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Question. Is it inevitable that Type2 will have to go on Insulin???

No. But parts of the medical profession might believe that, because there's a good chance if T2s follow the Eatwell plate advice and eat carbs with every meal, and almost inevitable if they just carry on as usual thinking the medication will sort it.
 
...I've had type 2 for fifteen, coming up to sixteen years, diet and SR metformin the last two, just diet the thirteen before that....and I was on the eatwell plate for years after I was diagnosed as I didn't know any different, now low carbish the last few months since I discovered this forum, my readings are coming down and I'm hoping to go back to diet only so its not one cap fits all...
 
My grandad was diagnosed in his early seventies and is now 94 - he lost a bit if weight and takes a tablet of some sort( not Metformin) but eats carbs with every meal and doesn't test regularly but no one has stuck him on insulin.
 
jack412 said:
The stats are 50% will be on insulin within 6-10 years
If you live long enough, the odds are you will be on insulin eventually
more important is complications from not keeping A1c under 7 or less before moving up the diet drug ladder
http://m.australianprescriber.com/magazine/27/4/93/6/
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Thanks Jack, this stat is just the incentive/threat I need to try harder to control my diabetes.:)
 
....Also I just wanted to add [ I won't edit my last post in case its quoted] that I work in a very large office so I know quite a few people with Type 2 of varying lengths of time and not one of us is on insulin...
 
zand said:
Thanks Jack, this stat is just the incentive/threat I need to try harder to control my diabetes.:)
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You and me both, I have had 2 carb meals in 6 mths and it was 2 too many
Through LCHF and metformin I have got my A1c to 5.6, but if it gets to 6.5 I will take more drugs or insulin if needed
 
The odds are that the majority of people currently with T2 will end up on insulin.

However that does assume that the 80% who were overweight or obese on diagnosis do nothing major to address their weight issue, and follow the classic degenerative route where they have overloaded their pancreas and leave it to struggle and expire instead of trying to save it.

There are people here who report complete reversal after significant weight loss, and presumably they are no longer classed as diabetic and so don't appear in the statistics.

So I suspect that if you manage to get your weight down to a level where your symptoms are minimised or disappear (which may be a scarily low weight) then you stand a good chance of avoiding having to take insulin.

Finally, I am sure that T1s will tell you that you can live a good life long term when taking insulin - although I have yet to convince myself that it is worth going onto insulin to enjoy just one more chip butty ;-)

Cheers

LGC
 
Pollylocks said:
...I've had type 2 for fifteen, coming up to sixteen years, diet and SR metformin the last two, just diet the thirteen before that....and I was on the eatwell plate for years after I was diagnosed as I didn't know any different, now low carbish the last few months since I discovered this forum, my readings are coming down and I'm hoping to go back to diet only so its not one cap fits all...
Click to expand...

Can I ask why you had to go on to Metformin after so long with just diet control? Obviously your readings must have gone up but I was just curious what you had been doing differently from the previous years.
 
LittleGreyCat said:
The odds are that the majority of people currently with T2 will end up on insulin.

However that does assume that the 80% who were overweight or obese on diagnosis do nothing major to address their weight issue, and follow the classic degenerative route where they have overloaded their pancreas and leave it to struggle and expire instead of trying to save it.

There are people here who report complete reversal after significant weight loss, and presumably they are no longer classed as diabetic and so don't appear in the statistics.

So I suspect that if you manage to get your weight down to a level where your symptoms are minimised or disappear (which may be a scarily low weight) then you stand a good chance of avoiding having to take insulin.

Finally, I am sure that T1s will tell you that you can live a good life long term when taking insulin - although I have yet to convince myself that it is worth going onto insulin to enjoy just one more chip butty ;-)

Cheers

LGC
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I think I agree with everything you've said.

But when I read comments like this 'So I suspect that if you manage to get your weight down to a level where your symptoms are minimised or disappear (which may be a scarily low weight) then you stand a good chance of avoiding having to take insulin'

Such comments always make me wonder about the slim type 2s. I think they are about 20% of type 2s (though I can't remember where I got that figure from).

They are often less diagnosed, because a lot of doctors are expecting late onset D to come with a spare tyre. So I assume that they have often been running for quite some time with raised BG levels and may have developed complications. And may have insulin looming earlier, as a result.

Is the assumption that even slim type 2s need to lower their bmi, to get rid of organ fat? Or are type 2s who are already slim diabetic for different reasons and skinnifying will never get the result? Maybe some slim type2s will chip in with their experiences.

I'm not aiming these questions at you @LittleGreyCat , it is just that your post prompted me to ask the question I've been wondering for a while...
 
cold ethyl said:
Can I ask why you had to go on to Metformin after so long with just diet control? Obviously your readings must have gone up but I was just curious what you had been doing differently from the previous years.
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...I don't know @cold ethyl , I wasn't eating any differently...I've always been told its a progressive disease so I just assumed it had actually progressed and thats why I needed the metformin as my HbA1c had gone up to 7.1....my HbA1c was 16 at original diagnosis, no diabetes in my family on either side...I used to drink a litre of coca cola a day before my original diagnosis [not the sugar free type!] and thats all I can put it down to..
 
Pollylocks said:
...I don't know @cold ethyl , I wasn't eating any differently...I've always been told its a progressive disease so I just assumed it had actually progressed and thats why I needed the metformin as my HbA1c had gone up to 7.1....my HbA1c was 16 at original diagnosis, no diabetes in my family on either side...I used to drink a litre of coca cola a day before my original diagnosis [not the sugar free type!] and thats all I can put it down to..
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I suppose if you were eating the healthy plate if carbs it was inevitable that eventually your body would give up. Good luck with getting your numbers back down and getting off the meds if that's your goal. I have been told I will be on them forever now as they are protective. Nice GP but very into preventative medication!
 
Thank you. Ive just read the thread and found the information fascinating and informative. I have two weeks before I go back to the DB. I want another blood test before I go to metformin twice a day instead of once. I want to see if my low carb diet hs begun to make a difference.:)
 
Brunneria said:
I think I agree with everything you've said.

But when I read comments like this 'So I suspect that if you manage to get your weight down to a level where your symptoms are minimised or disappear (which may be a scarily low weight) then you stand a good chance of avoiding having to take insulin'

Such comments always make me wonder about the slim type 2s. I think they are about 20% of type 2s (though I can't remember where I got that figure from).

They are often less diagnosed, because a lot of doctors are expecting late onset D to come with a spare tyre. So I assume that they have often been running for quite some time with raised BG levels and may have developed complications. And may have insulin looming earlier, as a result.

Is the assumption that even slim type 2s need to lower their bmi, to get rid of organ fat? Or are type 2s who are already slim diabetic for different reasons and skinnifying will never get the result? Maybe some slim type2s will chip in with their experiences.

I'm not aiming these questions at you @LittleGreyCat , it is just that your post prompted me to ask the question I've been wondering for a while...
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I suspect that the majority of overweight T2s will never go onto insulin if they low-carb and hence reduce their weight. The 15%-20% of 'slim' T2s are most likely to be Late onset T1 and will need to go onto insulin one day. In summary those T2s with insulin resistance can probably avoid insulin if they can take control and obviously avoid the Eat-well Plate and other 'helpful' advice from the 'experts'
 
mo53 said:
Thank you. Ive just read the thread and found the information fascinating and informative. I have two weeks before I go back to the DB. I want another blood test before I go to metformin twice a day instead of once. I want to see if my low carb diet hs begun to make a difference.:)
Click to expand...
what are your before breakfast numbers
If less than 5.5 then you don't need more metformin
The met does several worth while things and is worth googling
 
Brunneria said:
I think I agree with everything you've said.

But when I read comments like this 'So I suspect that if you manage to get your weight down to a level where your symptoms are minimised or disappear (which may be a scarily low weight) then you stand a good chance of avoiding having to take insulin'

Such comments always make me wonder about the slim type 2s. I think they are about 20% of type 2s (though I can't remember where I got that figure from).

They are often less diagnosed, because a lot of doctors are expecting late onset D to come with a spare tyre. So I assume that they have often been running for quite some time with raised BG levels and may have developed complications. And may have insulin looming earlier, as a result.

Is the assumption that even slim type 2s need to lower their bmi, to get rid of organ fat? Or are type 2s who are already slim diabetic for different reasons and skinnifying will never get the result? Maybe some slim type2s will chip in with their experiences.

I'm not aiming these questions at you @LittleGreyCat , it is just that your post prompted me to ask the question I've been wondering for a while...
Click to expand...

In fact this does apply to me.

I was overweight when diagnosed - a rapid weight loss from 14.5 stone to 14 stone (shudder) triggered the blood test and diagnosis.

I quite quickly reduced my weight to 13.5 stone (well, just over 'good' BMI but I have large bones) and cleared the scary high BG but still definitely diabetic.

Trimmed down to 13 stone and considered myself one of the unlucky normal weight diabetics with nowhere to go.
I found myself resenting the obese T2s who could drop a few stone and reverse diabetes.

Having read various papers coming out of the Newcastle Study I realised that midpoint of normal BMI was a better target and perhaps 'slim' T2s did have an option.

I am now down to 11 stone 12 pounds which for 6' tall is still not mid point BMI but my BG has gone from diabetic to pre-diabetic over the last 3 months.

I am having a bit of a battle but I intend to get down below 11 stone 7 lbs and see what my HbA1c is then.

So I am a slim Type 2 and I know all about scarily low weights.
Getting there - I weighed 11 stone 7 lbs when I was 16.
I do wonder if a general target should be to weigh the same at 60 as you did at 16.

So - my personal view is that T2s should aim to be at or below the mid point of 'normal' BMI which is probably a scary number for most people who think they are a 'normal' weight.

Body image is a very strange thing.
I thought I was quite slim at 13 stone.
My family started to worry about me when I got down to 12 stone 7 lbs - thought I had gone far enough.
Now at 11 stone 12 lbs I realise that I am not a stick insect but am still carrying quite a bit of fat.
I am aware that anorexia is a thin person looking in the mirror and seeing a fat person, but hopefully I will know when to stop!

Cheers

LGC
 
So is there hope for a T2 who has reduced BMI from 31 to 23 since diagnosis but still in pre-diabetic range with no more weight to lose? This is me, and am I likely to stall as far as BS goes?
 
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