Blood pressure fluctuations; input?

Melgar

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@JoKalsbeek I wrote about my blood pressure issues in another post, but I will copy it here as it shows what stress and outside influences can have on your BP

I came off my blood pressure pills as my BP was okay. Then about two years later my BP started to rise again. One morning, which I will never forget, I tested my BP, it was slightly raised so I tested it a few minutes later to see if it had normalized. It hadn't, in fact it was higher. So I tested it several more times. My BP went higher and higher. So high in fact I became very concerned. So I called 811 health line (that's the Canadian health line #) and spoke to the nurse. She asked me to test it again while I was on the line, it was like 160/110. She called an ambulance. I was then carted off to hospital. I was taken straight to a bed, no waiting at all. I had heart monitors put on, BP monitor the whole nine yards. My BP came right down.

The Dr attending me, who was Scottish, recalled a story from when he was a med student, this was a long time ago. Anyways, he told me that when he was at med school, doing the BP lesson they all tested their own BP. One of his fellow student's BP was raised. He then went on to tell me that they ribbed this poor guy so much about his raised BP, it went very high, no doubt from anxiety. It went so high he was admitted to the hospital and kept in overnight. The Dr said they all felt badly and it was anxiety, due to being ribbed about his BP, that had caused his BP to rise so dramatically. The Dr then told me that this is what had happened to me. I went back on my BP meds.

Ed grammar
 
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JoKalsbeek

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What about your reduced kidney function? As far as I know this alone is often enough reason to start people on bp medication even if they have perfectly normal bp.
It might get better as the next stone passes, assuming it'll pop out sooner or later... But at the same time, I've been passing many, many stones for 3 years now, so I doubt I'll ever get down to the last one. But yeah... It's a definite possibility.
 
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JoKalsbeek

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To be clear, I wasn't advocating medicating for your BP, based on the rationale that your usual readings are in the healthy ranges (in UK, at least). I was more suggesting you ditch any stress you might have, feeling your BP is routinely low.


I still strongly advocate a worn BP monitor for at least 24 hours. It's not a totally comfortable thing to do, and I was counting down the clock up to the 24hrs, but it was part of a research study and I really, really wanted to complete it.
Oh, I didn't mean I was going to go in for more meds, because I'd rather avoid them if possible... It just seemed at the time, that there was to be no more talk of my blood pressure, and the matter was *closed*... I'm still concerned though, because something's changing now, and I don't like the direction it's headed in. Could also have something to do with the doc changing the dosage of my thyroid meds recently, which didn't pop into my head until just now. Just so much going on, and I only get 10 minutes per appointment...! (Granted, I've taken up more time in the past, but it'd be more efficient if I knew what to talk about... ;)). I'm kind of dragging my heels because I've seen the new GP quite often now, (Three times this year!) and I don't want her to think I'm a hypochondriac... There's just a lot I didn't adress for a looooong time, and it's been ganging up on me, so she gets it all in one go. I'm a little worried she won't understand my brand of crazy. ;)
 
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AndBreathe

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Oh, I didn't mean I was going to go in for more meds, because I'd rather avoid them if possible... It just seemed at the time, that there was to be no more talk of my blood pressure, and the matter was *closed*... I'm still concerned though, because something's changing now, and I don't like the direction it's headed in. Could also have something to do with the doc changing the dosage of my thyroid meds recently, which didn't pop into my head until just now. Just so much going on, and I only get 10 minutes per appointment...! (Granted, I've taken up more time in the past, but it'd be more efficient if I knew what to talk about... ;)). I'm kind of dragging my heels because I've seen the new GP quite often now, (Three times this year!) and I don't want her to think I'm a hypochondriac... There's just a lot I didn't adress for a looooong time, and it's been ganging up on me, so she gets it all in one go. I'm a little worried she won't understand my brand of crazy. ;)
When were your thyroid meds change? Is it just the dosage? If so, what was the change, and what was the reason for the change?

Do you always have the same brand of Levothyroxine?
 
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JoKalsbeek

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@JoKalsbeek I wrote about my blood pressure issues in another post, but I will copy it here as it shows what stress and outside influences can have on your BP

I came off my blood pressure pills as my BP was okay. Then about two years later my BP started to rise again. One morning, which I will never forget, I tested my BP, it was slightly raised so I tested it a few minutes later to see if it had normalized. It hadn't, in fact it was higher. So I tested it several more times. My BP went higher and higher. So high in fact I became very concerned. So I called 811 health line (that's the Canadian health line #) and spoke to the nurse. She asked me to test it again while I was on the line, it was like 160/110. She called an ambulance. I was then carted off to hospital. I was taken straight to a bed, no waiting at all. I had heart monitors put on, BP monitor the whole nine yards. My BP came right down.

The Dr attending me, who was Scottish, recalled a story from when he was a med student, this was a long time ago. Anyways, he told me that when he was at med school, doing the BP lesson they all tested their own BP. One of his fellow student's BP was raised. He then went on to tell me that they ribbed this poor guy so much about his raised BP, it went very high, no doubt from anxiety. It went so high he was admitted to the hospital and kept in overnight. The Dr said they all felt badly and it was anxiety, due to being ribbed about his BP, that had caused his BP to rise so dramatically. The Dr then told me that this is what had happened to me. I went back on my BP meds.

Ed grammar
I see your point, but to be absolutely clear: My usual white coat syndrome revolves around human beings and social interactions... I don't quite care what the results are: they just are what they are, you know, kind of the way I also look at my blood glucose. Practical, me. ;) It's just information to act on, or not. I don't measure all day every day, only when I have a headache and am not sure whether it's a migraine or one brought on by high blood pressure. Sumatriptan for migraines elevates the blood pressure a little. Not a problem, and I've been on it since I was 16 years old. But the time I saw 180/100, I'd been taking three dosages already because the headache just wouldn't get better, upping the blood pressure in increments as I went. Oops. And since it wasn't a migraine but a blood pressure headache (someone at the lunch place we visited just before, had made my meal extremely salty, which had never been an issue before...), it wasn't going to help at all, and just made a bad thing worse. I ended up at the hospital because the pain was unbearable, that's where the blood pressure issue came up for the first time. The problem isn't just that a headache comes up and I might take the wrong medication for it, which'll make it worse... If it's a bp headache, the only thing so far that has helped, is ibuprofen. And with IBS and a diverticulum/diverticulitis-in-waiting, I can't exactly take it often. I pay for every single pink pill I pop with a rotten gut for a week, at least. So if I have to take it a few days in a row... That's not good. It'll be painful as the inflammation kicks in, I'll get constipated and 'rhea, it's just... Ugly. It's better than my eyes melting out of my head, but still not what you'd call fun. So if these headaches are going to be a thing more frequent than once every few months, I'll need to find a different way to tackle them. And whether that's more dietary changes, different medications that are more of the lowering bp variety than the pain killing one, or going back to see what else can be done because of kidney function being suboptimal, my thyroid meds possibly being too high now, avoiding global news, or anything else... Because this just isn't something I can afford having to deal with on a weekly or daily basis as things are now and with the drugs currently at my disposal. My gut won't allow for it. Once every few months, fine. But with the recent change in frequency, I am a bit concerned... And I honestly want to do as much as I can on my own, because, well... I just really don't want to go to the GP again. People are so very hard, and I think she is getting a little exhasperated.... My original GP seems to have handed me off to the new one within the same practice, so my RSD has kicked in as well. I thought we were cool and now we are... Not? I think? I just don't want to be a bother.

Lovely, how anxiety can get in the way of good-ish health.

Maybe I should just write a letter/email, because I get all fumbled when I'm in the practice, and there's just too many factors at play for this one... I need to get things on paper, I think!

....And then i forgot to post this. But I've written the GP a letter and will be delivering it this evening! (Practice is closed today)

Thank you! Without all the input here, i'd not have dares to take that step, i don't think...! <3
Jo
 

JoKalsbeek

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When were your thyroid meds change? Is it just the dosage? If so, what was the change, and what was the reason for the change?

Do you always have the same brand of Levothyroxine?
My brand is the same, but I was upped in increments, from 100 to 112,5 during six weeks, then to 125 in the six weeks after that... And I think that last nudge to 125 might've just been too much? Maybe a quart of a 25microgram tablet less, to go with my original 100. I've had to work with quartered tablets before, so it wouldn't surprise me if just a smidge made such a massive difference. But I have to go over it with the GP first, just in case I'm barking up the wrong tree. On the 12th of this month, the 6 weeks after the last upping were over, so it's very recent. Reason being my numbers weren't ideal, it'd been about 5 years since the last time my thyroid levels were properly checked (where did those covid years go?!), and being symptomatic. Overweight and unable to lose, swollen eyelids, T2 a bit up etc, all of which is still a problem! I'd hate to change my dosage again as my eyes have just adjusted to this, and I was going to get new glasses once they were back to normal again. But I guess it might take a little while longer yet, if this is indeed the issue! Hope to hear more next week, when the practice is open again.

I wish everything was as "easy" as diabetes... I might not have perfect numbers now thanks to a myread of things, but at least I have influence there and can do something without getting the gp involved and getting a plethora of tests done. Pff.
 
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AndBreathe

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My brand is the same, but I was upped in increments, from 100 to 112,5 during six weeks, then to 125 in the six weeks after that... And I think that last nudge to 125 might've just been too much? Maybe a quart of a 25microgram tablet less, to go with my original 100. I've had to work with quartered tablets before, so it wouldn't surprise me if just a smidge made such a massive difference. But I have to go over it with the GP first, just in case I'm barking up the wrong tree. On the 12th of this month, the 6 weeks after the last upping were over, so it's very recent. Reason being my numbers weren't ideal, it'd been about 5 years since the last time my thyroid levels were properly checked (where did those covid years go?!), and being symptomatic. Overweight and unable to lose, swollen eyelids, T2 a bit up etc, all of which is still a problem! I'd hate to change my dosage again as my eyes have just adjusted to this, and I was going to get new glasses once they were back to normal again. But I guess it might take a little while longer yet, if this is indeed the issue! Hope to hear more next week, when the practice is open again.

I wish everything was as "easy" as diabetes... I might not have perfect numbers now thanks to a myread of things, but at least I have influence there and can do something without getting the gp involved and getting a plethora of tests done. Pff.
To investigate if your thyroid meds are in play, you'll need to be tested around 6 weeks after your last change. That's how long it takes to ensure you're at the peak therapeutic dose from the changes made.

High blood pressure often accompanies hypothyroidisgm, with over medication more likely to cause sweats and palpitations, but as we know, symptoms can be individual.

When you had your proper testing on your thyroid, what were your results? Were you tested for antibodies, and your T4, and T3 tested, along with your TSH? Obviously I have no idea how things work in the Netherlands, but in UK most GP's understanding of thyroid matters is very poor. Much, much worse than for diabetes, in my experience and observation.

Thankfully at the start of that particular journey, I had an excellent GP who admitted she had no clue and asked for Consultant support up-front, because aside from dreadful intolerance to the cold, I had few symptoms. It still took a long time to be near adequately medicated.

Going back to your primary problem of periodic apparently sharp increases in blood pressure, leading to headaches and associated ails, do you keep a diary, a bit like we might suggest newbies do for their blood glucose?

In order to gain further potential insight for both yourself and/or your GP, it could be useful to keep a daily diary of when you take your meds, perhaps waking BP, food and drink, then ANY symptoms you feel, with timings etc. You might just find something really simple.

Don't misunderstand me, Jo. I'm not doubting anything you say or feel, but sometimes it is easier to engage with our (in this case, medical) advisors when we take something to them that demonstrates how seriously we feel the issue is impacting us, and maybe information they might find helpful.

In your shoes, personally, I'd really NOT want to medicate my BP, bearing in mind other medications have been changed recently, sort of aligned to the onset of these symptoms. I'd want monitoring thyroid bloods done, of at least TSH, T4 and T3. If antibodies have already been tested, the value of repeating that again after a few weeks is not that great.

I really hope you start to find a bit of light on all of this soon. It can't be any fun as things are for you.
 

JoKalsbeek

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To investigate if your thyroid meds are in play, you'll need to be tested around 6 weeks after your last change. That's how long it takes to ensure you're at the peak therapeutic dose from the changes made.

High blood pressure often accompanies hypothyroidisgm, with over medication more likely to cause sweats and palpitations, but as we know, symptoms can be individual.

When you had your proper testing on your thyroid, what were your results? Were you tested for antibodies, and your T4, and T3 tested, along with your TSH? Obviously I have no idea how things work in the Netherlands, but in UK most GP's understanding of thyroid matters is very poor. Much, much worse than for diabetes, in my experience and observation.

Thankfully at the start of that particular journey, I had an excellent GP who admitted she had no clue and asked for Consultant support up-front, because aside from dreadful intolerance to the cold, I had few symptoms. It still took a long time to be near adequately medicated.

Going back to your primary problem of periodic apparently sharp increases in blood pressure, leading to headaches and associated ails, do you keep a diary, a bit like we might suggest newbies do for their blood glucose?

In order to gain further potential insight for both yourself and/or your GP, it could be useful to keep a daily diary of when you take your meds, perhaps waking BP, food and drink, then ANY symptoms you feel, with timings etc. You might just find something really simple.

Don't misunderstand me, Jo. I'm not doubting anything you say or feel, but sometimes it is easier to engage with our (in this case, medical) advisors when we take something to them that demonstrates how seriously we feel the issue is impacting us, and maybe information they might find helpful.

In your shoes, personally, I'd really NOT want to medicate my BP, bearing in mind other medications have been changed recently, sort of aligned to the onset of these symptoms. I'd want monitoring thyroid bloods done, of at least TSH, T4 and T3. If antibodies have already been tested, the value of repeating that again after a few weeks is not that great.

I really hope you start to find a bit of light on all of this soon. It can't be any fun as things are for you.
Ah, and that's where things are.... Somewhat difficult. The GP can't order all those thyroid tests. Just TSH and free T4, all the rest is a no-go for a non-endocrinologist. She literally can't pull them up on her computer, they're not there, even if she could interpret them properly. Antibodies were tested something like 20 years ago, and Hashimoto's firmly established. The GP did say the target for TSH was lowered and I no longer met the criteria for "good control" at 3,2 (I'd been told under 4 was excellent when first diagnosed with Hashi's, so was unaware there was a problem before this, but she'd prefer to have me at 1 or under), so... Let's see if I can find all my test results from this latest adventure.

dec 7th FT4 was 14,3 pmol/l (low 10, high 17), meds upped from 100 to 112,5 due to these numbers
Jan 18th FT4 was 14,6 pmol/l meds upped from 112,5 to 125
mar 5th FT4 was 16.2 pmol./l check whether 125 is alright, no notes from the doc so far

dec 7th TSH 3.2 (low 0,35, high 5,00) meds upped from 100 to 112,5, due to these numbers
jan 18th TSH 2,4 meds upped from 112,5 to 125
mar 5th TSH 0,71 check whether 125 is alright, no notes from the doc so far

Which I guess might be about as useful as a "total cholesterol", (a.k.a. not at all even remotely useful) the doc hasn't been in touch on any further changes needed because the numbers look decent, I guess, and I was busy with the hospital about the kidney stone(s) and continued fever. I just forgot about it until this morning, really. I still get the occasional heart flutter or a skipped beat, but nowhere near as frequently as in the first 4 weeks of each change made. (The last two weeks were okay, then upped again and back to the heart turning into a frightened little bird fluttering all over the place)

Normally it'd be a case of going back to the specialist... But that would, for one thing, be the same specialist who told me 9 years ago, with some loathing, that I didn't have the spine for low carb eating. From her I got long sessions of berating me when I was down and scared already with the T2 diagnosis. And about 10 years before that, she referred me back to the GP for my thyroid, because I couldn't take the Cytomel she would've wanted me on anyway due to a heartmurmer, and now I'd be someone else's problem. (That was the first I heard about a heart murmur, so that came out of the blue and scared me sh*tless. But then, most migraineurs have a heart murmur, I just didn't know it. Not something to throw at someone in casual conversation about something else, though.).

I hope I can get this sorted with the GP. Just muck about with the meds some, maybe start back up with the zinc, selenium and b6 again to make my transition from t4 to t3 better... I dunno. I never could get tested for what the supplements did, so I never knew whether they were effective.

I do make notes in my calendar when something is off. Like when I get a period (I'm not supposed to get any on the Depo Provera injections I get to control the hormonal migraines, so this year I've also been examined for cervical cancer and ovarian cancer: turned out to be a menopause thing instead, though my PCOS has grown considerably. No cancerous cells though, yay!), when something else is off and if possible, why... Just in case there's a pattern somewhere. It's not as neat as an excel file like I did for my diabetes way back when, but I tend to forget to fill those out, and it's easier to just grab the online calendar for exactly the reasons you mentioned: It's data they might be able to work with! (Just like me saving a little jar of kidney stones... Just in case I am, as per usual, not believed by the pro's.). I eat much the same every day, which is why I vividly remember the extremely salty lunch that got my numbers up that time I went to the hospital: it was something out of the ordinary, and it came after an owl workshop where we shot pics of owls in small groups, which was stressful but fun. Other occasions were directly related to stressful, social situations, so it was easy to pinpoint a cause... And now everything seems to be the same/stable far as foods etc are concerned.... Just general stress over the state of the world, hormones being all over the place, my kidneys acting up, and as I realised properly this morning, the fairly recent change in thyroid meds.

So, the letter is written, and since the GP is out today and we're off to Belgium for two days next week, I hope to get a reply when we get back... Though part of me hopes she might put in a call to the endo and ask for advice, as she did with the urologist.... I only had to go see one once for my CT scan results, but the hospital got consulted 3 times without me having to go anywhere over the bleeding and rattling kidneys... So that'd be ideal! We'll see though... Fingers crossed I get a step further with ALL thyroid hormones checked, in a new form from the endo, via e-mail! That'd certainly be nice... Maybe a bit much to hope for, but it worked with the urologist too, so... Who knows? Fingers crossed.

<3 !
 

AndBreathe

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Ah, and that's where things are.... Somewhat difficult. The GP can't order all those thyroid tests. Just TSH and free T4, all the rest is a no-go for a non-endocrinologist. She literally can't pull them up on her computer, they're not there, even if she could interpret them properly. Antibodies were tested something like 20 years ago, and Hashimoto's firmly established. The GP did say the target for TSH was lowered and I no longer met the criteria for "good control" at 3,2 (I'd been told under 4 was excellent when first diagnosed with Hashi's, so was unaware there was a problem before this, but she'd prefer to have me at 1 or under), so... Let's see if I can find all my test results from this latest adventure.

dec 7th FT4 was 14,3 pmol/l (low 10, high 17), meds upped from 100 to 112,5 due to these numbers
Jan 18th FT4 was 14,6 pmol/l meds upped from 112,5 to 125
mar 5th FT4 was 16.2 pmol./l check whether 125 is alright, no notes from the doc so far

dec 7th TSH 3.2 (low 0,35, high 5,00) meds upped from 100 to 112,5, due to these numbers
jan 18th TSH 2,4 meds upped from 112,5 to 125
mar 5th TSH 0,71 check whether 125 is alright, no notes from the doc so far

Which I guess might be about as useful as a "total cholesterol", (a.k.a. not at all even remotely useful) the doc hasn't been in touch on any further changes needed because the numbers look decent, I guess, and I was busy with the hospital about the kidney stone(s) and continued fever. I just forgot about it until this morning, really. I still get the occasional heart flutter or a skipped beat, but nowhere near as frequently as in the first 4 weeks of each change made. (The last two weeks were okay, then upped again and back to the heart turning into a frightened little bird fluttering all over the place)

Normally it'd be a case of going back to the specialist... But that would, for one thing, be the same specialist who told me 9 years ago, with some loathing, that I didn't have the spine for low carb eating. From her I got long sessions of berating me when I was down and scared already with the T2 diagnosis. And about 10 years before that, she referred me back to the GP for my thyroid, because I couldn't take the Cytomel she would've wanted me on anyway due to a heartmurmer, and now I'd be someone else's problem. (That was the first I heard about a heart murmur, so that came out of the blue and scared me sh*tless. But then, most migraineurs have a heart murmur, I just didn't know it. Not something to throw at someone in casual conversation about something else, though.).

I hope I can get this sorted with the GP. Just muck about with the meds some, maybe start back up with the zinc, selenium and b6 again to make my transition from t4 to t3 better... I dunno. I never could get tested for what the supplements did, so I never knew whether they were effective.

I do make notes in my calendar when something is off. Like when I get a period (I'm not supposed to get any on the Depo Provera injections I get to control the hormonal migraines, so this year I've also been examined for cervical cancer and ovarian cancer: turned out to be a menopause thing instead, though my PCOS has grown considerably. No cancerous cells though, yay!), when something else is off and if possible, why... Just in case there's a pattern somewhere. It's not as neat as an excel file like I did for my diabetes way back when, but I tend to forget to fill those out, and it's easier to just grab the online calendar for exactly the reasons you mentioned: It's data they might be able to work with! (Just like me saving a little jar of kidney stones... Just in case I am, as per usual, not believed by the pro's.). I eat much the same every day, which is why I vividly remember the extremely salty lunch that got my numbers up that time I went to the hospital: it was something out of the ordinary, and it came after an owl workshop where we shot pics of owls in small groups, which was stressful but fun. Other occasions were directly related to stressful, social situations, so it was easy to pinpoint a cause... And now everything seems to be the same/stable far as foods etc are concerned.... Just general stress over the state of the world, hormones being all over the place, my kidneys acting up, and as I realised properly this morning, the fairly recent change in thyroid meds.

So, the letter is written, and since the GP is out today and we're off to Belgium for two days next week, I hope to get a reply when we get back... Though part of me hopes she might put in a call to the endo and ask for advice, as she did with the urologist.... I only had to go see one once for my CT scan results, but the hospital got consulted 3 times without me having to go anywhere over the bleeding and rattling kidneys... So that'd be ideal! We'll see though... Fingers crossed I get a step further with ALL thyroid hormones checked, in a new form from the endo, via e-mail! That'd certainly be nice... Maybe a bit much to hope for, but it worked with the urologist too, so... Who knows? Fingers crossed.

<3 !
TSH isn't a thyroid hormone, but a pituitary one. It signals the thyroid to get to work, so the bigger the number the louder it's having to shout for the thyroid to get into action. The thyroid chucks out T4 (which is inactive) which then metabolises by a process I'll spare you into T3 (which is active), so whilst knowing T4 levels is helpful, it's only half the story. Without knowing what happens to it, it's a bit like putting fuel in a car petrol tank and assuming on that basis it will go, and go fast.

In my own case, my body is plain old rubbish at generating T4, or indeed using levothroxine, never mind converting T4 to T3. In the end, I have been prescribed T3, which has really helped me.

It is helpful that you have been diagnosed with Hashi's, and good that your GP is recognising where decent TSH levels should be. Generally under 2 is "OK", but under 1 is ideal. If you're getting down into the 0.01, or less, then that suppression is sometimes thought to be worrying. For me, on T4 and T3, it is very acceptable. I am now considered to be on thyroid hormone replacement therapy, not topping up.

Again, no idea how things work in The Netherlands, but in UK, we have several commercial labs ofering private tests, and one lab, marketed as MonitorMyHealth (MMH), which is a private part of the Exeter NHS lab. My GP is very happy to accept MMH's results, bearing in mind they are being done by the NHS lab in quiet hours. MMH's thyroid screening starts at £32, which I find to be pretty reasonable.

It might be an idea to try for retesting on c6 weeks from your 5th March tests and see where you sit then. I always felt a million times better immediately after an increase in meds, only to crash back again after a couple of weeks.

It is indeed a puzzle, but you definitely need to discount thyroid interference, as that's a change factor around these new symptoms.

Just on a final aside, I assume your GP has run a simple ECG at some stage through all of this? My Endo has one done on me annually, but that's mainly because I take high (for my size and volume) levels of T3. My thyroid is overall just like a petulant 3yr old. I don't hold out my hope of that toddler growing up!
 

Melgar

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@JoKalsbeek I feel your pain. I have a totally messed up digestive system. Even Tylenol / paracetamol turns my gut into a veritable witches cauldron . I can tolerate the Ramipril very well, but in general IBS is the outcome from medications.
What I left out of my BP story was the headache I got with it. It became an emergency, not just for my rising blood pressure, but the headache I got. They called it a 'Thunderclap headache'. A headache with a sudden severe onset. I was told it can be a precursor to a stroke. My mom had a subarachnoid hemorrhage due to her BP being so high. I cannot remember the exact figure but it was like 260/150 or something like that. I remember she had a severe headache prior to her bleed. I know her BP was ridiculously high prior yo her stroke. My mom had a genetic predisposition for BP - Monogenic BP. My brother and I likely have it too. I went on BP meds when I started taking ADHD medications , but I have struggled with fluctuating bp for years. Sometimes it high, sometimes it drops.

I don't like it when they change your Dr. I think they divvy up patients at random and tend towards spreading out patients with more complex health issues. Just my take on it.
 
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JoKalsbeek

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Type of diabetes
I reversed my Type 2
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TSH isn't a thyroid hormone, but a pituitary one. It signals the thyroid to get to work, so the bigger the number the louder it's having to shout for the thyroid to get into action. The thyroid chucks out T4 (which is inactive) which then metabolises by a process I'll spare you into T3 (which is active), so whilst knowing T4 levels is helpful, it's only half the story. Without knowing what happens to it, it's a bit like putting fuel in a car petrol tank and assuming on that basis it will go, and go fast.

In my own case, my body is plain old rubbish at generating T4, or indeed using levothroxine, never mind converting T4 to T3. In the end, I have been prescribed T3, which has really helped me.

It is helpful that you have been diagnosed with Hashi's, and good that your GP is recognising where decent TSH levels should be. Generally under 2 is "OK", but under 1 is ideal. If you're getting down into the 0.01, or less, then that suppression is sometimes thought to be worrying. For me, on T4 and T3, it is very acceptable. I am now considered to be on thyroid hormone replacement therapy, not topping up.

Again, no idea how things work in The Netherlands, but in UK, we have several commercial labs ofering private tests, and one lab, marketed as MonitorMyHealth (MMH), which is a private part of the Exeter NHS lab. My GP is very happy to accept MMH's results, bearing in mind they are being done by the NHS lab in quiet hours. MMH's thyroid screening starts at £32, which I find to be pretty reasonable.

It might be an idea to try for retesting on c6 weeks from your 5th March tests and see where you sit then. I always felt a million times better immediately after an increase in meds, only to crash back again after a couple of weeks.

It is indeed a puzzle, but you definitely need to discount thyroid interference, as that's a change factor around these new symptoms.

Just on a final aside, I assume your GP has run a simple ECG at some stage through all of this? My Endo has one done on me annually, but that's mainly because I take high (for my size and volume) levels of T3. My thyroid is overall just like a petulant 3yr old. I don't hold out my hope of that toddler growing up!
I know, the test is entirely useless when you don't have all the numbers... And the GP can't get them. But with an endo on board, she might. I don't know. Will have to wait for a response on the letter for that. I wouldn't know where to get tested off the top of my head, though likely at a lab nearby.... I just don't think the GP has the skills to read the results, so she'd have to consult anyway if she is willing to wade in, and if the endo's involved, it's within my insurance. So it's just a bit of a waiting game until next week. Which isn't all that long, it just feels like it. ;)

Haven't felt better since the med increase, it hasn't helped at all. Still fat and not losing, still have puffy eyes, still fatigued... Pretty much a wreck, but with that continuous low grade fever from my kidney, chronic Vit D deficiency, just-barely prediabetic numbers, menopause and what have you, there's too much going on to be able to pinpoint one cause. All of them could be contributing by now. The last time I felt energetic was three and a half, maybe 4 years ago, back on the Carnivore diet. I was 20 kilo's lighter, bloods always 5 and under, and running circles around my 6-year-my-junior husband. If it hadn't triggered the kidney stones, I'd still be very happy on that diet, I think. LOVED it. Once that changed, and I had to take those blasted stones into account -which stayed with me anyway!- everything just went to pieces. Haven't been the same since, really. Weight went up, bloods too, cholesterol as well, and still I'm a sluggish gravel pit on legs. There's very little I long for as much as returning to the carnivore diet, I felt so *alive* then.... But my urine was cloudy with stones and bits all the time, once I knew what was going on and started checking. Just slush. No wonder bigger ones got stuck.

My last ECG was when I was first diagnosed a diabetic. I haven't had one since, so it's been 9 years this summer. I think the appointment with the nurse in May will include one though. I hope so, anyway...! Test to her competence, that'll be. ;) Otherwise I'll just have to ask for one... Oooh that sounds easy when i say it like that, haha.

Beginning to think there's nothing left in my body that isn't a petulant 3 year old! Or maybe I'm just a contrary old hag all over. There doesn't seem to be a middle ground anymore. Certainly not just simply a 46-year old, in the prime of her decay.

Lots to think about in any case... And discuss with the doc/nurse when I get some answers out of that corner.

Thank you!!!
 
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Antje77

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Normally it'd be a case of going back to the specialist... But that would, for one thing, be the same specialist who told me 9 years ago, with some loathing, that I didn't have the spine for low carb eating. From her I got long sessions of berating me when I was down and scared already with the T2 diagnosis.
Why would this need to be the same specialist?
You live in a densely populated area, lots of specialists around and you can simply tell your GP you want to be referred to a different one.
 
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JoKalsbeek

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@JoKalsbeek I feel your pain. I have a totally messed up digestive system. Even Tylenol / paracetamol turns my gut into a veritable witches cauldron . I can tolerate the Ramipril very well, but in general IBS is the outcome from medications.
What I left out of my BP story was the headache I got with it. It became an emergency, not just for my rising blood pressure, but the headache I got. They called it a 'Thunderclap headache'. A headache with a sudden severe onset. I was told it can be a precursor to a stroke. My mom had a subarachnoid hemorrhage due to her BP being so high. I cannot remember the exact figure but it was like 260/150 or something like that. I remember she had a severe headache prior to her bleed. I know her BP was ridiculously high prior yo her stroke. My mom had a genetic predisposition for BP - Monogenic BP. My brother and I likely have it too. I went on BP meds when I started taking ADHD medications , but I have struggled with fluctuating bp for years. Sometimes it high, sometimes it drops.

I don't like it when they change your Dr. I think they divvy up patients at random and tend towards spreading out patients with more complex health issues. Just my take on it.
Oh, yikes... I'm quite aware of strange headaches that don't fit the usual migraines since a friend's husband was sent home from hospital with a "migraine"... The poor bloke had a stroke within days. He got help once he went down relatively quickly, being close to a very good hospital, so he survived... But he'll never be the same again, and he's mourning the loss of the life (job, physical capabilities) he had, years later. I keep him in mind, whenever I think I could just ignore something... But clots and bleeds both run in the family, so while I could try and take a blood thinner -which I have in my cabinet- I might make a bleed worse rather than dissolve a clot when a headache goes funny. (And they have been funny the past few days as well.. Stabbing pains that I normally get once a year, maybe twice, are around a few times a day now, since this past weekend. Might have nothing to do with the blood pressure headaches, but I mentioned them in the letter to the GP anyway.) So I do think getting the GP involved is the right thing to do. I don't go into the 200's though, so I'm more worried about what the meds for the headaches do to my innards, than my brain going kaplooey. For now, anyway. I don't know how high my familymembers got before the TIA's and such happened though... I have no-one left to ask. Another one of the drawbacks of aging...! The ones who went before, tend to have keeled over before you knew what questions to ask them! Not that they would've known... Their faith in doctors was 100% blind. If they said to pop a pill, they did, without asking why, what their numbers are etc... Usually didn't even know what the pills were for to begin with. So even if my nan could come through via psychic means, she wouldn't have more to tell me, anyway. :p

I hope you're right on the divvying... I really liked my GP, got on like a house on fire. The new one is nice, but I don't know quite what to make of her. (And I think the feeling is mutual! I make deeper dives than the usual people who go for Dr. Google, I suppose... ;)).

Your take on anything is always welcome, you know that, right? :)
Jo
 
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JoKalsbeek

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Why would this need to be the same specialist?
You live in a densely populated area, lots of specialists around and you can simply tell your GP you want to be referred to a different one.
Ha! I already tried that with that bleeding idiot of a reumatologist. That was a no-go. It was her, or nobody. Something vague about the insurance.

Then it'll be nobody, thanks. And has been nobody for something like 17 or more years now! (And it will remain that way as long as that fool is in "my" hospital. Alas, she's still there. Once she's transferred, fired or otherwise gone, I'll happily make a new appointment.)
 
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Melgar

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@JoKalsbeek I think those headaches are called 'ice pick' headaches. That's what they are called here. They are generally considered harmless from what I have read about them.
 

JoKalsbeek

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@JoKalsbeek I think those headaches are called 'ice pick' headaches. That's what they are called here. They are generally considered harmless from what I have read about them.
Very apt description indeed...! And I did see they were generally harmless according to google, but since those too have changed in frequency (and in spot in my skull), I figured I'd mention those too. In House MD it was always the stuff you don't think of as being important, that was the key to solving the diagnostic mystery. ;) (Oh, to have Greg House on my team...!).

I do feel better hearing it from a human rather than some website though. Funny how that works...
 
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Melgar

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Yes, you can almost visualize an ice pick picking at your head!
 
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