I think i might have hypoglycemia

[azure]

@ghost_whistler Perhaps you could request an oral glucose tolerance test? That might give some initial answers. You've said most of your results were between 5-10 and you only get the symptoms some days.

Three thoughts - can you link the lows/symptoms to anything yet? If nor, that would be useful.
Have you eaten a carby meal and then tested every 30mins or more often afterwards to see if you're having a sudden/quick drop from the higher normal to the lower normal, which is causing yourvsymptoms?
Finally, have you tried just eating your usual diet, not testing regularly but waiting until you get the symptoms and then testing to confirm they are due to low blood sugar?

A final 'final thought', why not experiment with a variety of eating plans eg low carb, eating small meals more often, protein snacks between meals, etc, etc (those are just random examples) and see which way of eating makes you feel best?

I would be wary of assuming too much until you have a definite diagnosis.

 

[ghost_whistler]

I tested upon waking and usually before eating - ie when i started feeling hungry after the last meal. I don't usually feel hungry/hypo upon waking, although the glucose level averages about 5.5.

Waiting until symptoms or hunger is how i've been testing. Low results coincide with symptoms. Last friday after a counselling session i got home feeling a little woozy and the reading was less than 5. Later I had a meal with a 100g portion of roasted buckwheat (i had been told was low carb and gluten free) and felt the symptoms, reading was under 4 and a half.

I have not tested every 30 mins, i can try it if they give me some more strips.

I am currently trying to cut out wheat and grains, as the majority of carbs i eat come from wholeweat sandwiches for lunch/snack before bed (around 8-9pm), crispbread sandiwches for breakfast/late afternoon, and wholeweat noodles or brown rice with my dinner.

Interestingly although i cooked noodles last night for dinner, i put them on a separate plate to avoid eating unless i felt necessary. I didn't eat them, and i think i felt (hard to be objective - especially as i'd crashed earlier in the day and my system may hav ebeen compensating somehow) less hungry until bedtime snack.

Also, someone on a reddit discussion forum for keto mentioned 'early' hypoglycemia. I have never heard of this and assumed they meant reactive. Does anyone know what early hypo is, if anything?

 

[azure]

Again, apologies if this has all been mentioned, but can I ask your age (roughly)? Is there any link to your hormones?

Have you had any symptoms while at the doctors/hospital/similar and had them do a test?

 

[Brunneria]

I believe that 'early' is when you rise incredibly fast, and then crash equally quickly. Within an hour or so. But it isn't something that happens to me - I usually get hypos around 2.5-3.5 hours after meals, although I can slow that down a bit more and reduce both the spike and the crash by eating fat and fibre and protein in the meal. And if I don't eat the carbs, I don't get the spike, so I don't get the crash, at all.

I did a quick google and found this. But I don't know if it will give any info that you find useful.
https://www.hindawi.com/journals/crim/2013/273957/

@Lamont D may be able to help. He has done a bit of reading on 'early' RH, I think.

 

[Lamont D]

I tested upon waking and usually before eating - ie when i started feeling hungry after the last meal. I don't usually feel hungry/hypo upon waking, although the glucose level averages about 5.5.

Waiting until symptoms or hunger is how i've been testing. Low results coincide with symptoms. Last friday after a counselling session i got home feeling a little woozy and the reading was less than 5. Later I had a meal with a 100g portion of roasted buckwheat (i had been told was low carb and gluten free) and felt the symptoms, reading was under 4 and a half.

I have not tested every 30 mins, i can try it if they give me some more strips.

I am currently trying to cut out wheat and grains, as the majority of carbs i eat come from wholeweat sandwiches for lunch/snack before bed (around 8-9pm), crispbread sandiwches for breakfast/late afternoon, and wholeweat noodles or brown rice with my dinner.

Interestingly although i cooked noodles last night for dinner, i put them on a separate plate to avoid eating unless i felt necessary. I didn't eat them, and i think i felt (hard to be objective - especially as i'd crashed earlier in the day and my system may hav ebeen compensating somehow) less hungry until bedtime snack.

Also, someone on a reddit discussion forum for keto mentioned 'early' hypoglycemia. I have never heard of this and assumed they meant reactive. Does anyone know what early hypo is, if anything?

I have never heard it called that either!
I think it refers to gastric dumping. I think that is a better description.
You may not get to be in a hypo episode with this.
But it is more than reasonable to suspect that it does.
And it does cause the symptoms that you refer to.
The symptoms are caused by too much of a spike after eating, then crashing down again, it is the fluctuating blood glucose levels that give you symptoms, add on the speed of your spike and hypos, that's hard and horrible on your body and your brain!
As has been said previously, testing is the only way to find out and record everything in your food diary!
I would also stay away from those foods you describe as low GI, if you do suffer from this sort of condition including Hypoglycaemia, they are just slower acting carbs, but they will make you spike at a later time and you will get the symptoms from the spike and crash later on. Not spiking is the way forward!

Hope this helps.

 

[azure]

I tested upon waking and usually before eating - ie when i started feeling hungry after the last meal. I don't usually feel hungry/hypo upon waking, although the glucose level averages about 5.5.

Waiting until symptoms or hunger is how i've been testing. Low results coincide with symptoms. Last friday after a counselling session i got home feeling a little woozy and the reading was less than 5. Later I had a meal with a 100g portion of roasted buckwheat (i had been told was low carb and gluten free) and felt the symptoms, reading was under 4 and a half.

I have not tested every 30 mins, i can try it if they give me some more strips.

I am currently trying to cut out wheat and grains, as the majority of carbs i eat come from wholeweat sandwiches for lunch/snack before bed (around 8-9pm), crispbread sandiwches for breakfast/late afternoon, and wholeweat noodles or brown rice with my dinner.

Interestingly although i cooked noodles last night for dinner, i put them on a separate plate to avoid eating unless i felt necessary. I didn't eat them, and i think i felt (hard to be objective - especially as i'd crashed earlier in the day and my system may hav ebeen compensating somehow) less hungry until bedtime snack.

Also, someone on a reddit discussion forum for keto mentioned 'early' hypoglycemia. I have never heard of this and assumed they meant reactive. Does anyone know what early hypo is, if anything?

Less than 5 and 4.5 aren't hypo readings. They're perfectly normal readings

You say you wake at around 5.5 but don't feel hypo - well, again that's normal because your 5.5 is a normal reading, so that's reassuring too.

Apart from the rogue 3.3, it sounds like your daytime readings are normal too. I have two glucose meters and they can often read around 1mmol different, so your 3.3 may well have been higher. Non-diabetic friends who I've tested have had readings in the 3s at certain times.

Perhaps when the doctor said you had a 'reactive metabolism', he/she just meant you were more sensitive to normal,fluctuations in blood sugar?

 

[ghost_whistler]

Again, apologies if this has all been mentioned, but can I ask your age (roughly)? Is there any link to your hormones?

Have you had any symptoms while at the doctors/hospital/similar and had them do a test?

I am 43/male. I've been dealing with this for i'd say at least 15 years. the doctor record sme being tested about ten years ago. I am not aware of anything hormone-related, but I don't know if they checked this. They've repeatedly ruled out diabetes, i've mentioned doing the glucose test which yielded nothing, and my thyroid was tested two years ago so if there was a problem it would have appeared. What the insulin blood test will reveal I don't know since they've yet to actually get on and do it for some reason, despite having the sample for 3 weeks. I don't know how likely an insulinoma is.

I've never had the symptoms while at the hospital/doctors. She took a reading when i went a few weeks back, and that was around 8-30am before i'd even eaten (didn't have time after ringing for an appointment and didn't feel hungry). The reading was 5.6 iirc.

The whole thing is just tiring and wierd. It's so inconsistent. I feel fine fasting (ie before breakfast), but if i eat something like porridge, and i don't anymore, then i'm hungry half an hour later. Carbs? Who knows, but i recall the endocrinologist i saw back them at the hospital recommending porridge because it's supposed to be slow acting. Same with buckwheat last week. I wanted to try it because it's supposed ot be wheat free. Just no good at all.

 

[ghost_whistler]

I believe that 'early' is when you rise incredibly fast, and then crash equally quickly. Within an hour or so. But it isn't something that happens to me - I usually get hypos around 2.5-3.5 hours after meals, although I can slow that down a bit more and reduce both the spike and the crash by eating fat and fibre and protein in the meal. And if I don't eat the carbs, I don't get the spike, so I don't get the crash, at all.

I did a quick google and found this. But I don't know if it will give any info that you find useful.
https://www.hindawi.com/journals/crim/2013/273957/

@Lamont D may be able to help. He has done a bit of reading on 'early' RH, I think.

it just sounds like reactive hypoglycemia. I'm sure some people with it react faster/slower.

 

[ghost_whistler]

Less than 5 and 4.5 aren't hypo readings. They're perfectly normal readings

You say you wake at around 5.5 but don't feel hypo - well, again that's normal because your 5.5 is a normal reading, so that's reassuring too.

Apart from the rogue 3.3, it sounds like your daytime readings are normal too. I have two glucose meters and they can often read around 1mmol different, so your 3.3 may well have been higher. Non-diabetic friends who I've tested have had readings in the 3s at certain times.

Perhaps when the doctor said you had a 'reactive metabolism', he/she just meant you were more sensitive to normal,fluctuations in blood sugar?

the readings in the 4's didn't feel too great.

these aren't just readings, they are accompanied by some feelings/symptoms. If i'd felt fine yesterday, i wouldn't have tested. It was only because i could sense onset of symptoms.

I have to say i'm not sure I'm convinced by the point about meters. If it's possible they could be reading lower than the reality, then how would you know it wasn't the reverse? I have to assume they are working correctly. So far that seems to be the case.

 

[azure]

If you're feeling not right at readings in the 4s, which are perfectly normal and desirable blood sugar readings, then perhaps there's something else going on.

It's reassuring you've had things like thyroid checked, as at least you can rule that out. Sometimes problems can only be found by process of elimination, which is tiring, I know, if you've not been feeling right for some years.

What you described - eating some carbs and then feeling hungry shortly after isn't uncommon. I think some people's bodies do,react like that - that is, things that are supposed to,be filling like bread and porridge can just make some people hungrier.

Have you tried things like eating more protein with a meal - that is, trying to jiggle the balance of the meal so you have moderate amounts of carbs but also protein and fat? Have you tried snacking between meals - both small carby snacks and non-carb snacks like cheese and nuts?

Until you get your appointment, all you can do is see if you can discover what works for you food-wise. We're all individuals and what suits one person may not suit another. If you could find two or three breakfasts, and lunches and evening meals that reduced your symptoms, then that might make them manageable at least.

If it was me, I wouldn't assume that keto was best just because others find it so. I'd try a logical experiment with various meals, maybe starting at trying to get a good breakfast for,you, then working through each meal, to,see what makes you feel best.

 

[ghost_whistler]

I'm not very good at communicating on internet forums, nor liking individual posts etc, but I am very grateful for the responses and support. I've been struggling with this over the past month really badly. Even though the symptoms don't seem to be any worse than they ever were (and i'm not saying i managed those ideally either), it's really gotten to me over the past month and siginificant changes are required I think.

 

[Lamont D]

I believe that 'early' is when you rise incredibly fast, and then crash equally quickly. Within an hour or so. But it isn't something that happens to me - I usually get hypos around 2.5-3.5 hours after meals, although I can slow that down a bit more and reduce both the spike and the crash by eating fat and fibre and protein in the meal. And if I don't eat the carbs, I don't get the spike, so I don't get the crash, at all.

I did a quick google and found this. But I don't know if it will give any info that you find useful.
https://www.hindawi.com/journals/crim/2013/273957/

@Lamont D may be able to help. He has done a bit of reading on 'early' RH, I think.

Hi, Brun,
I think that is the best descriptive of 'early reactive hypoglycaemia' that I have read and I have bookmarked it as part of my encyclopedia of articles and medical notes.
It also gives a good description of my condition and how it affects the brain as well as the other symptoms.
The doctors could do with learning how to treat the hypos though and the rebound effect, as it did me on my first eOGTT, (that is a good easy way of prolonged OGTT!)
Also the low GI approach, when will they realise the symptoms do go away, if you don't them!
Hey ho!

I just knew we would be busy at some stage, just shows, we are not as unique as we thought we were!

 

[Lamont D]

I am 43/male. I've been dealing with this for i'd say at least 15 years. the doctor record sme being tested about ten years ago. I am not aware of anything hormone-related, but I don't know if they checked this. They've repeatedly ruled out diabetes, i've mentioned doing the glucose test which yielded nothing, and my thyroid was tested two years ago so if there was a problem it would have appeared. What the insulin blood test will reveal I don't know since they've yet to actually get on and do it for some reason, despite having the sample for 3 weeks. I don't know how likely an insulinoma is.

I've never had the symptoms while at the hospital/doctors. She took a reading when i went a few weeks back, and that was around 8-30am before i'd even eaten (didn't have time after ringing for an appointment and didn't feel hungry). The reading was 5.6 iirc.

The whole thing is just tiring and wierd. It's so inconsistent. I feel fine fasting (ie before breakfast), but if i eat something like porridge, and i don't anymore, then i'm hungry half an hour later. Carbs? Who knows, but i recall the endocrinologist i saw back them at the hospital recommending porridge because it's supposed to be slow acting. Same with buckwheat last week. I wanted to try it because it's supposed ot be wheat free. Just no good at all.

I've been dealing with the symptoms and my health problems for nearly twenty years, it took over a decade to get a diagnosis.
RH in my case, hypos only occurs after three hours depending on what I ate!
A two hour OGTT will not show nothing, only probably high glucose levels and high insulin resistance and high insulin levels in your blood tests, but that could be T2, except you have normal fasting levels and hba1c!
I was recommended porridge, but found that was the reason why a hypo happened in my doctors surgery! Grains are known to be baddies, it's something that you will have to test and experiment with!
If you don't eat anything and have a test, you will almost certainly be in normal levels!
That is why it so confusing and difficult to diagnose by GPs. It needs hospital tests starting with an extended OGTT.
You could have insulinoma, you might have pancreatitis, you may just be slightly intolerant to carbs and sugars namely wheat!
We could speculate all night, but, the bottom line is you need tests and getting there is the hard part!
I had to battle to get a specialist endocrinologist who knew what was going on and that guy, literally saved my life!

 

[ghost_whistler]

I don't know what to say, i have to assume the glucose test they did was chosen deliberately and analysed appropriately. If it wasn't, i don't know what to say. I mentioned today that perhaps the test should be longer, as some people go for hours in these tests, but she said that two hours was the norm. Until i see an endocrinologist, god knows when that will be, there isn't much else I can do. I'm also tempted to see what a dietician would tell me about keto before fully committing to it. I still find it very scary to go for (sorry!). On the other hand, if i eliminate bread and wheat i'm more or less going to be nearing ketogenic level carb intake so i don't really know what to think!

 

[Lamont D]

Ok, I know that because of all the information being given to you is a tad overwhelming, so I will say, you need to take it slowly and read up on what is happening to you. A better understanding of the condition and obviously the low carb approach needs to be explored and you need time to get your head around it all.
It is scary and along with the symptoms, you may not be aware of, this is something you should sleep on.
All the best advice given to you by so called nutritionists and doctors for you to be healthy is not so healthy for you, you already know you are wheat intolerant, why not sugar intolerant as well, or fructose?

The two hour glucose test is the norm if testing for intolerance in diabetes, but we haven't got diabetes, it is similar but we have not got diabetic hba1c levels!

I will leave it there because of information overload, do have a read around and then we will see If we can help you through the mire of getting the control you need.

I had to read and read, think about what it all means to myself and my family and my work and how it would impact my future life and health, I couldn't and wouldn't go back, no way, I've found my way, I will try and help you get there if I can!

Best wishes

 

[azure]

I don't know what to say, i have to assume the glucose test they did was chosen deliberately and analysed appropriately. If it wasn't, i don't know what to say. I mentioned today that perhaps the test should be longer, as some people go for hours in these tests, but she said that two hours was the norm. Until i see an endocrinologist, god knows when that will be, there isn't much else I can do. I'm also tempted to see what a dietician would tell me about keto before fully committing to it. I still find it very scary to go for (sorry!). On the other hand, if i eliminate bread and wheat i'm more or less going to be nearing ketogenic level carb intake so i don't really know what to think!

Hopefully the Endo will be able to,reassure you.

I forgot to mention above that something like MyFitnessPal is good to keep records of your food intake - ie percentages of carbs, protein and fat, plus calories, etc. I personally think you should experiment as I said. If you could at least find a few 'safe' meals to eat for now (or ones that don't make you feel too bad) then that might help you dl with tjings while you wait for your appointment.

I would be very wary of assuming anything for now as you haven't had a diagnosis yet. See what your appointments bring first.

 

[ghost_whistler]

What diet changes could i safely try in the meantime. It's going to be a long wait for an appointment.

 

[azure]

What diet changes could i safely try in the meantime. It's going to be a long wait for an appointment.

Read what I wrote above. Experiment with a) percentages of meal components ie carbs, protein and fat b) with snacks as above c) with number and size of meals.

Approach it logically.

 

[ghost_whistler]

Just had a breakfast of 2 sausages (forgetting they contain a smallamount of wheat, oh well), 2 slices of bacon, half an avocado, a portion (i've no idea how much a portion is) of spinach and a few leaves of lettuce, and a couple of scoops of greek fat live yoghurt and half a glass of soy milk.

this, or something like it, is going to be my breakfast from now on.

 

[ghost_whistler]

Ok this is really weird. I just measured my bs before eating - 6.2 while i'm cooking oopsie bread, and i eat two pieces of cheese wrapped in some ham and lettuce. I started to feel very sweaty and re checked and got 14! That's in the hyper/diabetic spectrum! I measured twice again shortly after and it came down to 8 very quickly.

Anyone know what this might be? Carb withdrawal, given what i've eaten today? Should I go back to carbs for breakfast? I don't know what on earth is happening here. I've been emphatically told, on many occassions, that i am NOT diabetic.