Eating out nightmare

[MommaE]

If im organising a meal out I look on the restaurant website first to see what is suitable before booking. If someone else has organised it I try to pick the lowest carb item on the menu. In an Italian usually a chicken dish or steak, definitely steer clear of pizza and pasta. I might ask them to substitute extra veg or salad instead of potatoes. If there is nothing suitable on the menu I have found ravioli seems to be the best option for me.

I find the hardest menus to pick from are Chinese and lunch time sandwich type shops. I have been known to order a tuna jacket potato without the jacket…..ie tuna Mayo and salad. All day breakfasts are ok if you avoid the toast, hash browns and baked beans.

I was on a river cruise last year and they were providing a packed lunch for an excursion which was a sandwich, fruit, crisps. I had a quiet word about low carb and they offered me gluten free bread (which is not low carb), so I suggested to them if they gave me some foil I could select some things to take from the breakfast buffet and I ended up with a lovely meal of cheeses, hams, walnuts and salad.

The tuna without a jacket made me smile

 

[AndBreathe]

To be honest, I have zero expectation that a restaurant or eatery will have any interest in any dietary requirements, unless they think they will be sued. Their offering is their offering, and in the age old way,........ "buyer beware."

From any given menu I just choose the least, worst/best option and pick what I can to eat from it. Sometimes that'll mean I leave stuff on the plate, or ask for a side plat to put something onto, but that's up to me.

As others have said, I'll try to navigate a menu before going. Getting along for 10 years in, folks just accept how I eat, but at the outset if someone asked why I wasn't eating x, y or z, my response was I'd had some routine blood tests that showed a few things in my diet weren't doing me any favours, I was was giving them up until further notice. Only once was I challenged on that, by the wife of a retired GP, who obviously felt it was her job to know the detail. I just explaine she didn't have enough life left to hear the story, laughed and moved on.

My condition is my condition to manage. These days I do have to be gluten free, and when choosing in a restaurant will always confirm I am having the gluten-free option.

Its tough going at the outset, I know, but trust me, it gets easier.

 

[HSSS]

To be honest, I have zero expectation that a restaurant or eatery will have any interest in any dietary requirements, unless they think they will be sued. Their offering is their offering, and in the age old way,........ "buyer beware."

My condition is my condition to manage.

whilst what you say is true, it is also true when they choose to cater for some customers other (optional) diets this argument falls down a bit. They are offering a service and if they want to make their customers happy and return at the very least some flexibility helps. Obviously I can choose not to eat somewhere that doesn’t recognise this.

I also object to paying for half a plate I can’t eat - so do choose not to eat at all if that’s the poor best they can do.

 

[wozey]

I also object to paying for half a plate I can’t eat - so do choose not to eat at all if that’s the poor best they can do.

I was always brought up that you clear the plate and don’t waste food so I’d rather not be given things I don’t plan on eating knowing it will end up in a bin

 

[AndBreathe]

whilst what you say is true, it is also true when they choose to cater for some customers other (optional) diets this argument falls down a bit. They are offering a service and if they want to make their customers happy and return at the very least some flexibility helps. Obviously I can choose not to eat somewhere that doesn’t recognise this.

I also object to paying for half a plate I can’t eat - so do choose not to eat at all if that’s the poor best they can do.

To date, I have never been dragged against my will into a restaurant. I enter of my own free will. It may not always be my choice of Latvian, but I either choose to go in or not. At that point, I am committed to nothing.

I then view their offering, via the menu, and make my choices. If there is nothing I consider to be palatable to me, I can leave. It might feel uncomfortable, but I can leave. No contract had been made between me and the restaurant.

Restaurants are businesses, often small businesses, and they can choose what they offer their clientele. They must provide information on 14 allergens. It is up to them if they offer alternatives, whether that be Vegetarian, gluten-free or whatever.

My OH is a former restauranteur, amongst other businesses. His business did comply with allergens requirements, and had a couple of simple vegetarian offerings on his menu, but he would not have been happy to have a customer wanting to alter his menu. You may or may not find that palatable, but that was his and other restauranteurs’ right.

Of course, I would like low carb options to be routinely available in every food outlet. Sadly, some offerings are not at all low-carb friendly. Hopefully things will change over time.

 

[HSSS]

To date, I have never been dragged against my will into a restaurant. I enter of my own free will. It may not always be my choice of Latvian, but I either choose to go in or not. At that point, I am committed to nothing.

I then view their offering, via the menu, and make my choices. If there is nothing I consider to be palatable to me, I can leave. It might feel uncomfortable, but I can leave. No contract had been made between me and the restaurant.

Restaurants are businesses, often small businesses, and they can choose what they offer their clientele. They must provide information on 14 allergens. It is up to them if they offer alternatives, whether that be Vegetarian, gluten-free or whatever.

My OH is a former restauranteur, amongst other businesses. His business did comply with allergens requirements, and had a couple of simple vegetarian offerings on his menu, but he would not have been happy to have a customer wanting to alter his menu. You may or may not find that palatable, but that was his and other restauranteurs’ right.

Of course, I would like low carb options to be routinely available in every food outlet. Sadly, some offerings are not at all low-carb friendly. Hopefully things will change over time.

You are missing my point here. Yes of course we can choose not to eat there, I already said that. And yes of course a restaurant can offer whatever they want.

The fact is most restaurants do choose to cater for other dietary choices even if they don’t have to, beyond the allergy requirements. If a restauranteur is so determined that they don’t want their menu altered even for medical reasons then I definitely wouldn’t want to eat somewhere so pretentious, even if it is entirely their right to make that choice.

 

[wozey]

Update: so I’ve just got off the phone from speaking with the owner who didn’t really understand much of my issue. He’s type 2 himself but says he’s never been told about eating a low carb diet (I tried to educate him) but as I explained it doesn’t matter what he thinks of my request it shouldn’t have been broadcast to everyone in the vicinity and it’s a very simple question that really shouldn’t have been a major issue! He agreed and said they normally like to be told in advance of any specific dietary requirements and the chef would have made his best efforts to accommodate me. I’ve been offered a free lunch as way of an apology and assured they will do better in future.
Looks like most of you were fairly right with what you’ve said, going forward I will definitely call ahead in future as this seems the norm

 

[AndBreathe]

You are missing my point here. Yes of course we can choose not to eat there, I already said that. And yes of course a restaurant can offer whatever they want.

The fact is most restaurants do choose to cater for other dietary choices even if they don’t have to, beyond the allergy requirements. If a restauranteur is so determined that they don’t want their menu altered even for medical reasons then I definitely wouldn’t want to eat somewhere so pretentious, even if it is entirely their right to make that choice.

My feeling is that there is a greater commercial demand for vegetarian food, for example. Certainly, when I was diagnosed and went LC my OH had never heard of it.

But, my point is that we all make choices, both as customers and those offering their services. I feel it is important that we respect others choices. As well as low carb, I live gluten-free. If there is nothing on a menu gluten-free that I find suitable, I can choose only to have a drink, or leave. I don’t expect a person modify their offering just because ingesting gluten will give me will render me miserable for several days.

@Wosey should not have been outed as he was, and the staff member dealing with him would never win any awards for diplomacy, and it appears he has received an apology from the proprietor.

 

[HSSS]

My feeling is that there is a greater commercial demand for vegetarian food, for example. Certainly, when I was diagnosed and went LC my OH had never heard of it.

But, my point is that we all make choices, both as customers and those offering their services. I feel it is important that we respect others choices. As well as low carb, I live gluten-free. If there is nothing on a menu gluten-free that I find suitable, I can choose only to have a drink, or leave. I don’t expect a person modify their offering just because ingesting gluten will give me will render me miserable for several days.

@Wosey should not have been outed as he was, and the staff member dealing with him would never win any awards for diplomacy, and it appears he has received an apology from the proprietor.

Yes again you are right about the demand being lower. But if no one ever asks for it there will never be a need to meet demand. And of course a non helpful restaurant can respect my choice not to give them money for their lack of service as a result.

I don’t ask or expect for foods not on the menu, just simple swaps of this instead of that of foods, as they already appear elsewhere on the menu.

 

[Outlier]

I don’t ask or expect for foods not on the menu, just simple swaps of this instead of that of foods, as they already appear elsewhere on the menu.

That's my thinking, too. Also, I find it makes life easier if I take charge of the dialogue and narrow the decision-making for the staff - such as: I'm afraid I'm not allowed to eat (insert carbs of choice) but may I have a green salad instead please, no dressing except olive oil?

 

[TriciaWs]

I will tell them I'm a diet-controlled diabetic and be as clear as possible about my needs.
The only time I had an issue was booking for a 3 day conference. I filled in the dietary needs section but when I arrived I for a snooty message that they didn't cater for low carb diets.
As I'm also a mobility scooter user I couldn't join the hot buffet queue (too crowded with people not looking where they were going) and even if I had all the containers were too high for me to see the contents). This was a disability they understood so I got a helper from the kitchen staff - who knew about keto and arranged for me to get suitable meals.
I did leave feedback, thanking her and the chef but pointing out that the requirement for low carb in my case comes under disability law, not just a fussy customer.

 

[TriciaWs]

One of the best experiences I had was at (another) convention last year. The special food options for delegates were carbs heavy but I said I would order and pay for a pizza with extra (low carb) toppings and just eat those - the chef then said I could just have the toppings, which arrived in 6 small oven dishes on a wooden platter.

 

[Resurgam]

Best experience of my diabetes - probably - was seeing the grin slide off the face of a waiter pretending he did not speak much English when I asked for a low carb option, so I swapped to Italian and repeated my request whilst the waitress a couple of tables away was in fits of giggles - my Italian is correct just my accent flips to Yorkshire.

 

[AndBreathe]

”…. the requirement for low carb in my case comes under disability law, not just a fussy customer.”

Tricia, I’d not wager the farm on that point. The law pertaining disability And diabetes focuses on those using insulin and other strong blood glucose lowering medications.

There has been some debate on forum in the past, but if you can show which part of the law supports your case I’ll very happily be educated and apologise unreservedly.

 

[PenguinMum]

Just to add we stayed at lovely old inn with friends for a long weekend last year. I perused the menu in advance and it was challenging for LC. I phoned ahead to say I was a diet controlled T2 and would require swaps for sides and removing sauces etc. They gushed that I didnt need to worry as one of the chefs was T2 and would know exactly what I could eat. You can imagine how that turned out, not giving me the dessert menu didnt quite cut it!

 

[Munkki]

Interested conversation. I have had all kinds of experiences during the years, with some very kind and some awful waiters, one rolling her eyes and saying they are not catering for diets. Some experiences were great, with me getting beautiful meat and cheese platters, or once a briefly fried salmon (raw on the inside, loved it!) at an all vegetarian event. I agree, mentioning diabetes makes things more difficult. Italian shouldn't be too bad though, as I find eating in Italy quite suitable, but in England it's not the same of course. Starters can be great, also the secondi piatti (meat, fish etc, not necessarily with carb side). I have had hidden sugars (especially Thai) and the unexpected spike, but I tend to avoid those places later on. Now that I have a little daughter, I often order the whole dish as it is, especially roasts etc, with distinct items, maybe an extra 1-2 low carb sides and share it all with my little girl.

 

[Brunneria]

I don't think I have ever been to an Italian restaurant that didn't have salads, or steak, or veal.

50 Most Popular Italian Meat Dishes

List includes: Carne salada, Bollito misto, Peposo, Porchetta di Ariccia, Pollo alla Marengo.

www.tasteatlas.com

To get low carb Italian, you just have to look further into the menu than the pasta dishes.

One marvellous memory of baked avocado filled with an egg and covered with cheese... lush.

Caprese Baked Avocados - Keto Stuffed Avocados -Keen for Keto

When you taste the warm and creamy avocado, fresh mozzarella cheeese all gooey and melty, and balsamic vinegar slightly caramelized, you'll understand why I say this Caprese Baked Avocado recipe is a step up from caprese stuffed avocados!

keenforketo.com

And I LOVE the seafood soups and stews. No need to eat the bread.

Sicilian-Style Fish Stew Recipe | The Mediterranean Dish

All-star recipe for fish stew with a Sicilian twist! The comfort of Italian flavors in one delicious stew w/ white wine-tomato broth, capers, raisins more!

www.themediterraneandish.com

Here in the UK it is rare nowadays that a restaurant doesn't offer meals such as steak or roast chicken for those who prefer plain options.

During my years as a non veg/salad eating carnivore, I rocked up to any number of places and ordered steak, then ignored all the greenery on the plate, and left full, satisfied, and happy to return.

As for announcing whether I have T2 or not... nope. None of their business, and the waiter's only interest is getting an order in, avoiding an allergic reaction, and moving on to their next task. So I just ask for my choices, and if they can't comply, I either order something else or go hungry (the hungry part has never yet happened). Being gluten free is, for me, a much bigger priority than staying keto.

 

[Jo_the_boat]

An allergic reaction 'is where your body reacts to something that's normally harmless...'
In effect, isn't that T2s with glucose? Mention allergy and people take notice.

To be fair, I don't have a problem in restaurants (not that we go often because my wife is a terrific cook) but if you speak to the staff they are invariably accommodating.
Many dishes come with carb-laden stuff. I just ask them to replace the carby things with something else or add a side salad. In fact, they are more likely to get a decent review or personal recommendation from me for being helpful.

We were staying away at a pub in Northumberland last weekend. At dinner we were sitting next to three porkers, 2 humans and a dog.
My wife and I asked for a meal 'sympathetic' to diabetics and explained why to the waitress. No problem she said.
The bloke next door said he really admired that we were managing our T2 through diet.
His meal was carb on carb, pastry-topped pie, chips etc. and he really was overweight.
Then he tells us he's diabetic too! I ask him if he's on mediation. 'Too right,' he says, 'two different diabetic ones including Metformin plus Statins.' He said it almost proudly.
Then he was feeding chips layered in mayonnaise to the dog. Poor things was as wide as it was long.
'It's a rescue from Hungary,' the lady said, 'it deserves a treat.'

Difficult to understand really. I so wanted to encourage them to be a bit more health-conscious, but that's not up to me is it? Particularly not in a pub!

 

[lovinglife]

The other side of the coin (sort of playing devils advocate here) I have family and friends with eateries from restaurants to cafes, I worked all my life until I had my son in catering as a chef then management, hubby works for a multi national provider of food managing staff restaurants and events ranging from the extremely elite to the smallest factories.

It’s an absolute nightmare to try and cater for everyone, just the 14 allergens alone is a minefield, then there’s religious and cultural diets to consider, the labelling and information that has to be included changes all the time and costs some businesses thousands even millions to comply.

We need to be mindful that 99% of places will do their best to accommodate differences, not being able to eat carbs IS NOT an allergy, allergies are life threatening and very serious and can kill quickly, and staff quite rightly need to have awareness and training , eating more carbs than normal for one meal is not life threatening for a T2 diet only, you will not die from one meal!

I do not expect any member of staff to understand my diabetes and what I personally set my lifestyle to, why would they? You only have to look on this forum to see that it takes a while for anyone to grasp what carbs are and what they do to your blood sugar and that’s from people who have a vested interest. Also every single one of us that have diabetes of any type eat differently, some keto, some low carb, some moderate carb, some count carbs and use insulin ratios - (something I have no knowledge of, which proves my point)

There is no point in trying to educate and pontificate to hospitality staff about diabetes when you’re in their establishments, all you are doing is educating them about how YOU do it. We complain when people assume we can or can’t eat something but the person assuming is only going on a very thin knowledge gained from anecdotes from other customers.

 

[HSSS]

The other side of the coin (sort of playing devils advocate here) I have family and friends with eateries from restaurants to cafes, I worked all my life until I had my son in catering as a chef then management, hubby works for a multi national provider of food managing staff restaurants and events ranging from the extremely elite to the smallest factories.

It’s an absolute nightmare to try and cater for everyone, just the 14 allergens alone is a minefield, then there’s religious and cultural diets to consider, the labelling and information that has to be included changes all the time and costs some businesses thousands even millions to comply.

We need to be mindful that 99% of places will do their best to accommodate differences, not being able to eat carbs IS NOT an allergy, allergies are life threatening and very serious and can kill quickly, and staff quite rightly need to have awareness and training , eating more carbs than normal for one meal is not life threatening for a T2 diet only, you will not die from one meal!

I do not expect any member of staff to understand my diabetes and what I personally set my lifestyle to, why would they? You only have to look on this forum to see that it takes a while for anyone to grasp what carbs are and what they do to your blood sugar and that’s from people who have a vested interest. Also every single one of us that have diabetes of any type eat differently, some keto, some low carb, some moderate carb, some count carbs and use insulin ratios - (something I have no knowledge of, which proves my point)

There is no point in trying to educate and pontificate to hospitality staff about diabetes when you’re in their establishments, all you are doing is educating them about how YOU do it. We complain when people assume we can or can’t eat something but the person assuming is only going on a very thin knowledge gained from anecdotes from other customers.

But I don’t think that’s what most of us are advocating though.

Although a carb count would be more helpful than the somewhat pointless calorie count they are now made to do I don’t expect that. We don’t generally expect or need them to understand type 2 eating styles.

We do expect a little understanding and flexibility with the items they already have on the menu when asked for swaps. Or to be able to tell us the ingredients used in a dish (there are other allergies not contained in the required listing to be considered there too).

And to be fair I’ve not had any refuse a request, especially once they know it’s medical (I can’t eat bread, rice, pasta or potatoes, no not even gluten free versions) rather than fussy/purely preference. I do reassure them it’s not an allergy though and will explain why if they are interested or ask.

It’s an absolute bonus if they at least appreciate not everyone eat carbs the same way as not everyone eats meat. Not at all difficult really and some even offer it on their menus (Naked burgers/in a leaf, swap chips for salad or veg etc)