Adventures in Sourdough

[Paul_]

Thanks, Paul. It seemed a bit scary to me. After my normal food of steak, salmon and chicken, with mushrooms and green veg, the graphs hardly went up, so I was very surprised to see such a spike. I'm still quite new to the diabetes club, and even newer to the CGM club. I still have things to learn.

You and me both! From the graph though, my amateur interpretation of the graph data would be that you stayed 8 or under the entire time, were back to within roughly 1-2 mmol of your starting BG after around 2 hours, then were back to your starting BG or below after around 3 hours. While the rise from approx 4 to 8 would qualify as a spike in my book at least, if my interpretation is in the ball park then your body's response was reasonably good.

Could be reading it wrong, hopefully one of those more experienced with CGM graphs will correct me if I am.

 

[DEBBIESCOTT]

I don’t have it often but it’s lovely toasted with butter, marmite, sliced avocado & poached eggs, may sound weird but it’s really not

 

[Dancing Badger]

I was a bit too adventurous with bread yesterday; the owners of the marina where we keep our boat occasionally hold "socials" for berth holders. Coffee and toasted sandwiches were on offer; it would have been rude to refuse...

Two hours after a cheese, ham and pesto toastie with two thick slices of delicious white bread accompanied by an Americano my BG was 9.5 - a rise of roughly 3.5 for me. Not good.

 

[JenniferM55]

That's it, no more adventures with sourdough bread for me. I'm done with it all! (BTW date and time are not set up on my meter). This was taken about 2 hours after eating the bread, now it's 4 hours and I'm still 8. The bread I ate was fresh this morning, the slice I ate yesterday had been frozen and toasted and that didn't put me above 7. But I want no more of it....

 

[KennyA]

My sugars have been quite good lately, so I bought home house Sourdough from the local bakery today (it wasn't cheap!) and had a couple of slices earlier smothered in real butter. I enjoyed it, but I don't think my Libre did. I actually had to go for a lie down afterwards. I've frozen the rest of the loaf, but how can I minimize the spike? It was gorgeous.

View attachment 64233

That looks OK to me. Ate the bread about 2.30 and by 4.30 (+2hrs) you seem to be back to where you started. Of course you BG went up - you ate carbs, that is what happens. I wouldn't class it as a "spike". But what also happened is that your BG came back down quickly, so it looks like a decent insulin response, with maybe a little bit of overshoot...?

CGMs are great for this - I've had a similar response to a latte - 5 and a bit to 9 something in 20 mins, back to 5 and a bit by one hour. You might want to do a bit of googling and look for CGM graphs for non-diabetic people - there's quite a number around these days and it's interesting to see what "normal" carb etc responses look like.

So - if that was me getting that graph - that bread would be something I'd have as a bit of a treat every so often. The risk of course is that it slips from two slices to four, and to four times a day, and suddenly you're in the eights most of the time. If you can avoid that, you might be on to something.

 

[Antje77]

And much better than a chunky Kit Kat, which would have been my treat of choice a while back. I still have one left in my treat cupboard, which will stay there.

My treat of choice used to be cheese and onion crisps. Preferably in bed as a midnight snack.
Telling myself I cannot have this anymore would make me very angry and unhappy with diabetes, So instead I told myself I can have them whenever the time is right, and I really want to eat half a family bag of crisps, mucking up my BG for the rest of the day and night.

And I bought a large bag of crisps some 5 or 6 years ago for when that day would come.
About once a year, I give the old bag away and buy a new one, you don't want old crisps whe you're finally going to eat them after years of looking forward to it, right!

 

[IanBish]

That's it, no more adventures with sourdough bread for me. I'm done with it all! (BTW date and time are not set up on my meter). This was taken about 2 hours after eating the bread, now it's 4 hours and I'm still 8. The bread I ate was fresh this morning, the slice I ate yesterday had been frozen and toasted and that didn't put me above 7. But I want no more of it....

Sorry for the inadvertent suggestion.

That looks OK to me. Ate the bread about 2.30 and by 4.30 (+2hrs) you seem to be back to where you started. Of course you BG went up - you ate carbs, that is what happens. I wouldn't class it as a "spike". But what also happened is that your BG came back down quickly, so it looks like a decent insulin response, with maybe a little bit of overshoot...?

CGMs are great for this - I've had a similar response to a latte - 5 and a bit to 9 something in 20 mins, back to 5 and a bit by one hour. You might want to do a bit of googling and look for CGM graphs for non-diabetic people - there's quite a number around these days and it's interesting to see what "normal" carb etc responses look like.

So - if that was me getting that graph - that bread would be something I'd have as a bit of a treat every so often. The risk of course is that it slips from two slices to four, and to four times a day, and suddenly you're in the eights most of the time. If you can avoid that, you might be on to something.

Thanks, Kenny. I've gone from looking at the before and after tests, to noticing the big peaks. I did have a quick look at non-diabetic CGM graphs, but didn't see any in mmol/L (I'll have to get that converter up).

But thanks to you and some others for allaying my "fears". I'm still not going to try that remaining chunky Kit Kat, mind!

 

[Antje77]

I did have a quick look at non-diabetic CGM graphs, but didn't see any in mmol/L (I'll have to get that converter up).

 

[IanBish]

Thank you, @Antje77 - much appreciated.

 

[plantae]

Thanks, Kenny. I've gone from looking at the before and after tests, to noticing the big peaks.

I'd better not show you any of my graphs

 

[IanBish]

I'd better not show you any of my graphs

Please do.

 

[MrsA2]

Please do.

Plantae is a type 1, a very different condition

 

[IanBish]

Plantae is a type 1, a very different condition

Sorry, I didn't notice. I do like graphs, though.

 

[plantae]

Sorry, I didn't notice. I do like graphs, though.

I like graphs as well and don't have any problem with sharing them

My suggestion of more butter (can you ever have too much butter?) is still applicable though despite my type (I can cite numerous studies)

 

[MommaE]

My treat of choice used to be cheese and onion crisps. Preferably in bed as a midnight snack.
Telling myself I cannot have this anymore would make me very angry and unhappy with diabetes, So instead I told myself I can have them whenever the time is right, and I really want to eat half a family bag of crisps, mucking up my BG for the rest of the day and night.

And I bought a large bag of crisps some 5 or 6 years ago for when that day would come.
About once a year, I give the old bag away and buy a new one, you don't want old crisps whe you're finally going to eat them after years of looking forward to it, right!

Reminds me of my mom who kept a packet of cigarettes in her purse. She said it was there to make her believe that she had chosen to stop smoking years ago and not merely run out of cigarettes.

 

[Deleted member 527103]

Just enjoyed a couple of thinly sliced sourdough toasts with beetroot and yoghurt "dip" (I use it more as a spread) for lunch.
The dip used up the last of some creme fraiche and a couple of the beetroot from my veg box along with a finely chopped homegrown chilli for a bit of heat.
The bread came from the freezer because I always bake two loaves at a time. When they take a couple of days to prove I would rather make a bigger batch of dough.

 

[IanBish]

Well, I did another experiment earlier, minus the CGM. I had a bacon sourdough sarnie (two slices of bread) and it wasn't good. My BG was 5.2 and two hours after eating it was 9.0! I did have a shaved scotch egg too (I know). It was lovely, but I did feel quite tired afterwards.

Anyway, I have another graph, this time from my (free trial) CKM, rather than a CGM. It shows I was in mild ketosis for a while this morning, then after my carby lunch, definitely not in ketosis. My ketones have increased a bit since, but I'm still not burning fat. So I thought sod it, and I'm shortly going to have a mushroom foo yung and a small egg fried rice. I'll get the carbs out of the way today, and try to discover why those ketones have been so elusive.

 

[lovinglife]

Step away from those scotch eggs! I know you know, so use that knowledge- I know it’s hard but it’s the stark truth - have a high meat sausage and a hard boiled egg instead, about the same amount of effort as shaving your scotch egg

 

[IanBish]

Step away from those scotch eggs! I know you know, so use that knowledge- I know it’s hard but it’s the stark truth - have a high meat sausage and a hard boiled egg instead, about the same amount of effort as shaving your scotch egg

I know, I know. I promise I'll try. But I wish the sourdough was kinder to me.

 

[MrsA2]

So I thought sod it, and I'm shortly going to have a mushroom foo yung and a small egg fried rice. I'll get the carbs out of the way today, and try to discover why those ketones have been so elusive.

Knowing what to eat for our own health is relatively easy ( specially so once you found this forum) It's the why we eat that can take longer to crack. I'm still working at the why and when 3 years in. I'm particularly good at "self sabotage" but it's getting easier to stop it.

You might find these resources help

Dr Jen Unwin is the psychologist wife of Dr David Unwin, the UK NHS low carb champion. She had a book and a website called "Fork in the Road" which aim to help understand why we eat, and especially why we eat the wrong things when we know better.

Home | Fork in the Road | Guide to Low Carb Eating

Welcome to Fork in the Road! A website dedicated to sharing resources and tips on low carb eating. Helping people recover from Sugar Addiction

forkintheroad.co.uk

And these 2 Australian lady doctors do blogs and podcasts to help people break old patterns and adopt new low carb ones. (They often do courses but I've never done one or spent a single penny, lots of their stuff is free)

Real Health and Weight Loss Podcast

Welcome to the Real Health and Weight Loss Podcast where you get Real advice from Real Doctors to help you lose weight and revolutionise your health not just now but permanently. You can change your future, starting now. Imagine if everything you had been told about weight loss was wrong.

www.rlmedicine.com

I find both the above (amongst others) informative and helpful. I hope you do too.