Energy gels

johnme

Well-Known Member
Messages
192
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Treatment type
Diet only
New user here, T2 diagnosed about 15 years ago and given, I now realise, the usual daft diet advice at the time. I've lost 15 kilos in the last 3 months since I discovered LCHF dieting (or rather, Michael Mosley's book on controlling your blood sugar in 8 weeks and via that LCHF) after spending all those years trying like hell to lose weight. I wonder if anyone has experience with energy gels? I try to cycle abt 50 kilometers a couple of times a week. I discovered (this predates LCHF) that an energy gel 75mg caffeine and 22g of carbs half way round gets me to the end in good shape and - since I'm 25 k into a ride when I have it - it doesn't make my BS spike. But of course it is 22g of maltodextrose. Just what I shouldn't eat. How do other cyclists or similar deal with this? By the way I'm 64 so not exactly a competitive athlete!
 
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Clivethedrive

Well-Known Member
Messages
3,996
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Treatment type
Diet only
Dislikes
Jogging
Happy new year @johnme,welcome to the forum,I am a t2 myself and only discovered this life saving forum 3 years ago,1st i will request the info for new posters from @daisy1 have a good read and come back with your q's,and you will get answers,clive
 

daisy1

Legend
Messages
26,457
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Treatment type
Tablets (oral)
Dislikes
Cruelty towards animals.
@johnme

Hello John and welcome to the forum :) Here is the basic information we give to new members and I hope you will find it useful. Ask as many questions as you need to and someone will be able to help.


BASIC INFORMATION FOR NEW MEMBERS

Diabetes is the general term to describe people who have blood that is sweeter than normal. A number of different types of diabetes exist.

A diagnosis of diabetes tends to be a big shock for most of us. It’s far from the end of the world though and on this forum you'll find well over 220,000 people who are demonstrating this.

On the forum we have found that with the number of new people being diagnosed with diabetes each day, sometimes the NHS is not being able to give all the advice it would perhaps like to deliver - particularly with regards to people with type 2 diabetes.

The role of carbohydrate

Carbohydrates are a factor in diabetes because they ultimately break down into sugar (glucose) within our blood. We then need enough insulin to either convert the blood sugar into energy for our body, or to store the blood sugar as body fat.

If the amount of carbohydrate we take in is more than our body’s own (or injected) insulin can cope with, then our blood sugar will rise.

The bad news

Research indicates that raised blood sugar levels over a period of years can lead to organ damage, commonly referred to as diabetic complications.

The good news

People on the forum here have shown that there is plenty of opportunity to keep blood sugar levels from going too high. It’s a daily task but it’s within our reach and it’s well worth the effort.

Controlling your carbs

The info below is primarily aimed at people with type 2 diabetes, however, it may also be of benefit for other types of diabetes as well.

There are two approaches to controlling your carbs:

  • Reduce your carbohydrate intake
  • Choose ‘better’ carbohydrates
Reduce your carbohydrates

A large number of people on this forum have chosen to reduce the amount of carbohydrates they eat as they have found this to be an effective way of improving (lowering) their blood sugar levels.

The carbohydrates which tend to have the most pronounced effect on blood sugar levels tend to be starchy carbohydrates such as rice, pasta, bread, potatoes and similar root vegetables, flour based products (pastry, cakes, biscuits, battered food etc) and certain fruits.

Choosing better carbohydrates

The low glycaemic index diet is often favoured by healthcare professionals but some people with diabetes find that low GI does not help their blood sugar enough and may wish to cut out these foods altogether.

Read more on carbohydrates and diabetes.

Over 145,000 people have taken part in the Low Carb Program - a free 10 week structured education course that is helping people lose weight and reduce medication dependency by explaining the science behind carbs, insulin and GI.

Eating what works for you

Different people respond differently to different types of food. What works for one person may not work so well for another. The best way to see which foods are working for you is to test your blood sugar with a glucose meter.

To be able to see what effect a particular type of food or meal has on your blood sugar is to do a test before the meal and then test after the meal. A test 2 hours after the meal gives a good idea of how your body has reacted to the meal.

The blood sugar ranges recommended by NICE are as follows:

Blood glucose ranges for type 2 diabetes
  • Before meals: 4 to 7 mmol/l
  • 2 hours after meals: under 8.5 mmol/l
Blood glucose ranges for type 1 diabetes (adults)
  • Before meals: 4 to 7 mmol/l
  • 2 hours after meals: under 9 mmol/l
Blood glucose ranges for type 1 diabetes (children)
  • Before meals: 4 to 8 mmol/l
  • 2 hours after meals: under 10 mmol/l
However, those that are able to, may wish to keep blood sugar levels below the NICE after meal targets.

Access to blood glucose test strips

The NICE guidelines suggest that people newly diagnosed with type 2 diabetes should be offered:

  • structured education to every person and/or their carer at and around the time of diagnosis, with annual reinforcement and review
  • self-monitoring of plasma glucose to a person newly diagnosed with type 2 diabetes only as an integral part of his or her self-management education

Therefore both structured education and self-monitoring of blood glucose should be offered to people with type 2 diabetes. Read more on getting access to blood glucose testing supplies.

You may also be interested to read questions to ask at a diabetic clinic.

Note: This post has been edited from Sue/Ken's post to include up to date information.
 

AtkinsMo

Well-Known Member
Messages
591
Type of diabetes
Prediabetes
Treatment type
Diet only
The experts in the field of endurance sports and a low carb diet are Phinney and Volek, the relevant book is 'The Art and Science of Low Carb Performance'. One of them is a researcher in diabetes, both are interested in cycling in particular. Their most recent randomised control trial was based on elite athlete cyclists. I may be able to source some internet references or you tube videos, amongst my saved 'favourites'.
 
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AtkinsMo

Well-Known Member
Messages
591
Type of diabetes
Prediabetes
Treatment type
Diet only

johnme

Well-Known Member
Messages
192
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Treatment type
Diet only
Thank you for those responses all, and the steer towards Phinney. Yes, thanks Daisy1, I knew much of that, but it would have been a lot easier if I had found this site, you and read that elegantly condensed form instead of spending years in ignorance and then chasing round the internet. Of course the reason it took so many years is that I had been so badly steered by medics - nurses and dieticians of course but also my GP who has spent all of that time literally repeating to me 'it's just the science, calories in and calories out.' Water under the bridge now.

ps 'elite athlete cyclists' is quite a long way from me! But I will learn from them
 

johnme

Well-Known Member
Messages
192
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Treatment type
Diet only
here's a find - anyone with a kindle and Amazon prime can borrow the Phinney and Volek book. I have (in a fit of insomnia).
 
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Kyambala

Well-Known Member
Messages
382
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Treatment type
Insulin
New user here, T2 diagnosed about 15 years ago and given, I now realise, the usual daft diet advice at the time. I've lost 15 kilos in the last 3 months since I discovered LCHF dieting (or rather, Michael Mosley's book on controlling your blood sugar in 8 weeks and via that LCHF) after spending all those years trying like hell to lose weight. I wonder if anyone has experience with energy gels? I try to cycle abt 50 kilometers a couple of times a week. I discovered (this predates LCHF) that an energy gel 75mg caffeine and 22g of carbs half way round gets me to the end in good shape and - since I'm 25 k into a ride when I have it - it doesn't make my BS spike. But of course it is 22g of maltodextrose. Just what I shouldn't eat. How do other cyclists or similar deal with this? By the way I'm 64 so not exactly a competitive athlete!

Hello Johnme & welcome to the Forum. Seems like we have both been in the same boat. I was diagnosed about 20 years ago and spent a long time struggling with blood sugar - sometimes going up as high as 28. My long term BS was usually about 9 and my Doctor was satisfied if I could keep it under 10 (which is far too high).

I have been on Insulin now about 4 years and was pleased when it came down to 8.6 (which is still too high). Six months ago my Doctor put me on Metformin slow release along with my Insulin and it came down to 7.3 (which is still too high) but my Doctor was singing my praises.

About a year or so ago I discovered this Forum and have learned a lot about Diabetes which I did not know. When I return to the UK in a couple of weeks time I am going to try this LCHF diet to see if it works for me the way it has worked for so many on this forum.

Because of this Forum I have stopped taking STATINS and feel much better for it. I am 75 and haven't ridden a bicycle in many years - the car is so converient. Perhaps I might try that too.

Thank you for your post.
 

Kyambala

Well-Known Member
Messages
382
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Treatment type
Insulin
New user here, T2 diagnosed about 15 years ago and given, I now realise, the usual daft diet advice at the time. I've lost 15 kilos in the last 3 months since I discovered LCHF dieting (or rather, Michael Mosley's book on controlling your blood sugar in 8 weeks and via that LCHF) after spending all those years trying like hell to lose weight. I wonder if anyone has experience with energy gels? I try to cycle abt 50 kilometers a couple of times a week. I discovered (this predates LCHF) that an energy gel 75mg caffeine and 22g of carbs half way round gets me to the end in good shape and - since I'm 25 k into a ride when I have it - it doesn't make my BS spike. But of course it is 22g of maltodextrose. Just what I shouldn't eat. How do other cyclists or similar deal with this? By the way I'm 64 so not exactly a competitive athlete!

John - what is an energy gel?
 
S

Sean01

Guest
New user here, T2 diagnosed about 15 years ago and given, I now realise, the usual daft diet advice at the time. I've lost 15 kilos in the last 3 months since I discovered LCHF dieting (or rather, Michael Mosley's book on controlling your blood sugar in 8 weeks and via that LCHF) after spending all those years trying like hell to lose weight. I wonder if anyone has experience with energy gels? I try to cycle abt 50 kilometers a couple of times a week. I discovered (this predates LCHF) that an energy gel 75mg caffeine and 22g of carbs half way round gets me to the end in good shape and - since I'm 25 k into a ride when I have it - it doesn't make my BS spike. But of course it is 22g of maltodextrose. Just what I shouldn't eat. How do other cyclists or similar deal with this? By the way I'm 64 so not exactly a competitive athlete!
Hi - I cycle on a stationary bike - not as much as you - maybe 30-40 minutes a day - 2-3 times a week, more when I can't be bothered with a treadmill. ( I exercise at least once a day.) You are right about the problem of wanting the energy to finish the ride but having the dilema of eating something that ios not good for you.. Completing the ride is important for a number of reasons - especially heart health and managing blood pressure and beats per minute, but eating energy gel to do extra work seems to cancel itself out.
Caffeine is a possible answer. Also you may possibly just need an adrenaline kick to get the muscles working harder (flight or fight etc) Some use music (there are companies that put together play lists based on your preferences and beats per minute - runners use them a lot. I watch dvds when I'm on the bike or treadmill - mainly sword and sandal stuff - Spartacus, game of Thrones - anything with vikings or Romans etc but I have been known to get a bit too absorbed in the fighting and have fallen of the treadmill once or twice - so be careful with your choices. Cold water may help - it will be refreshing and may wake you up when you need a bit of a boost - other than that - self motivation - play games in your head to keep you going. I did the Loch Ness Marathon in 2012 - 7 hrs 24 mins. Some of my training involved 6 hours on a treadmill - energy is an issue but so is the mental side - You have to be creative to see what you can do to finish without having to eat calories in order to burn calories. That mentlity works in an endurance event, but when you have diabetes, the endurance event is Life.

Somewhere out there is the answer - and it is the brain that you need to motivate, not the legs - Good luck on your journey.

T2 (Oct 15) Metformin, diet (mainly eggs and spinach) and a lot of exercise - treadmill/bike and powerlifting (long story)
 

johnme

Well-Known Member
Messages
192
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Treatment type
Diet only
Thanks all for further replies.

Gels are little doses of carbs in plastic sachets beloved of cyclists. I have downloaded the Phinney etc book and think I see how and why I don't need them. I'll have to act on it mind you, which is different.

The trouble I had with carbs is I was anxious about running out of puff 25k from home (ie a 50k loop). I've hardly ridden this week as I don't fancy coming off the bike on ice, but today (Saturday) is rated 6+ degC so as soon as it starts to get light I'm going to give it a go. I'll take the sachets in my jacket for anxiety's sake but leave them there.

I don't use music Sean because I'm a bit anxious abt hearing other traffic. Maybe if I start doing it in the hall I'd try that.
 

Robbity

Expert
Messages
6,700
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Treatment type
Diet only
If you eat an appropriate low carb high fat diet, you should be able convert your body (back!) to burning fats rather than carbs, and this way you have a much greater source of stored fuel for energy so you no longer need to keep topping up with carbs.

Robbity
 
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Kyambala

Well-Known Member
Messages
382
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Treatment type
Insulin
If you eat an appropriate low carb high fat diet, you should be able convert your body (back!) to burning fats rather than carbs, and this way you have a much greater source of stored fuel for energy so you no longer need to keep topping up with carbs.

Robbity

Nicely put
 

Indy51

Expert
Messages
5,540
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Treatment type
Diet only
If you search for "low carb performance" in Youtube, you'll get many videos - by Steve Phinney, Jeff Volek and others like Peter Attia.
 

Kyambala

Well-Known Member
Messages
382
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Treatment type
Insulin
I have just been reading the UK “Asda Guide for People with Diabetes”. It says:

1. Avoid being overweight

2. Starchy foods should make up the largest part of your diet.

3. Eat less fat, especially saturated fat.

4. Added sugar (sucrose) is acceptable.

On page 4 it says: “base your meals around rice, potato, bread, pasta or cereal”.

On page 5 it says: “All rice, pasta, bread, chapattis, cereals and potatoes .... are great foods”.

Page 6 says: “BREAKFAST: Fruit juice, chopped fruit on cereal, tomatoes on toast, fresh fruit e.g grapefruit, bananas”.

Page 7 recommends: “Semi Skinned & Skimmed Milk & Light Yorguts”.
Page 8 recommends: “Peas, beans, oats, pasta and rice dishes, curries and mince dishes”.

Page 9 suggests: “Diet Coke, Jams, Biscuits, Malted Milk, Scones and plain cakes. Pizzas & Pies”.

Page 10 suggests: “Banana & Date Loaf”.

Page 11 suggests: “ Apple & Pear Crumble. Marmalade Carrot Loaf”


This is the advice from “Commerce”. Now, what are the comments and advice from Diabetics “who have been there = experts”?
 

Kyambala

Well-Known Member
Messages
382
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Treatment type
Insulin
If you search for "low carb performance" in Youtube, you'll get many videos - by Steve Phinney, Jeff Volek and others like Peter Attia.

Hello Indy. Perhaps we should send your Post to Asda UK.
 

Deespee23

Well-Known Member
Messages
280
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Treatment type
Diet only
I have just been reading the UK “Asda Guide for People with Diabetes”. It says:

1. Avoid being overweight

2. Starchy foods should make up the largest part of your diet.

3. Eat less fat, especially saturated fat.

4. Added sugar (sucrose) is acceptable.

On page 4 it says: “base your meals around rice, potato, bread, pasta or cereal”.

On page 5 it says: “All rice, pasta, bread, chapattis, cereals and potatoes .... are great foods”.

Page 6 says: “BREAKFAST: Fruit juice, chopped fruit on cereal, tomatoes on toast, fresh fruit e.g grapefruit, bananas”.

Page 7 recommends: “Semi Skinned & Skimmed Milk & Light Yorguts”.
Page 8 recommends: “Peas, beans, oats, pasta and rice dishes, curries and mince dishes”.

Page 9 suggests: “Diet Coke, Jams, Biscuits, Malted Milk, Scones and plain cakes. Pizzas & Pies”.

Page 10 suggests: “Banana & Date Loaf”.

Page 11 suggests: “ Apple & Pear Crumble. Marmalade Carrot Loaf”


This is the advice from “Commerce”. Now, what are the comments and advice from Diabetics “who have been there = experts”?

Not sure whether this is funny or just tragic! Have you thought of getting in touch with ASDA to put 'em right?
Oooops - forgot - this'll be the money talking.....and it can talk louder than us!:rolleyes:
 

Kyambala

Well-Known Member
Messages
382
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Treatment type
Insulin
Not sure whether this is funny or just tragic! Have you thought of getting in touch with ASDA to put 'em right?
Oooops - forgot - this'll be the money talking.....and it can talk louder than us!:rolleyes:

Thanks Deespee. At present I am in Uganda - but I will have a chat with them soon. But ASDA is part of Walmart which I believe is the biggest Supermarket Chain in the world - what chance have I got?