COVID 2019 Comorbidity with Diabetes

Bill_St

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Very little has been said about the particular risks of Coronavirus to PWD.
We often read that the risk of death with Coronavirus is "only" 2%, with critical illness about 10%
But then we read that most of those suffering serious effects have pre-existing conditions.
80% have a pre-existing condition.

In effect, if you have a pre-existing condition then the risk of death is increased to around 10%; risk of critical illness increased to around 40% if you "catch" Coronavirus. The medical term for these increases in morbidity (death rates) is comorbidity.

Medical papers have been written on the prime condition which creates concern and we can read them by searching for Coronavirus Comorbid. Trouble is that COVID 2019 is too new for particular research papers to have been written - however we get a fairly accurate picture by looking at two "older", more researched Coronaviruses, SARS and MERS. These are very similar to COVID, indeed many medical professionals objected to the name COVID, saying that it should be called SARS2 as they are so similar.

We can find out just what those pre-existing conditions are - and which is the prime concern.

It is Diabetes - both T1 & T2

http://grantome.com/grant/NIH/F32-A..._fnGoJI-mnOb_gcQ0k6JbZtaPojB2JYc5NUCo-w67PZH4
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6824443/
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6357155/
https://www.ecdc.europa.eu/en/factsheet-health-professionals-coronaviruses
https://asprtracie.hhs.gov/technical-resources/44/coronavirus-sars-mers-2019-ncov/27
 

HSSS

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Very little has been said about the particular risks of Coronavirus to PWD.
We often read that the risk of death with Coronavirus is "only" 2%, with critical illness about 10%
But then we read that most of those suffering serious effects have pre-existing conditions.
80% have a pre-existing condition.

In effect, if you have a pre-existing condition then the risk of death is increased to around 10%; risk of critical illness increased to around 40% if you "catch" Coronavirus. The medical term for these increases in morbidity (death rates) is comorbidity.

Medical papers have been written on the prime condition which creates concern and we can read them by searching for Coronavirus Comorbid. Trouble is that COVID 2019 is too new for particular research papers to have been written - however we get a fairly accurate picture by looking at two "older", more researched Coronaviruses, SARS and MERS. These are very similar to COVID, indeed many medical professionals objected to the name COVID, saying that it should be called SARS2 as they are so similar.

We can find out just what those pre-existing conditions are - and which is the prime concern.

It is Diabetes - both T1 & T2

http://grantome.com/grant/NIH/F32-A..._fnGoJI-mnOb_gcQ0k6JbZtaPojB2JYc5NUCo-w67PZH4
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6824443/
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6357155/
https://www.ecdc.europa.eu/en/factsheet-health-professionals-coronaviruses
https://asprtracie.hhs.gov/technical-resources/44/coronavirus-sars-mers-2019-ncov/27
Without wading through the links, is that having the condition per se or having it without optimal control? Ie if hb1ac and daily bgl are good is the risk still increased? I suspect papers won’t identify the difference and will assume less than optimal control if not down right poor control and complications already in situ.
 
D

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Latest information from this week estimates the deaths to be closer to 1%, similar to flu. The original slightly higher rates were because they were not including the milder cases.
Deaths are more common in the elderly and those who are already ill, respiratory conditions such as asthma and coronary conditions appear to be a bigger risk than diabetes.
Anyone with well-controlled diabetes should have a lower risk.

https://www.imperial.ac.uk/media/im...ial-College-2019-nCoV-severity-10-02-2020.pdf
 
D

Deleted member 308541

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If you are a T1 and unfortunate to have been sneezed on by someone who is carrying the virus.

Then if you get full blown CV then you will be quarantined under medical supervision, who hopefully will take note that you are T1 and act accordingly...
 

jjraak

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Latest information from this week estimates the deaths to be closer to 1%, similar to flu. The original slightly higher rates were because they were not including the milder cases.
Deaths are more common in the elderly and those who are already ill, respiratory conditions such as asthma and coronary conditions appear to be a bigger risk than diabetes.
Anyone with well-controlled diabetes should have a lower risk.

https://www.imperial.ac.uk/media/im...ial-College-2019-nCoV-severity-10-02-2020.pdf


It's similar to flu, gets a lot of press.
Can't think of the last time a country shut down over flu... And given the size of China and the risks involved in taking such drastic action to the ruling elite, I think it might be wise to look beyond what the MSM tells us. Good or bad.

Good link here to running total and updates.
https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/

I find out we had a case in London before the BBC posted it up... So pretty bang on the money with its stats.
Check out the critical list.
A worry is post recovery, many diseases leave a lasting legacy, if you survive the initial impact.

As for more at risk.. For definite, but that goes for anyone. Whose health is compromised in some way

I'd say @HSSS is spot on re staying as healthy as possible gives us the best chance.. Well managed T1 or T2, I would suggest gives our bodies an easier time, saving on wear and tear so to speak internally .

For my money, most data re T2 IS MORE related to the previous generations JUST accepting the status quo and taking the meds and eating as proscribed...a thing most on here so NOT do.

I'd say we, are a step away from that scenario of the typical T2 in many ways.
(can't Speak for T1, mind.. Others may be way more aware ?)
 
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jjraak

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Very little has been said about the particular risks of Coronavirus to PWD.
We often read that the risk of death with Coronavirus is "only" 2%, with critical illness about 10%
But then we read that most of those suffering serious effects have pre-existing conditions.
80% have a pre-existing condition.

In effect, if you have a pre-existing condition then the risk of death is increased to around 10%; risk of critical illness increased to around 40% if you "catch" Coronavirus. The medical term for these increases in morbidity (death rates) is comorbidity.

Medical papers have been written on the prime condition which creates concern and we can read them by searching for Coronavirus Comorbid. Trouble is that COVID 2019 is too new for particular research papers to have been written - however we get a fairly accurate picture by looking at two "older", more researched Coronaviruses, SARS and MERS. These are very similar to COVID, indeed many medical professionals objected to the name COVID, saying that it should be called SARS2 as they are so similar.

We can find out just what those pre-existing conditions are - and which is the prime concern.

It is Diabetes - both T1 & T2

http://grantome.com/grant/NIH/F32-A..._fnGoJI-mnOb_gcQ0k6JbZtaPojB2JYc5NUCo-w67PZH4
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6824443/
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6357155/
https://www.ecdc.europa.eu/en/factsheet-health-professionals-coronaviruses
https://asprtracie.hhs.gov/technical-resources/44/coronavirus-sars-mers-2019-ncov/27

Cheers for posting.

Read through a bit and regards impaired lung efficiency.. Perhaps true, yet anecdotally my asthma has improved tremendously, as have many others since going LCHF..

hopefully if covid does befall us here, as expected, that MAY God willing give those of us on LCHF perhaps a small benefit .

Nice about it being sars2... Did not know that.
 

Bill_St

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Type of diabetes
Type 1
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Latest information from this week estimates the deaths to be closer to 1%, similar to flu. The original slightly higher rates were because they were not including the milder cases.
Deaths are more common in the elderly and those who are already ill, respiratory conditions such as asthma and coronary conditions appear to be a bigger risk than diabetes.
Anyone with well-controlled diabetes should have a lower risk.

Undoubtedly there is little direct information on COVID. The very wide differences in numbers released just yesterday does highlight this, although the ratios do not differ as much as the published rates.
But the first reference given above tells us for CoV-MERS that :
"The largest risk factor for increased disease severity and death is diabetes."

The second reference gives us :
"One study found that 15/17 (88%) individuals who had diabetes had a poor disease outcome characterized by intensive care unit admission or death compared with 7/18 (39%) individuals who had any type of nondiabetic comorbidity, which suggests that diabetes in particular is a major contributor to MERS-CoV disease severity"

In https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5094725/ Table 6 gives detail:
" univariate analysis (Table 6). Diabetes was the co-morbid condition most strongly associated with adverse outcome (p = 0.0002)."

It should be emphasised that most of these studies are naturally with respect to the earlier forms of Coronavirus - we need an early update with particular reference to COVID.

Those existing studies quoted above should not be ignored in further research
 
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NicoleC1971

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China has a type 2 rate of 11% so I guess that there will be more data soon. I know there's no vaccine and won't be until the current epidemic has passed, so the only thing I can do beyond trying not to get sneezed upon is get my flu vaccination done.
As with most things LCHF and diabetes, there isn't much data on morbidity in general yet though as the diet seems to mitigate many risk factors for chronic disease our optimism in the hypothesis seems valid and a better basis for action than sticking with the orthodox HCLF diet.
From this distance the whole incident is a fascinating example of the disasters and triumphs that can occur with a command and control economy that Dominic Cummings can only dream of.
 
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Indy51

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Unfortunately I'm at high risk because of a lung condition. The most annoying part for me is that it's seemingly impossible to buy masks in the expected outlets like pharmacies, at least in my area. All are out and have no idea when they'll be able to source more. Between the bushfires and now this virus, it's making life pretty scary. Would be nice if they'd kept some in reserve for people with conditions that depend on lung protection :rolleyes: [/ whinge]
 
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NicoleC1971

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Unfortunately I'm at high risk because of a lung condition. The most annoying part for me is that it's seemingly impossible to buy masks in the expected outlets like pharmacies, at least in my area. All are out and have no idea when they'll be able to source more. Between the bushfires and now this virus, it's making life pretty scary. Would be nice if they'd kept some in reserve for people with conditions that depend on lung protection :rolleyes: [/ whinge]
Sorry to hear that. Do you have many cases in Australia yet? Also heard that mask are only useful for an hour or so.
 

Bill_St

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Sorry to hear that. Do you have many cases in Australia yet? Also heard that mask are only useful for an hour or so.
A medical mask used correctly needs to be replaced every 4 hours, binned without touching the surface. Not many will use them correctly without training, so current advice is simply not to bother. It would lead to a false sense of security.
 
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Mike d

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@Indy51 ... I got mine (a pack) from ebay Australia during the bushfires ... brilliant and quick delivery.
 

jjraak

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A medical mask used correctly needs to be replaced every 4 hours, binned without touching the surface. Not many will use them correctly without training, so current advice is simply not to bother. It would lead to a false sense of security.
..

agree
Dr Bob was posted up a while back as saying the masks are only good IF used as above AND with protective glasses, as in googles or wrap around style.

droplets can also enter via tear ducts, apparently

not sure the masks have really helped the Chinese all that much..they do seem to use them religiously, tbh
 
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Mike d

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A medical mask used correctly needs to be replaced every 4 hours, binned without touching the surface. Not many will use them correctly without training, so current advice is simply not to bother. It would lead to a false sense of security.

Go thru blanketing fire smoke (pea soup) as we did for days on end, morning to night and you might change your mind.

Wouldn't say it unless I lived it. Mine worked
 

jjraak

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i think that it referred to the possibility of the virus being on the mask, so needing to be fitted and disposed of correctly.

I'm glad it worked for your situation.

terrible events down under.
 

Mike d

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Then my apologies. Yep .... when your town is surrounded by them at 3 a.m. in the morning, it's not for the faint hearted @jjraak .... sorry bill
 
D

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Unfortunately I'm at high risk because of a lung condition. The most annoying part for me is that it's seemingly impossible to buy masks in the expected outlets like pharmacies, at least in my area. All are out and have no idea when they'll be able to source more. Between the bushfires and now this virus, it's making life pretty scary. Would be nice if they'd kept some in reserve for people with conditions that depend on lung protection :rolleyes: [/ whinge]
I bought a box of P2 filters back in November from Amazon Australia, they helped me with the bush fire smoke with my COPD.

These ones I got are now unavailable now though.

https://www.amazon.com.au/Honeywell-1015846-Disposable-Superone-Valved/dp/B076DFKWJT

There are several that are available still though if you look through this Amazon page.

https://www.amazon.com.au/s?k=p2+face+masks&rh=n:5159338051&ref=nb_sb_noss

Bunning's also have / had them here in Bundaberg.
 
D

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Sorry to hear that. Do you have many cases in Australia yet? Also heard that mask are only useful for an hour or so.

We have 15 confimed cases so far.

As at 06:00 hrs on 14 February 2020, we have confirmed 15 cases of coronavirus (COVID-19) in Australia:

5 in Queensland
4 in New South Wales
4 in Victoria
2 in South Australia

6 of the earlier cases have recovered. The others are in a stable condition

https://www.health.gov.au/news/health-alerts/novel-coronavirus-2019-ncov-health-alert
 

jjraak

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uk now at 13 and northern Italy seems to be struggling

My go to site for updates.
https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/

  • 11 towns, 50,000 people, placed in lockdown.
  • Armed forces and police forces have been mobilized to form an insurmountable "health belt" around contagion areas. Roadblock violators risk up to a 3 months prison sentence.

    - Schools closed in Lombardy, Veneto, and in Trentino Alto Adige regions.

    - Universities closed in Piedmont and Emilia Romagna regions.

    - Carnival in Venice and all sport and public events in Veneto cancelled.

    - All public and private events, including sport, cultural, and religious events in Lombardy cancelled. Movie theaters closed.

    - "I think these three cases that have no contact with a primary carrier show how this virus is now ubiquitous so, as with flu symptoms, you get it and don't know who you got it from" said Veneto governon Luca Zaia who, in a separate comment, said "we are worried, drastic measures are needed."

    - "Serious mistake was made not to quarantine people who arrived in Italy from China" said Walter Ricciardi of the WHO, adding that "within two weeks we will know if we are facing an epidemic" and advising that, for the next two weeks, people "should avoid crowded
 

ringi

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similar to flu, gets a lot of press.
Can't think of the last time a country shut down over flu.

Think of 50% of people having flu at the same time, maybe 5% of the population needing medical care while 40% of the NHS staff are off sick. If that happens then the next year it will be no different to normal flu as enough people will already have had it to prevent it spreading fast.

So getting it is like getting flu, but many more people could get it in the same year all within a few weeks of each other.
 
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