I've been Type 2 since July 2018. I've been on insulin from the day I was diagnosed apart from a brief period between the end of March-June of this year.A comment was made on another thread that many type 2 progress to insulin within 10 years due to beta cell damage. (In order not to derail that conversation I though it would be interesting to continue this here.)
Is that an assumption based on continued consumption of high carb levels and a medication only approach, and is it often more than 10 yrs?
To my view it is an “assumption” is that beta cells have worn out due to type 2. It’s likely many of these are caused by the wringing out every possible drop of insulin of the already massively overproducing pancreas by medications such gliclazide. It’s also highly likely that many still overproduce, not under, but have become hugely insulin resistant which mimics underproduction.
Few type 2 are actually tested for insulin or c peptide production at diagnosis nor before being moved onto insulin. Even fewer have beta cell checks made (can that even be done?).
So how do we know why so many progress to insulin - if in fact they even do so - and at what point in time after disease onset/diagnosis.
Are you restricting your carb intake?I've been Type 2 since July 2018. I've been on insulin from the day I was diagnosed apart from a brief period between the end of March-June of this year.
Do you know and understand why this is the option and not some other alternative? Were choices offered and explained? Were tests done to ensure this is the most appropriate option medically? Were your informed preferences taken into account?I've been Type 2 since July 2018. I've been on insulin from the day I was diagnosed apart from a brief period between the end of March-June of this year.
That’s a bit like saying it’s the length of a piece of string. Means vastly different things to different peopleYeah I am. Still have some carbs but try to keep them to a minimum
do you know how many you have in a meal or over a day?Yeah I am. Still have some carbs but try to keep them to a minimum
You'll probably have to visit a lab or private hospital to get the blood taken as the old postal system used by medicheck and others didn't seem to get the blood to the lab fast enough for the tests to be accurate (or at least I presume that is why they stopped offering the service).How would one go about testing insulin levels in the UK if seeking to do this privately? I don't see many options coming up when searching for an insulin test. It does seem something that would be worthwhile having a data point taken on every few years to understand if a permanent change is happening that normal tests won't detect.
My understanding of this thread is that the OP was asking "what evidence supports the NHS mantra that Type 2 Diabetes has a progression to insulin therapy regardless of medication or lifestyle and if the evidence supports a 10 year timescale for this process." So insulin therapy is an endpoint or outcome
As far as I can see there are no statistics kept on how many T2D had not progressed onto inulin at the time of death - usually, such deaths are recorded as comorbidity events not death by sugar.
In my empirical life, I have never known any T2D that had progressed to insulin therapy. None of my friends or work colleagues has been so unfortunate. I know several T1D who use insulin, and my own family history has T1D but I am the first T2D. So my 'knowledge' as you put it does not support the hypothesis, but then I could be wrong. I too feel it in my bones, but I do not smell it in the air. My only contact with T2D who use insulin is on the pages of this forum. And that is the God's honest truth. Nada. Nihil, nix.I agree to an extent but the question asked was how do we know and there are many paths to Knowing other than statistics and studies there is also the empirical path of experience and anecdotal evidence either supporting the hypothesis or not.
Me I know the orthodox view of this is wrong "cause I feel it in me bones."
[QUOTE="Oldvatr, My only contact with T2D who use insulin is on the pages of this forum
My post was more about why type 2 is seen as progressive and insulin use is likely, and if 10 yrs is an accurate assumption of when it becomes likely.
Noting of course that there are at least two major variants of T2 - insulin over production with ever increasing IR, and insulin under production (generally slim T2) which seems to be where I am at the moment.
If you can cure (or radically improve) the IR for the insulin over producers then the condition should be reversible before the pancreas is thrashed to death.
I would also offer that reducing the demand for insulin will also help to prevent thrashing. The main cause ofJust wandering back to say that in my case it does seem to be progressive, but 10 years to insulin isn't the time scale.
Given that I am 70, I expect a lot of things in my body to work at reduced efficiency so it doesn't surprise me that my pancreas is one organ that is getting a bit worn.
Noting of course that there are at least two major variants of T2 - insulin over production with ever increasing IR, and insulin under production (generally slim T2) which seems to be where I am at the moment.
If you can cure (or radically improve) the IR for the insulin over producers then the condition should be reversible before the pancreas is thrashed to death.
Do you have any references/links for slim under-producers of insulin? NOT wanting to lose weight and yet having problems with carbs/bg feels to me like a very lonely position.Noting of course that there are at least two major variants of T2 - insulin over production with ever increasing IR, and insulin under production (generally slim T2) which seems to be where I am at the moment.
Is there much out there that supports underproduction of insulin in type 2 (before the pancreas is thrashed)Just wandering back to say that in my case it does seem to be progressive, but 10 years to insulin isn't the time scale.
Given that I am 70, I expect a lot of things in my body to work at reduced efficiency so it doesn't surprise me that my pancreas is one organ that is getting a bit worn.
Noting of course that there are at least two major variants of T2 - insulin over production with ever increasing IR, and insulin under production (generally slim T2) which seems to be where I am at the moment.
If you can cure (or radically improve) the IR for the insulin over producers then the condition should be reversible before the pancreas is thrashed to death.
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