vegan

Hi izzi, why are you wanting a soul mate or help?

Sorry izzi, just my cynical humour.
If you want to read up on veganism I can recommend 'Crazy sexy diet'. Its by a lady who has cancer but went vegan after researching loads od stuff to 'cure' her. Shes still around and looking healthy, but her cancer is in remission and its not a cancer that can be cured by traditional methods. She uses a lot of green juices. The juices are nice and taste cleansing.
I find tho that cos we live in a cold country I can't be doing wth cold stuff no matter how good.

Hi Izzi , I tried a vegan diet for about 6 months, it was in the early days of being diagnosed. I found it easy during the warmer months, but found it very difficult once the weather got colder and i wanted something like a nice hearty stew to eat.
i low carb, and try to maintain around 20g of carb per day, The problem i found was that most of the winter vegetables were too high in carbs for me, so went back to including dairy and the went the whole hog , back fully to meat .
Give it a try, In addition to the above, you may find it difficult to achieve a high fat intake. Largely depends on the carb/fat/protein balance you are looking for

As an addendum the theory is that cancer feeds on sugar so Kris Carr the lady I mentioned above has cut all carbs and sugar out of her diet. She does live in California I think, if I lived there I'm sure I could eat salads all day too.

I posted this on a Christian forum - but not really popping religious beliefs into the thread:

An "Eden" diet: And God said, Behold, I have given you every herb bearing seed, which [is] upon the face of all the earth, and every tree, in the which [is] the fruit of a tree yielding seed; to you it shall be for meat.

That is a strict vegan diet, seeds, fruit & nuts; could we be healthy & active - & long-lived - on such a diet today?
Typically seeds & nuts provide 2000 kcals per 400 g
protein: 80 g - 320 kcals
carbohydrate: 40 g - 160 kcals
fat: 200 g - 1400 kcals
fibre - 80 g - no digestible calories, but contribute to the total measurement - 2,000 kcals.
Most fruit contain 10% carbohydrate - as sugar - & would give a needed energy boost.

I consider such a diet would provide all we need.

OTOH the modern diet, comprising refined carbs, including sugars, but restricted fats means getting most of our energy from refined carbs, which is NOT what God provided. The post-diluvian addition of meat would provide additional protein & fat but NOT carb.

I've got very interested in diet as a diabetic. I followed the recommended "starchy carb/low fat/low sugar/ low salt" diet for 7-8 years until serious complications set in - extreme tiredness, leg muscle pain, & the beginning of retina damage. I then changed to a "low carb/higher fat" diet & this reversed ALL the complications. Four years on I am healthy, active & free from complications.

About 1/3 of my diet is nuts & seeds, in the form of ground almonds, coconut flour & milled flax. I also eat eggs, dairy, meat & fish, plenty of vegetables (NOT potatoes), limited fruit, plenty of tea & water, a multivitamin/mineral supplement.

Not an Eden diet, not a "caveman" diet, but more of a "hunter-gatherer" post-diluvian diet. My blood glucose is well-controlled.

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I am vegan for ethical reasons but it also has fantastic health benefits too.

I have a wholefood, high fibre, low fat and limited protein diet and it works brilliantly. I have been vegan for 5 years but only recently been watching my fat intake having read the China Study. It is the most healthy way to live. I am more insulin sensitive than i have ever been and i am much better controlled. What's more is that my Cholesterol is "as low as it can be" according to my doctor and it isn't hard to point to my diet and exercise as the reason.

I don't understand why you are linking it to religion. I am an athiest and i have never met another vegan who was religious so it seems odd to me.

Also, i do not understand how anyone can contend that eating a lot of veggies and fruit and wholefoods can ever be bad for you, afterall it isn't red peppers, brocolli and carrots that cause the majority of cardio vascular deseases is it!

Being a healthy vegan [edit] could be difficult .
It requires a LOT of knowledge. And I suspect a considerable use of supplements. For example, it's difficult to get enough vitamin B on a vegan diet. It's not easy for less strict vegetarians either.
I do know quite a few veggies and a couple of vegans, none of them diabetic as it happens and most of those people are not amongst the healthiest that I know. In addition, they seem to use lots of processed foods and stuff that mimics the things they don't eat, such as meat and dairy products.
I fully agree with people's right to eat in the way they consider morally and ethically right. I sympathise with those who are against taking life to get their own food and who worry about the welfare of farm animals. Nevertheless, I eat meat.
I try not to waste any of the meat I buy for my family as I remain aware that a living thing was sacrificed for my food. Still I can't imagine [edit] things being easy on an animal product free diet.
Hana

hanadr said:

Being a healthy vegan is difficult.
It requires a LOT of knowledge. And I suspect a considerable use of supplements. For example, it's difficult to get enough vitamin B on a vegan diet. It's not easy for less strict vegetarians either.
I do know quite a few veggies and a couple of vegans, none of them diabetic as it happens and most of those people are not amongst the healthiest that I know. In addition, they seem to use lots of processed foods and stuff that mimics the things they don't eat, such as meat and dairy products.
I fully agree with people's right to eat in the way they consider morally and ethically right. I sympathise with those who are against taking life to get their own food and who worry about the welfare of farm animals. Nevertheless, I eat meat.
I try not to waste any of the meat I buy for my family as I remain aware that a living thing was sacrificed for my food. Still I can't imagine trying to be a healthy T2 on an animal product free diet.
Hana

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Er no it isn't and you shoudln't scare monger with no (obvious) experience yourself.

B12 is the only vitamin that you would need to supplement as it used to be available through dirt on veggies etc but is now not. It is present in meat as ruminents eat a lot of soil etc.

What do you mean they are not the healthiest people you know? Also are you able to judge people on a small sample selection isn't that what people do with race, gender, sexuality etc. Yes i knwo you will think that example crude but you cannot tar everyone with the same brush.

The simple fact is that you can be a healthy vegan and you can be a unhealthy vegan but to infer that being a non-vegan somehow provides some sort of better health is completely false. All the evidence points to quite the opposite.

I take my health very serioulsy indeed and yes i have read widely on nutrition partly as a result of being vegan but then shouldn't we all take nutrition seriously? I find it incredibly condescending that you think because i am a vegan i am somehow intrinsically less healthy than you. I am sure i am in much better shape than 99% of the population but then i guess that doesn't fit your world view.

Please do eat whatever you want but don't defend your practices by attacking the choices of others. Just saying you "fully agree" with something doesn't mean you aren't being offensive and ignorant. It is a bit like saying "With all due respect" or "i don;t mean to be rude", it doesn't absolve you.

Anyway, back to the OP point. I believe, backed up by extensive research (unlike most carnies who seem to lecture me on mere hearsay) that a vegan diet it the healthiest you can have. It also happens to be the best for the planet, animals and of course humans too.

izzzi said:

Hi dawnmc,

Oddly enough I am not a vegan, its just that this vegan diet was recommended.
I am now thinking if there are not many vegans on this forum, is that a good sign for health reasons.

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Roy you should be proud of a decision to follow a vegan diet and know that it is absolutely a more ethical way to live. There are plenty who say it isn't but without wanting to get into a massive debate or have to stick up for my own choice (why should i, i have made a choice whereas others haven't) there is no GOOD reason not to be.

izzzi said:

Hi,Klang180

Sorry for my negative comment regarding religion. It is just that the store where I buy some health products is run by a very pleasant church group.

Point of interest, my son bakes a brownie suitable vegans which is top notch.

I am going through a early stage in learning about vegan's hence my bad defended attitude saying I am not a vegan (if you understand what I mean).

luckily my son like you is a vegan so when he cooks I get spoiled.

good luck

Roy

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Hey Roy

Thanks for your response and sorry if i got a bit defensive. As your son will no doubt testify people can be very negative and even aggresive when it comes to veganism and after a while defending ones choices all gets a bit tiresome.

Anyway, point is, i am vegan and i believe it has only helped me in my management of diabetes. I would never go back even if meat was cruelty free.

Always good to hear about a fellow vegan cooking up a storm like your son!

Kang 180
you are doing just what you accuse me of
I do mot imply that my way is best, but you do just that. I stated simply what I do know. The vegans I know are members of my family and I've known them a long time. I do know that those particular vegans are not really healthy people. In no place do I suggest that there are no healthy vegans. I'm sure there are.
For people who haven't tried it, I'm sure they need to know that it isn't easy to get all you need on a vegan diet. I know that my family members buy quite a lot of simulated meat products to try to imitate a standard British diet. They also need a lot of imported foods.
I'm not even sure that if everyone was vegan, it would benefit the planet. there would naurally be far fewer farm animals and hence a lot less manure to return fertility to the soil.
It's a very complex issue and I don't/didn't pretend to know the answers. Ialso made it clear that I don't know a lot of vegans.
You could try reading what I wrote without adding to it in your own head. I'm pretty good at expressing myself clearly in several languages.
Hana