Anyone else planning on trying Thiosulphate supplement after research published in nature last week?

[KevinPotts]

Can you give us links for the debunking?

Yes lndy51, I'd also be interested to see a few just to euip myself. Thanks Oldvatr


Diagnosed 13/4/16: T2, no meds, HbA1c 53, FBG 12.6, Trigs 3.6, HDL .75, LDL 4.0, BP 169/95, BPM 85, 13st 8lbs, waist 34" (2012 - 17st 7lbs, w 42").

16/6/16: FBG AV 4.6, Trigs 1.5, HDL 2.0, LDL 3.0, BP 112/68, BPM 6O, 11st 5lbs, waist 30", PWV 7.0. Lifelong migraines and hay fever gone.

Regime: 20g LCHF, run 1 mile daily, weekly fasting, occasionally longer fasts.

 

[Oldvatr]

Can you give us links for the debunking?

Wikipedia is a good start. Stephanie is a Computer specialist working for MIT labs, the home of Ancel Keyes, and she did not get her biology degree (she dropped out). Her doctorate is for computer and AI work only and is irrelevant to her publications in biology. .She is the one advocating we should spend hours out in the sun WITHOUT SUN BLOCKERS to get the D3 that we need - although theoretically correct, this advice is not a good idea. She does not give the associated warnings necessary.

Most references to cholesterol sulphate track back to her or members of the MIT team, so it is clear that this is research that originated from her lab, and is not covered by mainstream endocrinologists. This is the basis for this thread, so is relevant. Having read her paper on D3, it is clear that she is using pseudo science, and it is mainly conjecture. This is why I am posting here as a warning not to believe everything that is written in journals such as Nature, since this is not the only time they have published rubbish. Her colleague Dr Mercola is also widely regarded as a quack.

Apparently if you google <<Stephanie Seneff quack>> you get access to pages and pages of counter arguments. I have not read or verified any of them, since I have already reached this conclusion independently by reading her paper on D3.

 

[Indy51]

Thanks for the info, though a Google search of almost any American doctor/researcher with the word "quack" attached isn't particularly convincing to me - there are so many people out in internet land with an axe to grind. I imagine Monsanto have quite a few people in their pockets spreading the word that Seneff is a quack considering what she's had to say about glyphosate

 

[Oldvatr]

Thanks for the info, though a Google search of almost any American doctor/researcher with the word "quack" attached isn't particularly convincing to me - there are so many people out in internet land with an axe to grind. I imagine Monsanto have quite a few people in their pockets spreading the word that Seneff is a quack considering what she's had to say about glyphosate

I have no interest in following this particular bandwagon. Her latest paper on statins causing autism and Alzheimers is also receiving some criticism, but I have not read it so cannot comment myself.

If you google cholesterol sulfate or sulphate, then you will find less than a page on it, and most links stem back to Stephanie, or Mercola or MIT in some way. This substance is essential to her latest research papers, and it is clearly invented by Stephanie. The substance does not really exist. Actually it does exist, but it is only as a result of bad oxidation with a sulphite or sulphate, and is excreted in the bile, so is not the basis of D3 metabolites as she claims. So taking thiosulphate will probably increase this expulsion, increase bad oxidation of the cholymicrons, as well as emitting sulpherous gas products. How appropriate for a quack remedy. I rest my case. This science stinks.

 

[Oldvatr]

Thanks for the info, though a Google search of almost any American doctor/researcher with the word "quack" attached isn't particularly convincing to me - there are so many people out in internet land with an axe to grind. I imagine Monsanto have quite a few people in their pockets spreading the word that Seneff is a quack considering what she's had to say about glyphosate

Roundup is still sold in the UK. It is not classed as an organophosate (which have been banned in EU) and does not have restrictions, and is available from Amazon et al. It is manufactured by Monsanto. There are other manufacturers for glyphosate products, presumably under licence from Monsanto. Stephanie lost that battle.

 

[Indy51]

Roundup is still sold in the UK. It is not classed as an organophosate (which have been banned in EU) and does not have restrictions, and is available from Amazon et al.

Should be interesting to see what develops now that WHO has declared glyphosate "probably carcinogenic for humans".

 

[Oldvatr]

Should be interesting to see what develops now that WHO has declared glyphosate "probably carcinogenic for humans".

Updated Telegraph article folowing EU meeting on relicencing of Roundup.
https://www.theguardian.com/environ...ikely-to-pose-risk-to-humans-unwho-study-says

 

[Indy51]

Updated Telegraph article folowing EU meeting on relicencing of Roundup.
https://www.theguardian.com/environ...ikely-to-pose-risk-to-humans-unwho-study-says

Thanks for the link.

Reassuring for people who eat glyphosate residue from food, I guess. Maybe not so reassuring for agricultural workers.

 

[Oldvatr]

Thanks for the link.

Reassuring for people who eat glyphosate residue from food, I guess. Maybe not so reassuring for agricultural workers.

I agree that it is right that people like Stephanie and Mercola question how we make and use things in our lives. It is how they use pseudo science to support their arguments and offer antidote treatments that I have problems with.

We have a thread here suggesting that this latest research requires the ingestion of some rather noxious compounds, and although the OP is free to experiment on his own body, by publishing this in the forum, it opens the door to others to take up the baton and also run with it. So in a way I am doing what Stephanie does, and I am querying the science on which this thread is based, since it could place readers here into harm.

I had a quick look at the news article on the cyanide poisoning antidote for curing T2D, and when I saw thiosulfate being proposed, it rang warning bells. Having seen the D3 'research paper' from the same source, I have to say I am now convinced this path of action is one I cannot support.

Edit to add:
Just read a recent paper by Dr Mercola on T2D. His theory is that T2D is caused by staphylococcal infection, primarily by Staph2. Acccording to the dear doctor, it is caused by obese people emitting staph germs on their skin. His trials showed that fat people have large colonies of staph aurealis on their skin that sloughs off and covers all surfaces and this is why we have a diabetes epidemic. Oh Yeah We are all doomed!
Edit to add: Off Topic Warning. If anyone wants to follow up on Mercola, please start a new thread. I do not wish to pursue this line.

 

[Indy51]

@Oldvatr Agreed. I'd want a lot more research on human subjects with doses designed for humans and a reputable source for the drug/supplement before I'd be playing with it. Especially from a source made for aquarium use

 

[Jasperville]

Just to let you all know I have abandoned the Thiosulphate experiment after 3 days.................no obvious effect, good or bad.

Apologies to those of you who feel I have drawn too much attention to what you see as bad research.

I will not post in this thread again, so it will drop out of sight after a while.

Thanks for what I believe was genuine concern for my well-being.

Apart from the extra head, everything seems normal.

 

[Oldvatr]

Just to let you all know I have abandoned the Thiosulphate experiment after 3 days.................no obvious effect, good or bad.

Apologies to those of you who feel I have drawn too much attention to what you see as bad research.

I will not post in this thread again, so it will drop out of sight after a while.

Thanks for what I believe was genuine concern for my well-being.

Apart from the extra head, everything seems normal.

It was worth airing and if others stunble upon it, then we have the info here for them to make infomed decisions. Thank you for joining in and sharing your logic behind it.
Maybe in time this topic will be reviewed anew and maybe some controlled research is performed to provide the formal evidence required to give a treatment for T2D. I am not holding my breath.