Low carb diet and night cramps....help please!11

[Glenmac]

Thanks for this. I just checked my sodium results. Four taken over the last couple of years are in the normal range, including the last sample that showed the low potassium. I am on treatment for high BP but home readings show them coming down since low carbing, loosing weight etc…. I too have given up bananas, I used to eat one most days and only have maybe one tiny roast potato on Sundays now. Looks like a little low salt wouldn't go amiss.

I have also given up bananas which pre low carbing I ate most days.I have just two small potatoes as a treat now.I can see that I need to address several points.Id dropped the nuts for a while in tweeking my diet to lose a little more weight.Ill add them to my shopping list.Hope things improve for you too Rachox.

 

[ringi]

The NHS recommended salt intake has no bases in science (just like the eat well plate!) some studies show that people live longer when they have about double the recommended salt intake. This is still a lot less then someone eating fast food etc every day gets, so lots of people do have too much salt. If you are cooking all your own food you are very unlikely to be having too much salt.

Lots of people eating low carb find that a stockcube in a mag of hat water two times a day helps them as it provides a little more salt. It seems that the body needs a little more salt on a low card diet.

LoSalt sounds like a good option for getting potassium but I would still have the stockcubes to get enough sodium. A spoon of Marmite in a mug of hot water will give B12 as well as salt.

Clearly we need to drink enough water, but without salt, our body will not take on the water – hence the recommendation to have 5g of salt 1hr before a long run, with 0.5l of water 30 minutes before the run. (LoSalt would be ideal for this as potassium is lost as well when we sweat.

Sodium results can often look normal even if you are not having enough, as the body chooses dehydration over having to low sodium. If you kidneys are working well, they will remove any excess salt.

I have seen claim that “slow mag”is needed by some people on low carb to stop cramps – details in The Art and Science of Low Carbohydrate Living on how to get the dose right.

 

[Glenmac]

The NHS recommended salt intake has no bases in science (just like the eat well plate!) some studies show that people live longer when they have about double the recommended salt intake. This is still a lot less then someone eating fast food etc every day gets, so lots of people do have too much salt. If you are cooking all your own food you are very unlikely to be having too much salt.

Lots of people eating low carb find that a stockcube in a mag of hat water two times a day helps them as it provides a little more salt. It seems that the body needs a little more salt on a low card diet.

LoSalt sounds like a good option for getting potassium but I would still have the stockcubes to get enough sodium. A spoon of Marmite in a mug of hot water will give B12 as well as salt.

Clearly we need to drink enough water, but without salt, our body will not take on the water – hence the recommendation to have 5g of salt 1hr before a long run, with 0.5l of water 30 minutes before the run. (LoSalt would be ideal for this as potassium is lost as well when we sweat.

Sodium results can often look normal even if you are not having enough, as the body chooses dehydration over having to low sodium. If you kidneys are working well, they will remove any excess salt.

I have seen claim that “slow mag”is needed by some people on low carb to stop cramps – details in The Art and Science of Low Carbohydrate Living on how to get the dose right.

Thankyou Ringi.These are very helpful suggestions.Im beginning to understand the science better and the link between salt,water,and staying hydrated.I shall certainly use the stock cube in water drink.The book recommendation sounds interesting,and will go on my next read list.

 

[lindisfel]

This post is of great interest to me. Since starting on a low carb/mod fat diet I have often been waking in the mornings with cramp in my ankles. I have stopped adding Lo-salt (or indeed any salt) to my food as I thought I read somewhere Lo salt wasn't recommended for diabetics due to harm it may do to your kidneys. I just looked up my blood results online and my potassium is 3.2mmols/l it says it should be 3.5-5mmols/l! This may explain things? I guess I should start using low salt again but will the sodium content be harmful?

Salt will cause you to lose potassium. Your potassium is low you may have high bp as a result. I try to keep my potassium above 4.5 else my heart plays up. D.

 

[Rachox]

Salt will cause you to lose potassium. Your potassium is low you may have high bp as a result. I try to keep my potassium above 4.5 else my heart plays up. D.

Oh it's so complicated! My BP is actually much better since starting low carbing, loosing weight etc… I am on BP meds, two types but was hoping maybe to stop one of them in due course!

 

[ringi]

Oh it's so complicated! My BP is actually much better since starting low carbing, loosing weight etc… I am on BP meds, two types but was hoping maybe to stop one of them in due course!

I expect you have gone from eating ready meals etc that have LOTS of added salt etc to very little on the food you cook yourself, if you were getting a lot too much salt that would not have been good for BP. Low carb is also known to reduce BP even if your salt intake has remained the same. (Will only happen in controlled tests, as in real life most people have less salt when they go Low Carb.)

The BP meds may even be the reasons for some of the cramps, ask you doctor or chemist if they are.

Salt will cause you to lose potassium. Your potassium is low you may have high bp as a result. I try to keep my potassium above 4.5 else my heart plays up.

It takes a lot too much salt to lose potassium, but I like the ideal of using some LoSalt to reduce this risk.

It is a shame “oral rehydration” mixes without sugar are hard to get ready made, Sodium Chloride 0.47g plus Potassium Chloride 0.30g in a mug of water will be about right. But without the glucose and flowerings may not be that nice to drink. (A lot easier in ready mixed packets, but we need to avoid the glucose unless being sick etc.

 

[Glenmac]

Oh it's so complicated! My BP is actually much better since starting low carbing, loosing weight etc… I am on BP meds, two types but was hoping maybe to stop one of them in due course!

I am also on meds three types for BP,there may be a connection here Rachox.Ill check the leaflets for side effects.It is complicated.

 

[ringi]

I am starting to think that the BP meds may be connected to the cramps, but as I have never taken them, and therefore have not spend a few days understanding how they work, I don't know.

 

[Rachox]

I expect you have gone from eating ready meals etc that have LOTS of added salt etc to very little on the food you cook yourself, if you were getting a lot too much salt that would not have been good for BP. Low carb is also known to reduce BP even if your salt intake has remained the same. (Will only happen in controlled tests, as in real life most people have less salt when they go Low Carb.)

The BP meds may even be the reasons for some of the cramps, ask you doctor or chemist if they are.

I guess my salt intake in meals has gone down somewhat though I didn't eat many ready meals, I only ever added (Lo)/salt to rice, chips or eggs. I'm not eating rice or chips now and stopped adding it to eggs. I will start using some Lo salt again now.
I've been on the same BP meds for several years and not suffered these cramps before. I'm like the OP in that I didn't mention these cramps to my GP at my appt last month for fear of him saying it was my 'faddy' new diet. I will however mention it at next month's appt as he can now see that my 'faddy' diet has reduced my HbA1c significantly.

 

[badcat]

The other complicating factor is the bodies need to have a balance between sodium and potassium - too much of either is potentially dangerous. Too much salt and your blood pressure goes too high, too much potassium you risk hyperkalemia.
Some drugs ( Ace inhibitors among them) can mess with potassium excretion and increase the risk of hyperkalemia
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyperkalemia

 

[Rachox]

The other complicating factor is the bodies need to have a balance between sodium and potassium - too much of either is potentially dangerous. Too much salt and your blood pressure goes too high, too much potassium you risk hyperkalemia.
Some drugs ( Ace inhibitors among them) can mess with potassium excretion and increase the risk of hyperkalemia
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyperkalemia

Oh no! Now even more confusing, I have a low potassium level yet I'm on an ace-inhibitor, Ramipril!

 

[ringi]

Go into you local chemist and ask for a medication review, a chemist knows a lot more about drugs then a GP and can spend half an hour with you unlike the 7 minutes you get with the GP. The chemist will then if needed write to the GP advising what needs doing.

This thread will give you a good ideal of what to ask the chemist.

When talking to a GP just say you have "reduced the number of high GI carbs you are eating", as that is what NICE says they should recommend. Also tell the GP how much veg you are eating, as they like people to eat lots of green veg.

 

[lindisfel]

I guess my salt intake in meals has gone down somewhat though I didn't eat many ready meals, I only ever added (Lo)/salt to rice, chips or eggs. I'm not eating rice or chips now and stopped adding it to eggs. I will start using some Lo salt again now.
I've been on the same BP meds for several years and not suffered these cramps before. I'm like the OP in that I didn't mention these cramps to my GP at my appt last month for fear of him saying it was my 'faddy' new diet. I will however mention it at next month's appt as he can now see that my 'faddy' diet has reduced my HbA1c significantly.

I have Conn's, Rachox and my body loses potassium and retains sodium so I have a low salt diet and take a drug to stop excessive aldosterone hanging on to sodium. It stops potassium being lost. For most people that are not salt sensitive salt intake matters little because the body compensates via the aldosterone/renin system. It is potassium that is the problem because it is difficult to get the recommended amount per day. Derek

 

[Glenmac]

Go into you local chemist and ask for a medication review, a chemist knows a lot more about drugs then a GP and can spend half an hour with you unlike the 7 minutes you get with the GP. The chemist will then if needed write to the GP advising what needs doing.

This thread will give you a good ideal of what to ask the chemist.

When talking to a GP just say you have "reduced the number of high GI carbs you are eating", as that is what NICE says they should recommend. Also tell the GP how much veg you are eating, as they like people to eat lots of green veg.

That seems to be good advice ringi,I've had a conversation previously with the pharmacist in our health centre Boots.Much to my surprise she really approved of low carb diets for diabetes,as did the trainee,who was very enthusiastic.Ill ask her to review my medication,I'm sure she will be very helpful.

 

[ickihun]

starting to think that the BP meds may be connected to the cramps, but as I have never taken them, and therefore have not spend a few days understanding how they work, I don't know.

Ive been on bp meds for 11yrs since pregnancy of first son and only just started feet cramps on a statin. So that is why I feel statin related only, for me. Also stopped statin so now no foot cramps unless in freezing conditions (which we've had this summer in the north-east through the night).

 

[lindisfel]

If any one is on bp med ending in 'sartan they work into the renin system and eating salt renders these ARB's ineffectual. This is also true of drugs ending in 'pril , they also work on the renin system at a different point but cause a permanent cough in some patients. That's why I once took an ARB. The best person to ask about meds is your doctor. I had to explain to the chemist why I was on the potassium sparing diuretic Eplerenone! Derek

 

[lindisfel]

Go into you local chemist and ask for a medication review, a chemist knows a lot more about drugs then a GP and can spend half an hour with you unlike the 7 minutes you get with the GP. The chemist will then if needed write to the GP advising what needs doing.

This thread will give you a good ideal of what to ask the chemist.

When talking to a GP just say you have "reduced the number of high GI carbs you are eating", as that is what NICE says they should recommend. Also tell the GP how much veg you are eating, as they like people to eat lots of green veg.

Depends on chemist you must have one that knows your medical history!

 

[ringi]

Depends on chemist you must have one that knows your medical history!

Given that they get paid close to £30 for doing the review, they have time to ask you for your medical history if they are doing their job.

 

[lindisfel]

Given that they get paid close to £30 for doing the review, they have time to ask you for your medical history if they are doing their job.

I know some doctors who think giving chemist money for tablet reviews is a rip off.

 

[Glenmac]

Depends on chemist you must have one that knows your medical history!

The pharmacist/chemist if you are lucky, may have a more recent awareness of contra-indications of some drugs.Mine had spotted my longstanding cough could be connected to a BP med.The med was changed,cough gone!When you see a different locum at each visit it's difficult to have any sort of continuity,for either doctor or patient.Some of us oldies and not so oldies have more than one illness to unravel