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LCHF Diet Newbie - High Blood Sugars

Yes, I agree about veg.
When I was first diagnosed I was given a set amount of carbs for each meal (never to be deviated from!) and told to count every single one of them including veg. I later learnt how to shade the amounts I need so for example so I actually may give a bit more than the true carb count for roasted veg. I don't eat a low carb diet but a large amount of my carb intake actually come from vegetables (not really a high carb diet either one in terms of grams of carb, but I'm 'old' and female so unfortunately don't require many calories )
 
fittaedae said:
Hi Jack,

Thanks for that. I have my DAFNE course workbook still but its probably out of date now and its been a few years since I did the course, work were being a pain about me taking time off to do a refresher. I have a lot of reading and testing to do. Thank you :)
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What you learnt on DAFNE (insulin-to-carb ratio) will go out of the window when you LCHF fittaedae, I would start with some basal testing first then work out how much insulin you need for the meals you eat, it's really trial & error but you should get their in the end.
 
fittaedae said:
@Heathenlass Thank you! I'm away to download that app right now... maybe just what I have been looking for :)
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You are welcome :)
I first bought "Carbs and Cals " (the book) but it was next to useless for the type of food I eat (I cook almost everything from scratch through necessity :confused:) The app is great, because I only have to input a recipe once, then can calculate the carbs with a few taps which is a huge time and faff saver :D

Signy
 
Just downloaded it and it looks perfect!

I too cook everything from scratch as I enjoy cooking and dont trust these strange additives and extras they add to tins and jars of food, dabbling a bit with Paleo too so if its been processed dont eat it they say!

@noblehead that's what I was trying to suss out, Doctor and Hospital just throw their hands up in horror and ask "oh you need to see the dietician" Whom I know is gonna order me to eat baked potatoes, pasta, wholemeal bread and rice as the biggest percentage of my food intake.... "Oh and watch the fat", then they tell you on the DAFNE course not to eat anything Low Fat or Fat Free as they add extra sugar and salt into it... crazy! :wideyed::joyful:
 
fittaedae said:
@noblehead that's what I was trying to suss out, Doctor and Hospital just throw their hands up in horror and ask "oh you need to see the dietician" Whom I know is gonna order me to eat baked potatoes, pasta, wholemeal bread and rice as the biggest percentage of my food intake.... "Oh and watch the fat", then they tell you on the DAFNE course not to eat anything Low Fat or Fat Free as they add extra sugar and salt into it... crazy! :wideyed::joyful:
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The HCP's won't advise a LCHF diet and see carbs as an important part of a healthy well balanced diet, whether that is right or wrong is debatable, but at the end of the day it's your life and your diabetes and if you want to go down the LCHF route then that is your choice.

Personally I sit somewhere in the middle, eating carbs in moderation.......:)
 
@fittaedae wait till they start talking about delayed bolus or split bolus because the protein and fat digest slower than the carb.
the pump TAG'ers have it to a fine art

off topic and not for this thread but...it wouldn't be as simple as this, the old insulins may have other problems...
I haven't seen it said, but I wonder if the older slower bolus insulins would be better for LCHF than the new ultra quick acting short duration insulins for high carb diets?
 
Hi. In one of your posts you said that your Bolus 'was set by the hospital? How can that be if you are carb counting? Can you clarify what you do with your Bolus?
 
jack412 said:
@fittaedae wait till they start talking about delayed bolus or split bolus because the protein and fat digest slower than the carb.
the pump TAG'ers have it to a fine art

off topic and not for this thread but...it wouldn't be as simple as this, the old insulins may have other problems...
I haven't seen it said, but I wonder if the older slower bolus insulins would be better for LCHF than the new ultra quick acting short duration insulins for high carb diets?
Click to expand...
My endo's face when I ask him for porcine insulin to suit my LCHF diet :eek:
 
robert72 said:
My endo's face when I ask him for porcine insulin to suit my LCHF diet :eek:
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I had to google it, did he send you to the vet? :)
http://www.fda.gov/downloads/animalveterinary/products/approvedanimaldrugproducts/foiadrugsummaries/ucm118049.pdf
FREEDOM OF INFORMATION SUMMARY. SUPPLEMENTAL NEW ANIMAL DRUG APPLICATION. NADA 141-236. VETSULIN. Porcine insulin zinc suspension.

I saw the old insulin charts with the new insulin overlade saying how much better they were because of the fast acting and didn't last too long, the opposite thing you want for the 'diabetes pizza effect'
 
jack412 said:
I had to google it, did he send you to the vet? :)
http://www.fda.gov/downloads/animalveterinary/products/approvedanimaldrugproducts/foiadrugsummaries/ucm118049.pdf
FREEDOM OF INFORMATION SUMMARY. SUPPLEMENTAL NEW ANIMAL DRUG APPLICATION. NADA 141-236. VETSULIN. Porcine insulin zinc suspension.

I saw the old insulin charts with the new insulin overlade saying how much better they were because of the fast acting and didn't last too long, the opposite thing you want for the 'diabetes pizza effect'
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I used porcine insulin from 1972 to 1988 because we only had that or bovine insulin in the old days.
 
jack412 said:
@fittaedae wait till they start talking about delayed bolus or split bolus because the protein and fat digest slower than the carb.
the pump TAG'ers have it to a fine art

off topic and not for this thread but...it wouldn't be as simple as this, the old insulins may have other problems...
I haven't seen it said, but I wonder if the older slower bolus insulins would be better for LCHF than the new ultra quick acting short duration insulins for high carb diets?
Click to expand...

In my experience, yes they do :) Slightly longer in the system, with a peak later than the newer ones, they seem to fit in much better with LCHF. The peak of the newer ones seems to miss the peak of what is eaten. At least , it works that way for me. Novorapid just didn't seem to fit the profile

Signy
I
 
Just a wee update... I had chicken breaded with pork rinds and a tiny sweet potato and baby leaf salad for supper last night so I added up all the carbs and the protein and took rapid insulin for 50% of the protein over 20g and took to cover my carbs, bit scary as it seemed too much. But I tested my blood before I went to bed and it was 8.7 (first time in ages been into single figures!!) I went to bed set my alarm but either it did not go off or I slept through it :banghead:
...but when I woke this morning and tested its 6.7.... I am totally amazed! I am going to do some more reading on this and get it right in my head.

Just want to say a big thanks to you all yesterday, you made a very confused and worried T1 a awful lot happier! Probably need to take one of the extra units that I added on at teatime off now.... will give it a bash anyway! :):happy:
 
fittaedae said:
Hello,

I'm a Type 1 Diabetic have been for 38 years.

I have recently started doing the Low Carb High Fat regime, but I am constantly getting High Blood sugars!

I asked my diabetes team who were horrified that I'm cutting back on carbs and instructed me to eat more carbs... My GP is not a fan of LCHF either and the Diabetes Specialist Nurse at my doctors practice is always off ill!

I tried upping my background insulin to no avail, I am concerned that I may be causing myself damage, I cannot understand if i'm not eating carbs then why are my sugars rising.... no hypos, rarely get single figure resuts since I started this.

Any advice would be appreciated..

Currently taking 10 units Lantus in morning and 14 Units of Lantus at 8pm, then Humalog as and when needed if I eat carbs. I have done DAFNE, and it changed my life for the better, but cannot understand what is happening right now!
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I have done a lot of research into this as I was having the same problem. It drove me insane. Your brain needs glucose for the first few weeks of low carb so until it adapts to using more ketones it breaks down protein for glucose. This iscalled gluconeogenesis and I have to say it's a *****. What I do is take 2/3 of the total amount of protein to also make up for tiny bit of carbs available in the food. So 30g= 2 units (this also depends on your insulin carb ratio) . I take it over a dual wave with half going in straight away and the other half going in at half a unit per hour. It may be completely different for you, but you have to see what works.
This happens a lot more in the beginning and eventually tales off when your body adapts. Best of luck.
 
fittaedae said:
Just a wee update... I had chicken breaded with pork rinds and a tiny sweet potato and baby leaf salad for supper last night so I added up all the carbs and the protein and took rapid insulin for 50% of the protein over 20g and took to cover my carbs, bit scary as it seemed too much. But I tested my blood before I went to bed and it was 8.7 (first time in ages been into single figures!!) I went to bed set my alarm but either it did not go off or I slept through it :banghead:
...but when I woke this morning and tested its 6.7.... I am totally amazed! I am going to do some more reading on this and get it right in my head.

Just want to say a big thanks to you all yesterday, you made a very confused and worried T1 a awful lot happier! Probably need to take one of the extra units that I added on at teatime off now.... will give it a bash anyway! :):happy:
Click to expand...


Good result and your certainly getting there, ask your DSN for a half-unit pen, it can make a big difference in fine-tuning bg levels.
 
@noblehead My thoughts exactly. Have asked for before but I am going to ask again for a half-unit pen... just have to have a good excuse without mentioning LCHF or I have no chance! ;)
 
Hi @fittadae

Could you clarify if you are carb counting, and what your carb target is for LCHF please?

I would not expect you need to dose for protein unless your carb target is "very low", well under 100 gCH per day. Everyone is different with protein ratios. Even well under 100 gCH/day, if I bolus 2/3 protein as carbs or even 1/2 protein as carbs, I go hypo. For me I dose 1/3 of the grams of protein as grams of carbs (gCH), and I use a delayed bolus (aka "wave") on my pump. When I was on MDI, I would inject slower acting insulin for the protein. And half unit pens were essential, for carbs as well as protein.

I would guess a bigger problem might be DAFNE. As @noblehead and @Heathenlass noted, DAFNE and LCHF don't mix. You have to count all carbs (and possibly protein); there is no more "ignore this". Ignore nothing. This in turn will probably *decrease* your real carb ratio, so watch that closely. Since people on DAFNE are ignoring a proportion of their carbs, most people on DAFNE have their carb ratio (or their basal) set too high.

Your stress will be a major factor and it was a good suggestion by @jack412 to consider sticking with your previous diet until the stress has subsided. Ideally that is what you should do. But I do appreciate that LCHF has solved some other health issues for you, and you may want to use these 3 precious weeks off to make important changes. We can't always work to the ideal scenario.

I posted some other stuff on another thread, so I will just link that.
 
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