T2 and Cholesterol

[G0ldengirl68]

I had my doctor appointment yesterday, and again my doctor (MD) encouraged me to take statins. My cholesterol total (hdl and ldl) was 294. The ratio was 3.7 which here in US the good ratio is 0.0 - 3.2 ratio. I have read quite a bit on cholesterol and lowering the ldl which is called "bad cholesterol" here. Nothing anyone here doesn't already know I'm sure, just a little background, thinking outloud.

I wanted to start this thread because I want to see feedback on anyone that has brought down their Ldl without meds. I am convinced that statins are bad news for me, and that I can do this without them. My ldl is at 222, and my hdl is 60 (within good range of >39). I was so surprised to see this Q and A on my hospital/Sutter Health Clinic (see attached) this morning. I had no idea they would answer something on "natural methods" or supplements.

Has anyone brought their cholesterol into the good range by doing Red Rice Yeast (no statins)? Or, any other natural supplement or food I might try? Much appreciate any help as my doc wants me to do another Lipid Profile in 1 month, which
I'd rather it was 2 months and may try to get that changed I just know I can do this.
PS I had to add this and feedback welcome. What do you think?

 

[NicoleC1971]

I haven't lowered my cholesterol ldl because having read around the subject along with a few of us on here,we're not convinced it is necessary! Ask you doctor about your triglycerides/hdl ratio which should be on your report. The former should be the same or lower than your hdl and many reckon this to be a better indicator of risk. The difference between improving these numbers and lowering your ldl is that there is a pill to take for the latter but the former can be done through diet. The issue with statins is that they don't seem to prevent heart attacks and some people find they have side effects. I know that they do reduce ldl effectively but that doesn't seem to translate into lives saved for those who don't have known heart disease.
I am not sure how you are bringing down your hba1c but the high trig/low hdl ratios result from diets high in processed carbs therefore changing your diet will give you better heart health (blood pressure, weight ) as well as lowering your hba1c i.e. a natural solution. Some people do find that eating more protein and fat to replace their carbs causes a rise in LDL but it doesn't mean that this ldl is harmful especially if your blood sugars, triglycerides are going down and your hdl is already at a good level. To be certain you can ask for a LDL particle analysis (you can't in the UK) to determine if your ldl is of the small dense variety versus the healthier big fluffy kind. If you think of your arteries as a river imagine dropping a golf ball in which sticks to the riverbed (vldl) versus dropping a beach ball in that simply floats around (ldl). Have a look a Ivor Cummins and Malcolm McKendrick who present the topic well.

 

[G0ldengirl68]

I haven't lowered my cholesterol ldl because having read around the subject along with a few of us on here,we're not convinced it is necessary! Ask you doctor about your triglycerides/hdl ratio which should be on your report. The former should be the same or lower than your hdl and many reckon this to be a better indicator of risk. The difference between improving these numbers and lowering your ldl is that there is a pill to take for the latter but the former can be done through diet. The issue with statins is that they don't seem to prevent heart attacks and some people find they have side effects. I know that they do reduce ldl effectively but that doesn't seem to translate into lives saved for those who don't have known heart disease.
I am not sure how you are bringing down your hba1c but the high trig/low hdl ratios result from diets high in processed carbs therefore changing your diet will give you better heart health (blood pressure, weight ) as well as lowering your hba1c i.e. a natural solution. Some people do find that eating more protein and fat to replace their carbs causes a rise in LDL but it doesn't mean that this ldl is harmful especially if your blood sugars, triglycerides are going down and your hdl is already at a good level. To be certain you can ask for a LDL particle analysis (you can't in the UK) to determine if your ldl is of the small dense variety versus the healthier big fluffy kind. If you think of your arteries as a river imagine dropping a golf ball in which sticks to the riverbed (vldl) versus dropping a beach ball in that simply floats around (ldl). Have a look a Ivor Cummins and Malcolm McKendrick who present the topic well.

I appreciate your feedback. I am looking at the upside of statins this a.m. I've heard a lot of down-sides and thought it was only fair to consider studies, which I found one on pubmed. There's always both opinions, I find, when searching online. Personal experience is what I hope to find here, but in the long run, I'll have to decide which way to go. I do have a 3rd degree AV Node block, since 97, and on my 3rd pacemaker so I think that's the big concern for my MD. I'm due to see my Cardio very soon as well and can ask him too.

Natural ways are my preference, but it may be safest for me, to take a statin short-term, while doing my nutrition and exercise. It's a hard decision. I don't do any other meds, nothing for heart at all, pacemaker works wonderfully. Would you tell me what your Ldl is? As I said, mine is 222 which is high according to the Conventional doctors. Thank you for the videos and I will watch them

 

[G0ldengirl68]

Here is a study I found on Lipotoxicity. I looked for it because the first video @NicoleC1971 mentions at the beginning, that there isn't any evidence LDL causes damage to Endophelial which is a new term to me. But this article/study seems to disagree with the video. That's the issue for me is the opposite info on anything and everything these days I don't doubt that you could be right in your belief, or anyone else's, but I can't doubt what the studies show either, it's a real conundrum
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6181280/

 

[Roggg]

Dyslipidemia (ie "bad" blood lipid results) is part and parcel of T2 diabetes, along with high blood pressure. If you want to investigate this, look for the term "metabolic syndrome", and in particular, I would recommend any lecture by Robert Lustig on the topic.

I am on a statin and have been for several years. My lipids have been stable and "ok" on the statin, but improved markedly when I switched to keto eating. I fully expect to drop the statin in the not too distant future. I've been procrastinating for months on my lab visit due to covid restrictions.

 

[G0ldengirl68]

Dyslipidemia (ie "bad" blood lipid results) is part and parcel of T2 diabetes, along with high blood pressure. If you want to investigate this, look for the term "metabolic syndrome", and in particular, I would recommend any lecture by Robert Lustig on the topic.

I am on a statin and have been for several years. My lipids have been stable and "ok" on the statin, but improved markedly when I switched to keto eating. I fully expect to drop the statin in the not too distant future. I've been procrastinating for months on my lab visit due to covid restrictions.

I love Keto, and my health is improving in so many ways, I don't want to bore anyone listing all of them. Those on Keto most likely have the same reports.

That would be my intention as well @Roggg, take the statin as a sort of back up, but short-term while I get more keto-time under my belt so to speak.

Thank you for the references and I will check them out for sure. I'm kind of like a sponge when looking up info on my latest interest, especially health issues My blood pressure has been excellent and I was concerned for a time that I might end up on pills for that, but I'm monitoring that and has been running around 113/63 and 112/66. I understand it's important to sit and relax for about 5 to 10 minutes before taking mine. When I get active it goes up a bit so we'll see how that goes. Not really studying that at the moment.

Hope thing lift for your area, open up more soon so you can get in to do labs. I never like blood draws, now I can't wait seeing the improvements, or sadly, maybe lack thereof but I'm doubting I'll see much of those

 

[Bluetit1802]

It is the triglycerides that are the baddies, not the LDL. If your trigs are low your LDL is likely to have plenty of the good fluffy particles rather than the bad hard ones. Have a read up on this. I am having a problem with your results because here in the UK we have totally different measurement units!

 

[Mike d]

https://www.heartuk.org.uk/download...lesterol---triglyceride-levels-conversion.pdf

Here you go @Bluetit1802 ...

 

[Bluetit1802]

https://www.heartuk.org.uk/download...lesterol---triglyceride-levels-conversion.pdf

Here you go @Bluetit1802 ...

Thanks Mike.

 

[carty]

I was offered statins when I was diagnosed with diabetes and my cholesterol was over 7 I refused the statins (politely !) I reduced my carbs and upped my fat intake and my cholesterol came down to 5.2 which as a oap lady I am ok with that
Carol

 

[Geordie_P]

I had historically bad triglycerides (32+) and brought them back into normal range by cutting out carbs and alcohol. Didn't take long.

 

[NicoleC1971]

I appreciate your feedback. I am looking at the upside of statins this a.m. I've heard a lot of down-sides and thought it was only fair to consider studies, which I found one on pubmed. There's always both opinions, I find, when searching online. Personal experience is what I hope to find here, but in the long run, I'll have to decide which way to go. I do have a 3rd degree AV Node block, since 97, and on my 3rd pacemaker so I think that's the big concern for my MD. I'm due to see my Cardio very soon as well and can ask him too.

Natural ways are my preference, but it may be safest for me, to take a statin short-term, while doing my nutrition and exercise. It's a hard decision. I don't do any other meds, nothing for heart at all, pacemaker works wonderfully. Would you tell me what your Ldl is? As I said, mine is 222 which is high according to the Conventional doctors. Thank you for the videos and I will watch them

I agree that it is all contradictory with a lot of evidence coming from interested parties such as the drug companies or those wishing to sell books though I trust the latter more than the former. I think the ultimate test has to be what they give to incoming presidents and astronauts - a calcium scan - to see what, if any, damage has been done to your arteries. Alternatively you can take a statin and see how you respond. If you do that I am sure your ldl will come down and this may reassure you or your doctor. If you take this route consider a supplement to replace what the statin takes away. Its called Ubiquinol or in its cheaper form co-enzyme q10 . Sorry that I've given you more rabbit holes to do down !

 

[G0ldengirl68]

I was offered statins when I was diagnosed with diabetes and my cholesterol was over 7 I refused the statins (politely !) I reduced my carbs and upped my fat intake and my cholesterol came down to 5.2 which as a oap lady I am ok with that
Carol

Wonderful how that worked for you, congrats!

What were your cholesterol numbers (I'd like to know triglycerides and ldl specifically) and how long before your cholesterol came down @carty? I changed my diet on the day I was diagnosed, and hit Keto big-time after next lab in March when my BG went up to 7.4 from original diagnosis at 7.0.

 

[G0ldengirl68]

I agree that it is all contradictory with a lot of evidence coming from interested parties such as the drug companies or those wishing to sell books though I trust the latter more than the former. I think the ultimate test has to be what they give to incoming presidents and astronauts - a calcium scan - to see what, if any, damage has been done to your arteries. Alternatively you can take a statin and see how you respond. If you do that I am sure your ldl will come down and this may reassure you or your doctor. If you take this route consider a supplement to replace what the statin takes away. Its called Ubiquinol or in its cheaper form co-enzyme q10 . Sorry that I've given you more rabbit holes to do down !

No apology necessary

 

[carty]

Wonderful how that worked for you, congrats!

What were your cholesterol numbers (I'd like to know triglycerides and ldl specifically) and how long before your cholesterol came down @carty? I changed my diet on the day I was diagnosed, and hit Keto big-time after next lab in March when my BG went up to 7.4 from original diagnosis at 7.0.

Sorry I don't know what the breakdown of my cholesterol was it was over 12 years ago !! My cholesterol results came down on my test after 6 months All my results breakdown have been within the limits at each test .Hope that helps Carol

 

[G0ldengirl68]

It's good to know it all worked out for you Carol. Thank you for your info