Supplements, for those with an open mind.

What's your point? Everything under the sun has detractors. Some things work for some people but not others. All they are saying that THEY aren't sure.

DavidGrahamJones said:

I'm open minded but hopefully not so open that my brains are falling out.

I have taken different supplements at different times, not all have made a jot of difference although some have. Pre and probiotics do seem to have been very effective in getting intestinal flora correct after taking antibiotics and when dealing with the side effects of taking cocodomol as does vitamin C powder.

Whether Magnesium, Chromium and Berberine are any good for BG, maybe, maybe not.

Just in case you might be looking at the effectiveness of any supplements you might like to look at http://www.webmd.com/vitamins-suppl...?diseaseid=1145&diseasename=Diabetes&source=0, it includes reviews for each supplement. Just FYI.

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I use this website often, and find it to be a relatively well balanced source of information. It is, I believe, run by Boots the Chemist.

I have tried Chromiun myself and found it helped, but had only a small benefit on bgl reduction, I believe that you need to be using a diet that is low in natural chromium (i.e. lacking green veg, say) for the effect of supplementation to be noticeable. So I no longer supplement with this since my diet is now supplying my needs.

I use a magnesium supplement on occasions. I have no evidence in my life that either it or Zinc improve my bgl directly, but these two chemicals are needed for good metabolism and affect the Krebs / Citric cycle so are essential. I use a combined zinc+ magnesium supplement to cover my base, but again I believe my diet provides my normal requirements now. I think it may be useful immediately following diagnosis, or if taking a diuretic to replace these water soluble elements thar maybe excreted by excessive sugar levels. It may also be appropriate if taking SGLT-2 type meds such as Canagliflozin, which encourages extra urine excretion.

I have not taken berberine. I have however found that Bitter Melon and Gymnema Sylvestre to have a direct benefit to me, and I am using a alternating combination of these to replace my Gliclazide meds.

Other supplements I use are Brewers yeast to replace Vit B6 et al (but not B12) that I miss when I dropped using fortified cereal and wheat products, Vit B12 because of my long term use of Metformin, Vit C again because of use of diuretics and Metformin, and because I am iron deficient anemic.

i am happy to supplement where i find my diet or my meds may lead to deficiency, but it is easy to spend out on expensive supplements that literally just get flushed straight down the drain. For me changing to a low carb diet has been the best way of reducing my sugar levels.

DavidGrahamJones said:

That's interesting, when I was taking Gliclazide it was very effective as I kept having hypos and eventually I dropped them all together. May I ask where you get BM and GS, I see BM is on Amazon, I was wondering if there's any difference between where it comes from.

I eat about 40 gms carb a day but need to get my BG down some more. Will have to look them up and try them. I'm avoiding gliclazide for the time being, although I can't allow elevated BG to go on much longer, but my concern is that Gliclazide will cause hypos again and then I'll end up consuming carbs just to be able to take Gliclazide (I always reckoned GPs say keep eating carbs so they can prescribe Gliclazide).

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LoL. I find the Swanson brand is fairly consistent, and I use Amazon for sourcing both. I think the BM is slightly more effective than the GS, and the GS i am using currently also has cinnamon and mulberry in it, so is a hybrid mix.

I was not aware until recently that Gliclazide is also available in 40 mg tabs so I am about to ask my GP to split my one tab a day into onex40mg am and one pm so I cover breakfast and my main meal in the evening. I find an 80mg tab can drop my bgl by 6 mmol/l after a LC meal, so I have been splitting the 80 mg in half (it is scored to do that), and I use the half in the morning. I have had low bgl but no hypo's since I started doing this.

My Gp wants me to drop the Glic completely, but then I will lose my excuse for self monitoring support. I also would have to drop my carb intake more severely, and then become totally anal about it. I prefer to be able to take things in a more relaxed manner as befits my age.

Going by what is being said in another thread we are active on, I musr warn you that both BM and GS have alternate treatment status as a mild laxative, so be prepared in case it bites you in the proverbial. I have the occasional sessions, but it is a one off session then life goes on. No worse than Metformin, and no cramps. I think I may have a perfect storm going on here, Metformin 2000 mg, concurrent with dropping diuretic med, adding BM, and iron tabs all meeting in the same place where the sun don't shine.

I find taking no supplements whatsoever works for me.

I have never taken supplements, believing that any deficiency would show itself either with physical symptoms or in my twice yearly blood tests. I did ask for some vitamin and mineral tests when I had my last HbA1c and was given them without question. As long as I feel and look well, I don't feel I need them.

Having said all that, after reading so much on the forums about Alpha Lipoic Acid and its benefits for mild neuropathy I decided to bite the bullet and try some. I am pleased to say they work, or at least have for me. My foot neuropathy is mild and was chemotherapy-induced rather than diabetes induced, so it may be a different. I have most definitely not seen any benefit from them as regards blood sugars.

Bluetit1802 said:

Having said all that, after reading so much on the forums about Alpha Lipoic Acid and its benefits for mild neuropathy I decided to bite the bullet and try some. I am pleased to say they work, or at least have for me. My foot neuropathy is mild and was chemotherapy-induced rather than diabetes induced, so it may be a different. I have most definitely not seen any benefit from them as regards blood sugars.

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Hi @Bluetit1802 - can I please ask how long it took before noticing the neuropathy improvement??

I've only been taking the Alpha Lipoic Acid for a week now - my neuropathy isn't diabetic related either - rather apparently the result of nerve damage from tourniquet useage during my double knee replacement in early April - I'm also taking prescribed Lyrica for it and have added a magnesium/zinc/vit C combo - as suggested by the surgeon

Mine is on the inside of my calves - from knee to ankle - both legs - have been told will see an improvement with time - but at the moment drives me mad at times every day - when the efficacy of the meds are wearing off I think - before I can take the next dose - so hoping the ALA will kick in soon!!

Thanks in advance for your response and sorry to @DavidGrahamJones for hijacking your post : )

I am open minded about supplements. In fact to make certain I wasn't missing out on something I bought some. The plan was to take one for a week or two to see if it made any noticeable difference and then try another. Any perceived improvement would indicate an earlier shortage of something.

Nothing made any difference that I could tell. The Government said that we are all short of Vitamin D and since I had bought some I took two a day. It might have helped. Any improvement was not marked.

SueNSW said:

Hi @Bluetit1802 - can I please ask how long it took before noticing the neuropathy improvement??

I've only been taking the Alpha Lipoic Acid for a week now - my neuropathy isn't diabetic related either - rather apparently the result of nerve damage from tourniquet useage during my double knee replacement in early April - I'm also taking prescribed Lyrica for it and have added a magnesium/zinc/vit C combo - as suggested by the surgeon

Mine is on the inside of my calves - from knee to ankle - both legs - have been told will see an improvement with time - but at the moment drives me mad at times every day - when the efficacy of the meds are wearing off I think - before I can take the next dose - so hoping the ALA will kick in soon!!

Thanks in advance for your response and sorry to @DavidGrahamJones for hijacking your post : )

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Mine was in my feet - intermittent tingling and burning and sometimes feeling my socks were rucked up underneath when walking. I started the ALA on 7th April, 300mg a day. I noticed an improvement fairly quickly, I can't remember just when.

Bluetit1802 said:

Mine was in my feet - intermittent tingling and burning and sometimes feeling my socks were rucked up underneath when walking. I started the ALA on 7th April, 300mg a day. I noticed an improvement fairly quickly, I can't remember just when.

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Thanks for that @Bluetit1802 - I'm taking twice that dose - pretty desperate I guess - a large area of my calves are completely numb to the touch and feel as though they are really badly sunburnt. I also have waves of pins and needles/electric shock type pains at various - not consistent - places on the lower legs.

Something - possibly the Lyrica is taking the edge off those pains, but certainly not completely, so - like I said, desperate I guess for the ALA to work some magic.

Ironic of course that the knees are going very well - but now have this to deal with

NoCrbs4Me said:

I find taking no supplements whatsoever works for me.

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Well then it is pretty obvious you don't need to.

Among the supplements I do take is calcium + D3 prescribed by my doctor because I do need them. Each to their own I say.

JohnEGreen said:

Well then it is pretty obvious you don't need to.

Among the supplements I do take is calcium + D3 prescribed by my doctor because I do need them. Each to their own I say.

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Is your doctor concerned with your bone density? The supplements you're taking probably aren't helping:

http://www.consumerreports.org/vitamins-supplements/the-truth-about-calcium-and-vitamin-d/

DavidGrahamJones said:

That's interesting, when I was taking Gliclazide it was very effective as I kept having hypos and eventually I dropped them all together. May I ask where you get BM and GS, I see BM is on Amazon, I was wondering if there's any difference between where it comes from.

I eat about 40 gms carb a day but need to get my BG down some more. Will have to look them up and try them. I'm avoiding gliclazide for the time being, although I can't allow elevated BG to go on much longer, but my concern is that Gliclazide will cause hypos again and then I'll end up consuming carbs just to be able to take Gliclazide (I always reckoned GPs say keep eating carbs so they can prescribe Gliclazide).

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Are you able to increase your exercise? Are you like me semi immobile so even walking is painful?

NoCrbs4Me said:

Is your doctor concerned with your bone density? The supplements you're taking probably aren't helping:

http://www.consumerreports.org/vitamins-supplements/the-truth-about-calcium-and-vitamin-d/

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If it's prescribed I expect he takes Adcal which is usually taken alongside a weekly dose of alendronic acid to help absorption.

I started taking Vitamin B12 and Alpha Lipoic Acid (ALA) after getting pins and needles sensations in my hand. Neuropathy is a symptom of prolonged high blood sugar, so I was a little surprised at getting symptoms once my blood sugars had normalised. I was also getting symptoms of "brain fog" and finding it difficult to remember things. Alpha Lipoic Acid is also good for brain fog as well as neuropathy.

Metformin can cause vitamin B12 deficiency which can result in neuropathy symptoms and memory loss. I think it is unwise to take high doses of Metformin if you have effectively controlled high blood sugar through a low carb diet. For that reason I reduced my Metformin from 2x500 to 1x500 in February and stopped taking it altogether in May once my HbA1C reduced to 44. Anyone taking Metformin should consider taking B12 supplements and maybe ALA as well.

Some supplements do not work well on their own or the effectiveness is somewhat reduced. Some of them work better when taken with other supplements. e.g. Taking D3 and K2 tend to increase their effectiviness. Same with Alpha Lipoic Acid and Acetyl-L-Carnitine. Having supplement free days may be help as well in some cases.