours and throat cancer are sexier?), diagnosis of Diabetes, or any other condition, can never be a surprise.
Besides, at the time of my 'The Talk', Diabetes was irrelevant. Most of the red stuff trickling down my legs wasn't mine!

20 years and a yard of innards later, we are mostly over that problem. Nothing that can't be sanforized by a tablespoon of TCP.
But it does mean a little care has to be taken with diet. I cannot, for instance, become a disciple/zealot of LCHF, or of fasting. It has taken 40 years on a 'See Food' diet to reach the safety of 13 stone. Even at that porky size, I’m a long way from being Michelin Man (I’m 6 feet 4). I can still lose a stone inside a week, when I don’t want and that leads to reaching for the TCP, or worse.
It does not mean I can not change my diet, or anything else, just means moderation, even experiment with a few alternatives. What killed the colitis taking up a pipe. My GP said it helped reduce stress levels, (but only after he retired).

So far we seem to have been passably successful. My A1C is down from the low 60’s to the mid 40’s and with my sugar readings averaging 6.5 I’m hopeful of another drop next week.
Click to expand...

Hi there!

In my book? The name of the game is managing the BG levels. (However it's done is a personal journey.) You can only arm yourself with a meter & do the best you can.. :)
 
Well at least you’ve kept your sense of humour .

13 stone for a 6’4” man doesn’t sound so bad to me having gone to that and beyond and thankfully back again as a 5’6” woman.

I don’t know about your condition. What does it mean definitively for diet and what’s negotiable case by case?
 
@Raygower

Hello Raygower and welcome to the Forum :) Here is the Basic Information we give to new members and I hope you will find it useful. Ask questions when you need to and someone will try to help.

BASIC INFORMATION FOR NEW MEMBERS

Diabetes is the general term to describe people who have blood that is sweeter than normal. A number of different types of diabetes exist.

A diagnosis of diabetes tends to be a big shock for most of us. It’s far from the end of the world though and on this forum you'll find well over 235,000 people who are demonstrating this.

On the forum we have found that with the number of new people being diagnosed with diabetes each day, sometimes the NHS is not being able to give all the advice it would perhaps like to deliver - particularly with regards to people with type 2 diabetes.

The role of carbohydrate

Carbohydrates are a factor in diabetes because they ultimately break down into sugar (glucose) within our blood. We then need enough insulin to either convert the blood sugar into energy for our body, or to store the blood sugar as body fat.

If the amount of carbohydrate we take in is more than our body’s own (or injected) insulin can cope with, then our blood sugar will rise.

The bad news

Research indicates that raised blood sugar levels over a period of years can lead to organ damage, commonly referred to as diabetic complications.

The good news

People on the forum here have shown that there is plenty of opportunity to keep blood sugar levels from going too high. It’s a daily task but it’s within our reach and it’s well worth the effort.

Controlling your carbs

The info below is primarily aimed at people with type 2 diabetes, however, it may also be of benefit for other types of diabetes as well.

There are two approaches to controlling your carbs:
  • Reduce your carbohydrate intake
  • Choose ‘better’ carbohydrates
Reduce your carbohydrates

A large number of people on this forum have chosen to reduce the amount of carbohydrates they eat as they have found this to be an effective way of improving (lowering) their blood sugar levels.

The carbohydrates which tend to have the most pronounced effect on blood sugar levels tend to be starchy carbohydrates such as rice, pasta, bread, potatoes and similar root vegetables, flour based products (pastry, cakes, biscuits, battered food etc) and certain fruits.

Choosing better carbohydrates

The low glycaemic index diet is often favoured by healthcare professionals but some people with diabetes find that low GI does not help their blood sugar enough and may wish to cut out these foods altogether.

Read more on carbohydrates and diabetes.

Over 145,000 people have taken part in the Low Carb Program - a 10 week structured education course that is helping people lose weight and reduce medication dependency by explaining the science behind carbs, insulin and GI.

Eating what works for you

Different people respond differently to different types of food. What works for one person may not work so well for another. The best way to see which foods are working for you is to test your blood sugar with a glucose meter.

To be able to see what effect a particular type of food or meal has on your blood sugar is to do a test before the meal and then test after the meal. A test 2 hours after the meal gives a good idea of how your body has reacted to the meal.

The blood sugar ranges recommended by NICE are as follows:

Blood glucose ranges for type 2 diabetes
  • Before meals: 4 to 7 mmol/l
  • 2 hours after meals: under 8.5 mmol/l
Blood glucose ranges for type 1 diabetes (adults)
  • Before meals: 4 to 7 mmol/l
  • 2 hours after meals: under 9 mmol/l
Blood glucose ranges for type 1 diabetes (children)
  • Before meals: 4 to 8 mmol/l
  • 2 hours after meals: under 10 mmol/l
However, those that are able to, may wish to keep blood sugar levels below the NICE after meal targets.

Access to blood glucose test strips

The NICE guidelines suggest that people newly diagnosed with type 2 diabetes should be offered:
  • structured education to every person and/or their carer at and around the time of diagnosis, with annual reinforcement and review
  • self-monitoring of plasma glucose to a person newly diagnosed with type 2 diabetes only as an integral part of his or her self-management education

Therefore both structured education and self-monitoring of blood glucose should be offered to people with type 2 diabetes. Read more on getting access to blood glucose testing supplies.

You may also be interested to read questions to ask at a diabetic clinic.

Note: This post has been edited from Sue/Ken's post to include up to date information.
Take part in Diabetes.co.uk digital education programs and improve your understanding. Most of these are free.

  • Low Carb Program - it's made front-page news of the New Scientist and The Times. Developed with 20,000 people with type 2 diabetes; 96% of people who take part recommend it... find out why

  • Hypo Program - improve your understanding of hypos. There's a version for people with diabetes, parents/guardians of children with type 1, children with type 1 diabetes, teachers and HCPs.
 
Raygower said:
As I’ve been lurking for a while, and more recently, poking the odd oar in, I thought it high time to introduce myself properly.

I was diagnosed with type 2 Diabetes early this year, having made the mistake of accepting my new doctor’s invitation to go for a ‘Well man’s MOT’.

I also have a long history of Ulcerative Colitis.
Any colitis sufferer can tell you, colitis is the cause of everything, from septic arthritus, to being run over by a truck. We know because the next phrase used by the doctor after 'What seems to be the problem?', is ‘It’s the colitis.’ So, even though it is not mentioned in 'The Talk', even as a possibility (brain tumours and throat cancer are sexier?), diagnosis of Diabetes, or any other condition, can never be a surprise.
Besides, at the time of my 'The Talk', Diabetes was irrelevant. Most of the red stuff trickling down my legs wasn't mine!

20 years and a yard of innards later, we are mostly over that problem. Nothing that can't be sanforized by a tablespoon of TCP.
But it does mean a little care has to be taken with diet. I cannot, for instance, become a disciple/zealot of LCHF, or of fasting. It has taken 40 years on a 'See Food' diet to reach the safety of 13 stone. Even at that porky size, I’m a long way from being Michelin Man (I’m 6 feet 4). I can still lose a stone inside a week, when I don’t want and that leads to reaching for the TCP, or worse.
It does not mean I can not change my diet, or anything else, just means moderation, even experiment with a few alternatives. What killed the colitis taking up a pipe. My GP said it helped reduce stress levels, (but only after he retired).

So far we seem to have been passably successful. My A1C is down from the low 60’s to the mid 40’s and with my sugar readings averaging 6.5 I’m hopeful of another drop next week.
Click to expand...


Hi Ray and welcome! I admire you greatly already, it is tricky enough when you 'just' have diabetes on its own but when you have other significant health issues as well, then it becomes a minefield. You seem to be managing magnificently so well done you! x
 
Jaylee said:
Hi there!

In my book? The name of the game is managing the BG levels. (However it's done is a personal journey.) You can only arm yourself with a meter & do the best you can.. :)
Click to expand...
My book says, 'Look it square in the eye and do not let it drive, whether it is crawling under the door at the hospital for a transfusion, or celebrating with an occasional reading of 10 on a bit of pizza.'
I will control it and I will beat it in to submission!
 
HSSS said:
Well at least you’ve kept your sense of humour .

13 stone for a 6’4” man doesn’t sound so bad to me having gone to that and beyond and thankfully back again as a 5’6” woman.

I don’t know about your condition. What does it mean definitively for diet and what’s negotiable case by case?
Click to expand...
Always got humour! :)

Officially, the medical profession gives out the same broken plate of contradictions as they offer up to diabetes. Some of the contradictions have a different slant: No fat, no sugar, no processed, fewer proteins and carbs etc. More meat, more fibre, more carbs etc.
40 years later, the crockery remains the same. We really ought to do more plate smashing at parties?
Because what I eat passes through a little quicker, I'm told I need to eat about 15% more calories than normal to stand still. For me, given that I have a job that gets quite active, that means between 2,500-3,000 calories a day.

Practically, the problem is more mechanical, than dietary. I need to avoid constipation and diaorhea because they strain the stomach, so fibre is important and I tend to limit things like nuts, because I can't digest them properly,

Realistically, the battle is to eat enough to maintain weight. Smaller stomach and general lack of appertite makes meals a long lasting chore. So I tend to be a grazer and carbs are more effective in maintaining body fat than protein.
 
Ok so have I got this right?

Fat: no issues beyond the usual NHS scare of it for heart health/cholesterol reasons? This is good for feeling full, energy, constipation and absorption of fat sooluble vitamins. Not so good for diarrhoea potentially

Carbs: bad for diabetes. Helps you maintain weight, but probably body fat rather than muscle. Source of fibre to keep it all moving

Protein: maintains body muscle rather than body fat. Excess might cause constipation

That leads back to lchf with moderate protein.still a little confused what causes you a problem with it other than enough fat to maintain weight and likely no fasting but more regular meals
 
Your sense of humour will see you through this journey. That, and a meter to keep you on track..

I know little about your condition other than my daughter had it. Note the past tense. She certainly did not go low fat, and I am struggling to understand why the two conditions require different diets. As long as you eat the required amount of fibre, drink plenty of fluids, and stay off the diabetes drug Metformin, you ought to be OK.
 
HSSS said:
Ok so have I got this right?

Fat: no issues beyond the usual NHS scare of it for heart health/cholesterol reasons? This is good for feeling full, energy, constipation and absorption of fat sooluble vitamins. Not so good for diarrhoea potentially

Carbs: bad for diabetes. Helps you maintain weight, but probably body fat rather than muscle. Source of fibre to keep it all moving

Protein: maintains body muscle rather than body fat. Excess might cause constipation

That leads back to lchf with moderate protein.still a little confused what causes you a problem with it other than enough fat to maintain weight and likely no fasting but more regular meals
Click to expand...
More or less.
Too much fat will irritate the lining of the stomach, prompt complications (flare ups) and sieze the bowel.
Most fruit and veg is good for loosening things, but some are too fibrous to break down, e.g. pineapple, nuts, sweetcorn etc so have the opposite effect.
Lean meats, chicken and white fish particularly, can prompt diarrhoea. That is why they appear in low residue diets used by hospitals for colonoscopies and bariums.

It is not carbs, fats and proteins that are generally the problem. They are the juggling act for diabetes, if you like.
Colitis, and other IBD's in general, are not dietary controllable conditions in any sense other than some foods seriously aggravate the symptoms and others may ease them, or, at least, don't do any harm. So the problem is more to juggle how easily, or otherwise, the carbs and proteins break down on the way through and get enough of them. The later, because during an attack, all you want to do after a meal is curl up in a ball until you can get rid of it.
I am fortunate. I have been in a state of remission for some years. As long as I follow the rules, I can take some liberties here and there. But cross the line too far and my stomach will remind me.

I can and do, for instance, cope quite easily with a good fried breakfast once a week, though, preferably not at breakfast. Twice is also fine, as long as it is accompanied with something acidic, like grapefruit, or, dare I say, scrumpy. Three times and I can start to run in to problems. I suspect that the acidity helps break down the fat to manageable size.
Perversely. I have no restrictions with beef dripping on toast, at least when taken at sensible levels, two slices. In this case, the bread cushions the effects of the beef fat.

For the other side of the problem, eating enough. Two slices of bacon, a sausage, an egg, a few mushrooms, slice of black pudding and half slice of fried bread is a serious meal of dinner proportions for me. Add a spoon of beans and something gets left 7 out of 10 times.
Never really bothered with counting calories, but after looking it up, my main meal fry up is about a quarter of my daily needs. The only reason I eat that much is because I like my fry up enough to weather my grumbling stomach. There is no way I can manage four of those a day. More typically it might be a chop, a potato and a few beans. But I can nibble.
 
Well the good news is pineapple and sweet corn aren’t great for diabetes either so perhaps write these off entirely. Scrumpy and bread and probably beans too will spike most diabetics. Sounds like spreading the fat and protein is the answer and not loading any one meal too highly. Perhaps take a look at some of the vegetarian low carb threads and websites for ideas minimising the protein or trying different forms of it.

Why would you need 4 large meals a day? I guess you just need to keep tweeking it a bit at a time til you find your best balance remaining symptom free with numbers the best you can reach by limiting the carbs you can
 
Bluetit1802 said:
Your sense of humour will see you through this journey. That, and a meter to keep you on track..

I know little about your condition other than my daughter had it. Note the past tense. She certainly did not go low fat, and I am struggling to understand why the two conditions require different diets. As long as you eat the required amount of fibre, drink plenty of fluids, and stay off the diabetes drug Metformin, you ought to be OK.
Click to expand...

I was 12 when the Colitis appeared, so never concerned myself with fat, carbs and proteins. The problem has always been to eat enough food, while not antagonising my stomach/colitis too much. At that age it boils down to being as simple as 'If you see food, eat it!'.
As I grew older, I learnt certain combinations of food were easier to digest than others, but carbs and proteins were still not important, compared to trying to add a little weight in readiness for the next onslaught.
It was only the addition of diabetes that they have gained any degree of interest
 
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HSSS said:
Well the good news is pineapple and sweet corn aren’t great for diabetes either so perhaps write these off entirely. Scrumpy and bread and probably beans too will spike most diabetics. Sounds like spreading the fat and protein is the answer and not loading any one meal too highly. Perhaps take a look at some of the vegetarian low carb threads and websites for ideas minimising the protein or trying different forms of it.

Why would you need 4 large meals a day? I guess you just need to keep tweeking it a bit at a time til you find your best balance remaining symptom free with numbers the best you can reach by limiting the carbs you can
Click to expand...

Four large meals a day, is the equivalent of what I am told I need to maintain what weight I have, given that I have what is amusingly described as a highly active job (3000 calories). But I can't eat like that. I can graze however.
It used to be easy. Lunch started about 10am and finished about 3. Dinner between 8pm and 10 and supper from 11. Only, in trying to limit the dreaded carbs, I am losing the weight I've been trying to gain for 30 years.
Some where between 'hang it all' and giving up work, there is a combination that will work. Just got to find it
 
Hi @Raygower, For bowel conditions I have heard the advice: If in doubt eat chocolate. Not sure if that applies in your experience. ? Maybe for loose bowels? And drinking chilled soy milk and eating well-cooked beetroot being pain easing remedies.?
Sometimes I guess it is a balance of what works vs what is sensible for controlling BSLs.
And how do you ensure you obtain sufficient vitamin C (mostly in fruit)?
Best Wishes.
 
kitedoc said:
Hi @Raygower, For bowel conditions I have heard the advice: If in doubt eat chocolate. Not sure if that applies in your experience. ? Maybe for loose bowels? And drinking chilled soy milk and eating well-cooked beetroot being pain easing remedies.?
Sometimes I guess it is a balance of what works vs what is sensible for controlling BSLs.
And how do you ensure you obtain sufficient vitamin C (mostly in fruit)?
Best Wishes.
Click to expand...
Not heard either of those tweaks. Occasionally my body says I need chocolate and I comply. That seems to work.
The twist that I've found really useful, given to me by a district nurse during a flush out enema, is to take two spoons of neat TCP. Not only does it kill the pain, but it stops the bleeding for anything up to a fortnight.

Vitamin c is not a problem. We're on high fibre, by definition we've got our noses in the shrubbery.
Iron has been and there is a lot to be said in favour of stout.
 
Raygower said:
Not heard either of those tweaks. Occasionally my body says I need chocolate and I comply. That seems to work.
The twist that I've found really useful, given to me by a district nurse during a flush out enema, is to take two spoons of neat TCP. Not only does it kill the pain, but it stops the bleeding for anything up to a fortnight.

Vitamin c is not a problem. We're on high fibre, by definition we've got our noses in the shrubbery.
Iron has been and there is a lot to be said in favour of stout.
Click to expand...
Thank you @Raygower, so does that mean lots of veggies for Vitamin C?
 
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