Desmond course - worth using a day's annual leave?

[TooManyCrisps]

I was diagnosed a few weeks ago with an HBA1C of 97. GP suggested I try yo reduce my levels with diet and exercise. So far I have lost about 10 kgs and have been eating lchf. I'm also exercising loads.

I've just had a referral through for a DESMOND course. In this area they are one day courses, weekdays only. I work full time and only get 22 days leave per year. Is it worth using a day's leave for this course? I feel I've learned loads on this forum and am not sure I'll learn any more from the course. On the other hand, I wouldn't want to miss it if it's useful. Can anyond advise?

 

[Snapsy]

Just spotted your post, @TooManyCrisps , and although this is in the T2 forum I hope you don't mind that I am replying (I'm type 1).

I would probably go for it - all information is useful, even if you were to choose to take some aspects of it with a pinch of salt (I note you're doing LCHF, which might not for instance be one of the DESMOND recommendations).
(I'm bending towards lower carb myself, and reaping benefits.)

One day out of 22 is indeed quite a 'spend' as far as annual leave is concerned, but it's also just one day out of 365 x the rest of your years with diabetes, so it might well be worth it.

I did the T1 equivalent of the course (a regional variation of DAFNE, which was 5 days) and have never looked back.

 

[Type1Bri]

I'm type one as well and only get 20 days annual leave, the Dafne course took 5 days. It's all about prority really, to me it was 5 days well spent

 

[ladybird64]

Hmm. Good question, I can only give my answer from a personal perspective so..
If you had no information available to you, felt lost and in need of "real life" support, I probably would advise going. But if you are testing regularly, your numbers are coming down, you already mention you are more active and have lost weight, I wonder how much benefit it would be to you. Maybe it would be an idea to contact those providing the course and ask them to send you an agenda, a breakdown of how the day will be spent? I'm sure they could give details of topics that would be discussed, and you can make your decision based on that?

 

[Diadav189]

Done the first part this week (split over two days here) and found it informative and helpful. A lot of reassurance too, I'm fortunate as my gaffer views it as essential health care and I do not lose any time. I'd gone with my mind set on low carb approach and expected to be preached but not the case at all. The advice is still balanced diet but low carb not dismissed and encouraging views on a current in Newcastle. It's your health and my advice would be decided with that uppermost in your mind .

 

[TooManyCrisps]

Just spotted your post, @TooManyCrisps , and although this is in the T2 forum I hope you don't mind that I am replying (I'm type 1).

I would probably go for it - all information is useful, even if you were to choose to take some aspects of it with a pinch of salt (I note you're doing LCHF, which might not for instance be one of the DESMOND recommendations).
(I'm bending towards lower carb myself, and reaping benefits.)

One day out of 22 is indeed quite a 'spend' as far as annual leave is concerned, but it's also just one day out of 365 x the rest of your years with diabetes, so it might well be worth it.

I did the T1 equivalent of the course (a regional variation of DAFNE, which was 5 days) and have never looked back.

 

[TooManyCrisps]

Thank you everyone for taking the trouble to reply. I have heard very good things about Dafne courses for T1s, but less good things about Desmond - I read on one thread that participants were given biscuits at break times.

I am testing regularly and my reading are getting lower, although there is still a way to go. My next HBA1C will be an indication of how well I'm doing at gaining control.

My health is an absolute priority, and this forum has been so helpful for me. I think I will attend the course, as i might benefit from it, or learn something I didn't know.

 

[ladybird64]

Thank you everyone for taking the trouble to reply. I have heard very good things about Dafne courses for T1s, but less good things about Desmond - I read on one thread that participants were given biscuits at break times.

I am testing regularly and my reading are getting lower, although there is still a way to go. My next HBA1C will be an indication of how well I'm doing at gaining control.

My health is an absolute priority, and this forum has been so helpful for me. I think I will attend the course, as i might benefit from it, or learn something I didn't know.

Will you let us know how you got on? I'm sure it will be helpful for others to hear your experience

 

[AndBreathe]

I was diagnosed a few weeks ago with an HBA1C of 97. GP suggested I try yo reduce my levels with diet and exercise. So far I have lost about 10 kgs and have been eating lchf. I'm also exercising loads.

I've just had a referral through for a DESMOND course. In this area they are one day courses, weekdays only. I work full time and only get 22 days leave per year. Is it worth using a day's leave for this course? I feel I've learned loads on this forum and am not sure I'll learn any more from the course. On the other hand, I wouldn't want to miss it if it's useful. Can anyond advise?

Is there any way you can cut a deal with your employer to make up the time over a couple of months, say? Making up 8 hours, over eight weeks would be do-able, depending upon the sort of business you work in?

 

[TooManyCrisps]

Is there any way you can cut a deal with your employer to make up the time over a couple of months, say? Making up 8 hours, over eight weeks would be do-able, depending upon the sort of business you work in?

Hi, I'm sure my employer would be fine with that, they are very flexible with hours, its just that i am on a very tight schedule already. I go to work very early so that I can pick my son up from school two days per week.

I'm happy to take annual leave if the course is worth doing, I just worry that I'll be sitting in a room whilst someone tells me to eat porridge, wholemeal bread and brown rice!

 

[TooManyCrisps]

Will you let us know how you got on? I'm sure it will be helpful for others to hear your experience

I will do, @ladybird64.

 

[AndBreathe]

Hi, I'm sure my employer would be fine with that, they are very flexible with hours, its just that i am on a very tight schedule already. I go to work very early so that I can pick my son up from school two days per week.

I'm happy to take annual leave if the course is worth doing, I just worry that I'll be sitting in a room whilst someone tells me to eat porridge, wholemeal bread and brown rice!

I have never attended such a course, but from feedback we've seen on the forum, I doubt I could robustly refute your fears. Some courses are recognising carbs in a way more aligned to "modern thinking" though.

Many people have however commented that they found meeting other people, in a similar boat to themselves to be a useful experience though.

Like all these things, the call will ultimately be your own.

(Vis-a-vis your schedule; do you have a lunch break you could trim to make up the time?)

 

[Dougie22]

I was on the Desmond course a couple of years ago and, although it does seem to vary slightly (and might have been updated since then), I found that the advice on diet followed the traditional NHS " health plate" route which pretty much conflicts with the "low carb" style promoted by the majority of active members in this forum. Perhaps of necessity, it is aimed at the lowest common denominator (how much sugar is in full fat Coke?). So I would say that, while it does contain a lot of useful information if you are new to diabetes and healthy eating, it is likely to contradict some of the advice here. As an update, I've just completed an eight week "waist winners" weight reduction programme run by NHS dieticians and they are still promoting the "healthy eating plate" and "carbs are good for you and necessary" messages ( in this part of the country anyway), even in the full knowledge that most of our group was type 2.

 

[AtkinsMo]

I will probably go against the flow here and recommend you don't bother. I have a friend who recently attended one and said it was a complete waste of time, counter-productive and confusing. This person had already fully embraced a low carb diet, was having great success and great results and found the whole process extremely disconcerting and confidence damaging.

 

[Naomi425]

I complained to Barts health trust . It's ridiculous that they only do the course during working hours. Diabetes is a long term condition but losing your job would make it worse. I'm the CE of a small charity and cannot take half a day off every week for 8 weeks. It would be untenable. So I learn via the Internet, this forum etc . Really I love the NHS but sometimes they need to think about people's needs

 

[AndBreathe]

I complained to Barts health trust . It's ridiculous that they only do the course during working hours. Diabetes is a long term condition but losing your job would make it worse. I'm the CE of a small charity and cannot take half a day off every week for 8 weeks. It would be untenable. So I learn via the Internet, this forum etc . Really I love the NHS but sometimes they need to think about people's needs

I'm not advocating or supporting the NHS either way, but running a course, outside usual hours could cost more, as the staff would potentially be on premium pay rates, if their normal duties are working in clinics 09:00-17:00.

Many people find they are able to make time up, when they need to take time out of their working day, by extending their other working days by 30 minutes or an hour for a short while, or by taking 30 minutes, instead of an hour for lunch. Obviously, those are just examples.

If you are Chief Exec of an organisation, perhaps you can be it's leading light to flexible working, or merely an empathetic approach to employees health support requirements.

It is rare that a business loses out by being flexible, and more often than not, I have found where I have exercised flexibility, with decent, loyal staff, they up the ante in their approach to their work as they are often very grateful, not to have to take annual leave. It also helps when from time to time the business require employees to "go the extra mile", whether it be at year end, sickness cover or whatever.

Anything to consider there?

 

[Naomi425]

Thursday afternoons are a major meeting time across the voluntary and public sector . We have flexible working here and if I could do the course I would but it is just not practical . Yes it might cost a bit more but I have a feeling that they would get better uptake and therefore more people understanding the long term implications of the condition and taking action to improve their diabetes. Probably one or two fewer people with eye problems or foot problems that are inordinately expensive to treat would cover the costs in less than a year. Still awaiting a response to my complaint .

 

[SunnyExpat]

Hi, I'm sure my employer would be fine with that, they are very flexible with hours, its just that i am on a very tight schedule already. I go to work very early so that I can pick my son up from school two days per week.

I'm happy to take annual leave if the course is worth doing, I just worry that I'll be sitting in a room whilst someone tells me to eat porridge, wholemeal bread and brown rice!

It'll be the first thing they tell you to eat.

 

[AtkinsMo]

I don't think increased flexibility would actually cost more. Especially these days, with a largely female workforce, many members of staff are desperate to accrue TOIL for emergencies (sick children and the like), I know my daughter-in-law is, she's a Radiographer. She is always looking for opportunities for planned work out of hours so that she has some 'time in the bank'. It's just a matter of thinking differently. It should be within the capability of every Health Authority to provide, say, 1 course a year 'out of hours'. But until they start and teach a 'good protocol', I would regard that as based upon the work of Richard Bernstein, or rolling out the work of David Unwin, now he has won his NHS award and been acknowledged for the work he has done in the field, personally I wouldn't bother!

 

[TooManyCrisps]

My employer is really flexible (public sector). It's just that I am already using up a lot of flexibility to fit in with family commitments, running sporty son around to various activities etc. So I feel it's not possible for me to do the course without taking a day's leave.

Anyway, I've just booked my course, which is going to be in May, and I'll feed back as to whether it's any good.