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BG levels have dropped to normal?

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white43

Well-Known Member
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45
Location
Dorset
Hi All.

Sorry, this is longwinded - but I'd like anyone to comment on whether this is good, bad, weird or anything......

On the 30th April, I had a BG of 17.9mmol - this was the first ever test I'd had(and fasting as well). To put you in the picture, I eat ****(very high carb), I am 21 stone and I'm practically an alcoholic, I can guzzle down 2 bottles of wine and hardly blink - and until recently, this was very, very often.

I immediately was put on Metformin x2 and I started a lower carb diet. Two days later, I bought a blood monitor kit and was seeing an average of around 6-8mmol. I stopped drinking as well.

I saw a nurse for another blood test on the 5th. This time I'd had a greek yoghurt of 12g carb and some nuts for breakfast. This test was lunchtime. The result was 6.0mmol.

I didn't have any more test strips at this point. Anyway, on Thursday just gone(7th) I was naughty. I had a largish bag of popcorn at the cinema. Felt OK that night, but the next morning, I threw my guts up, had a headache and was tired. Called in sick to work and zonked out for four hours. I expected to have blown my BG levels sky high, but long story short, I got test strips and, no, they were about 4.4mmol. Which surprised me. I felt better later on. The Doc said that as my BG was now only six(! - yes, on that test Doc :roll: ), I should drop to one Metformin a day.

That evening I had a couple racks of ribs, which I didn't realise had a sugar-based glaze until after I'd eaten them - I went up to 7.0mmol, but no higher.

Fasting the next morning was 4.9mmol(10.30am). I had a couple fried eggs, two rashers of bacon and a slice of wholemeal toast - an hour later - 4.4, two hours later 5.3

Next morning(Sunday) - fasting 4.6mmol(10.30am). This time I had a bacon sandwich - two bits of wholemeal bread. One hour 7.0, two hours, 7.2mmol, three hours 5.8. Evening meal included two roast spuds and a stuffing ball. I couldn't test one hour after that, but I managed a two hour, which was 5.5mmol. Bedtime 5.9mmol. Didn't eat anything inbetween.

This morning, 5.7mmol(7am). I had a greek yoghurt, nuts for breakfast. Saving on strips so didn't test that, but for lunch - Tuna/Mayo, a boiled egg, some chicken tikka snacks, a satsuma and a peperami. I tested when I got home as I was curious and I'm still 5.7mmol.

My eyesight went blurry on Thurs and I had to buy new temp glasses twice my prescription, but that has also now returned to normal vision.

So, is this all normal? If anything, I'm worried my BG's are a little low, but they're all within acceptable limits aren't they? The only thing I do notice is that they are sometimes higher at the second hour, rather than the first, but by the third they're down. Is this because of higher fats?

Cheers
 
Hi white
Bg of 5, or below 6.
How wonderful,
I can only wish mine are alot higher than that! I tend to feel sick and headache and unwell when my bg drops below 5. When hits 3 then i panic!
So long as you are okay now! A bag of popcorn, Thing is we all have to learn what affects us wrong and right! Will you be eating popcorn again?
You will find different foods affect differently! I can't have mayo or salas cream go into 20's!
Someone soon will be along alot better in the know! I am only 5/6 weeks into all this!
Sandy
 
Hi white43, you are on the right road. As for low, you really don't need to worry unless you drop below about 3.5. And how's the weight doing?
 
Hi white43,

It sounds as if you've got the hang pretty quickly. Blurred vision is not unusual while your
body gets use to the big improvement in your sugar levels. As the meds, diet and exercise
work their magic, you may find you're better able to handle the occasional honey-glazed
spare rib without seeing double figures.

Your higher 2 hour reading may possibly be down to fat delaying the effects of any carb in
your meal.

Keep up the good work!

Regards,
timo.
 
And how's the weight doing?
Click to expand...

I lost a couple lb's in the first week. Maybe too many carbs... :roll:

But At the moment, I'm in the 'test, test, test' thing, where I want to see reactions to foods....
 
Tonight has been interesting.

I had what equated to 60g(dry) 'Batchelors mild curry savoury rice', with steak.

An hour before dinner I was 5.7mmol.

1 hour : 6.8mmol
2 hour : 6.3mmol
3 hour : 6.2mmol
Bedtime : 6.2mmol

I note that I effectively rose by 1, but am slow to come back down. Or am I?
 
Hi White43,

That's a surprisingly small rise - most people find their BS rockets after a rice dish. Maybe you are able to tolerate rice better than others. Most of us find that different foods affect us in different ways. In my case, for example, I can eat bread with very little damage, but pasta, cereals and rice send my BS sky high.
 
Dennis,

What would be considered a 'high rise'? Or a spike?

This morning - I'm at 6.5mmol(7.10am). Although I was up until 1am. Would that make a difference?
 
The amount of rise would depend entirely on how much carbohydrate you have eaten and it's GI value. On average a rise of up to 4mmol an hour after a meal is normal. Anything over that would indicate a level of carbs that is higher than is good for you. A "spike" is a sudden rise in BS caused by something that is very quick acting, like sugar or plain white rice (in most people). In fact it is possible that the rice you had acted very quickly and when you tested after an hour your BS was already on its way back down, so past it's peak.

The fact that you were a little higher this morning wouldn't be a consequence of how much sleep you had but is probably a degree of dawn phenomenon. This is a throwback to mankind's earliest days and is where your liver compensates for the fact that you have had no fuel during the night by creating glucose, so that you can wake up with all the energy needed to hunt for a sabre toothed tiger or a woolly mammoth! Unfortunately in type 2 diabetes the liver loses the ability to calculate how much is needed and can produce as much as 3 times the amount of glocose that it should do. This is one of the reasons why metformin is the standard treatment for type 2 diabetes - one of it's actions is to reduce the amount of glucose that the liver produces.
 
Not an expert to this by any means.. btu it sounds to me as if you could drop all medication and just control your BG by diet. What do your medics say? The drugs do an awful lot of things to your system that you may not want long term. If you can just change diet and control that way go for it!! :wink:
 
Hi Cynical,

I'm afraid I can't agree there. When you take a medication and have good BS control, it is the medication that is helping you to do that. Drop the medication and you could very soon end up back on high BS levels and increased insulin resistance. If your doc says try things without the medication then fine, but never assume that because you can see an improvement that you don't need to maintain the medication that enabled you to achieve that improvement.
 
There's also something else to consider that I haven't mentioned as I didn't think of it. From February 10th, I asked to be put on Campral - a medication to help for recovering alcoholics. A frequent side effect of this is vision changes. Less frequent effects are Hyperglycemia and Diabetes. I was taking this on and off for three months before I went to the Doctor.

8 days after taking it, I was at Vision Express having a new eye exam. I didn't put two and two together.

I was taking it up to a day before I went to the Doctor and it has a half life of 33 hours. You take 1998mg a day.

Since D Day(30th April), I've not touched it and ....my BG seems to be going down. Last weekend, I didn't take any Metformin, as I was a bit ill. So I've not really accumulated the Metformin in my system to be making radical changes as of yet - and as I understand it, it would reduce me by 1.5mmol at the most?(I think I read that here somewhere).

Yesterday, I did a sort of oral glucose test. I took 75g of glucose, to test resistance. I went from 5.6 to 11.1 in an hour. After two, I was at 9.5 and after 3, I was back to 5.6. Now, I know it wasn't taken in 'correct' circumstances, but surely this means something? I seem to be able to well tolerate bread, potatoes, rice and popcorn!

Something new I've noticed over a few days now.

My morning readings are generally 6.5mmol.

My late afternoon readings are 5.5mmol

Is it possible, that the Campral produced the symptoms over the last three months and maybe, just maybe I'm suffering from Impaired Fasting Glycemia? No-one here is a Doctor I know, but what do you think?
 
It certainly sounds feasible. You need to discuss it with your GP.
 
Sounds to me as if you've caught it relatively early, your pancreas is not yet too compromised and the reduction in IR has improved your responses.

I have virtually zero Phase 1 insulin so can spike easily, but slower acting things like pizza work better than expected because my Phase 2 is still fairly strong. Others may have an opposite response, if they have adequate Phase 1 and a Phase 2 that runs out early.
 
Trinkwasser said:
Sounds to me as if you've caught it relatively early, your pancreas is not yet too compromised and the reduction in IR has improved your responses.

I have virtually zero Phase 1 insulin so can spike easily, but slower acting things like pizza work better than expected because my Phase 2 is still fairly strong. Others may have an opposite response, if they have adequate Phase 1 and a Phase 2 that runs out early.
Click to expand...

Phase 1, Phase 2? :?: :mrgreen:

According to my Doc - a blood test that was taken last Nov showed normal BG levels....well, at least at that time they were. So if I'm correct, I've literally caught this at the start, which is why I think it's possible that the Campral was giving an exaggerated result and has either caused or revealed an Impaired Glucose Tolerance.
 
When you eat your pancreas produces insulin in two phases. When your stomach first detects food it releases enzymes into the blood that signal the pancreas to start producing insulin. It also stops the liver from creating glucose. This is called first phase production and builds up a small reserve of insulin so that as the food is digested the blood sugar can be dealt with immediately. Once BS levels start to rise the pancreas detects this and starts full-scale insulin production. This is second phase production. Second phase should continue until BS levels have returned to normal (i.e. what happens with non-diabetics and well controlled diabetics) or until the pancreas just can't produce any more and leaves you with a high BS level (i.e. what happens for most diabetics).
 
Thanks for this Dennis - had no idea.

What is considered 'high' and for how long?

Last night, in another 'test', I ate a pack of instant noodles - about 80g of carb and pretty high in fat. I started at 5.6mmol, after one hour went to 5.9, two hours went to 8mmol and stayed there. In the morning I was 5.7mmol. At least one source I've read would put this all in the realm of 'normal':

http://www.diabetes.co.uk/diabetes_care/Diabetes_and_blood_glucose.html
 
High would be anything above the 'normal' levels and for whatever period. If it's higher than normal then it is 'high.' The D.co.uk levels are at variance with the official published figures.

The 2009 NICE guideline Bg levels for a T2 are
Fasting( waking) ...............between 4 - 7 mmol/l.
2 hrs after a meal..............no more than 8.5 mmol/l.

Keep testing. You are getting good evidence all the time.
 
Pedantically, Phase 1 insulin is produced "on spec" and stored within the beta cells so they can push out a spike of insulin from storage before they start the generation from scratch. Then theoretically the storage granules are refilled ready for the next meal.

Equally pedantically, not a few diabetics have tested nondiabetic family members, friends, colleagues etc. and found their BG seldom strays from the 5 +- 0.5 sort of range. These are the true "nondiabetics"

Pancreases tend to **** out with age anyway, there's a theory that if everyone lived to be 150 we'd all become diabetic. The speed of the denegeration is dependent on genetic factors and abuse among other things.

http://www.phlaunt.com/diabetes/

is worth a read
 
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