Frank discussions Poll

this is quite frankly the best thing that has come out of a consensus on this forum in my time here.. a shame administration aren't supporting this with the community..

seeing as those who also helped administration with the type II test strips poll are the primary drivers here you would think that admin might listen to its type II community and support this message with them?

Xyzzy ...
Can I ask you this question ?

What if we have a member(s) who is/are too terrified to accept the reality of the worst of the facts .

They are so traumatised to relax trust info/frank/blunt debates to even attempt to control their diabetes more.
What 'if' they cant sleep at night from sheer fright and genuine worries .

Is this a positive way of action to be so overtly frank/blunt in debates.

Yes - there 'will' + be such persons experiencing this.
They may be few - but they are here and amongst us all.

It isnt about us mods/admin trying to prevent things being discussed etc...
But we 'do' have to remember the few that are in this state of trauma mentally/emotionally.
Not EVERYONE is able/ready to accept or digest things so raw.
This is 'why' we ask and speak of sensitivity with it all.

Anna.

anna29 said:

Xyzzy ...
Can I ask you this question ?

What if we have a member(s) who is/are too terrified to accept the reality of the worst of the facts .

They are so traumatised to relax trust info/frank/blunt debates to even attempt to control their diabetes more.
What 'if' they cant sleep at night from sheer fright and genuine worries .

Is this a positive way of action to be so overtly frank/blunt in debates.

Yes - there 'will' + be such persons experiencing this.
They may be few - but they are here and amongst us all.

It isnt about us mods/admin trying to prevent things being discussed etc...
But we 'do' have to remember the few that are in this state of trauma mentally/emotionally.
Not EVERYONE is able/ready to accept or digest things so raw.
This is 'why' we ask and speak of sensitivity with it all.

Anna.

Click to expand...

Being terrified of complications and ignoring them wont make them go away, it will probably make them worse - if they dont accept that they have a condition that needs to be dealt with.

Molly-coddling them wont do anyone any good in the long run, in my opinion.

What exactly are they terrified of? Getting complications? Then they should come here and learn about the different ways to control their blood sugar and find what works for them.

If there are members who are that traumatised by reality, then I think they probably need psychological help dealing with their issues. I doubt if any amount of sensitivity would help.

anna29 said:

Xyzzy ...
Can I ask you this question ?

What if we have a member(s) who is/are too terrified to accept the reality of the worst of the facts .

They are so traumatised to relax trust info/frank/blunt debates to even attempt to control their diabetes more.
What 'if' they cant sleep at night from sheer fright and genuine worries .

Is this a positive way of action to be so overtly frank/blunt in debates.

Yes - there 'will' + be such persons experiencing this.
They may be few - but they are here and amongst us all.

It isnt about us mods/admin trying to prevent things being discussed etc...
But we 'do' have to remember the few that are in this state of trauma mentally/emotionally.
Not EVERYONE is able/ready to accept or digest things so raw.
This is 'why' we ask and speak of sensitivity with it all.

Anna.

Click to expand...

So answer me this question then Anna..

When individuals such as these are targeted by other members including a moderator.. used and manipulated and this is reported to the forum admin was no action taken? Yet the fact that these vulnerable people are here is used as a defense for protecting people from the truth and moderating members and posts? sounds like double standards to me I believe my hypocrisy meter has just blown a fuse.

Someone very famous once said:
"if you remain neutral in situations of injustice then you have chosen the side of the oppressor"..

Choosing not to act or say something makes those people no better than those who perpetrated the vile acts of manipulation against our members.

Anna said:

What if we have a member(s) who is/are too terrified to accept the reality of the worst of the facts.

Click to expand...

That's life. We all cope differently. If the whole world adapted to pander to those that are most sensitive we'd soon enough be in a world of trouble.

Actually, after reading the posts that were made before mine, I think Ashleigh and Indy have put much better than me.

Indy51 said:

If there are members who are that traumatised by reality, then I think they probably need psychological help dealing with their issues. I doubt if any amount of sensitivity would help.

Click to expand...

Exactly Asleigh. ctually this poll nd Pneu's comments are very apposite. It occurred to me earlier hat the testing Strips
Petition in itself could be a source of anxiety to many. They may be nmade to lose trust in the advice given by their HCPs because hey are being denied what many consider o be an essenial tool in controlling diabetes.
In fact T"s are actively discouraged from testing at all on various spurious grounds/

It would surely be better to tell peope hat testing is helpful but the NHS can't fund it - in the same way as many of us are advised o buy our own blood pressure monitors .

If the HCP s are wrong about moniors then maybe they could be wrong about other aspects of dibetes care...
This might upset sensitive newly dignosed person. How o help these people without lying to them or undermining their rust in the NHS and DUK advice?

I must say finding out that I had been given advice which didn't help at all but made mtters worse was the most difficult thing for me. Had I been old this at the ery beginning I don;'t think I could have hndled it.
I was issued immeditely with a meter and strips . Had I been told by the HCPs that I oughn't to test I doubt I would have in the bsence of any oher advic
If someone is searching for advice on he internet then the implicaion is that they wnt advice. Just as we cannot know just how much information hat individual can take we don't know he best way o presen the information to that person.
So many of us are honest and straightforward.

Had I had any idea that a sensitive poster such as Mongoose would be uoset by feeling he ws being forcefed then I would have requested admin to delete all threads menioning any sort of dietary advice.

t that rate here wouldn't be much left. Someone somewhere is going to be upset by anything posted , however it is phrased for reasons personal to them >

My sister is also a T2. She is needle-phobic nd won't test. She can't even read abut it let lone look t my meter and strips.
Mybe the petition shuld be withdrawn because she occasoionally reads the forum . Together with all references o blood ests , of course!
It is an impossible stance . There re many people posting here . Why don't we matter s much as those unknowns who "might " be upset by our "lack of sensiiviy.

I wonder hat such sensitive souls mabnage to eist on a day to day basis. If they really do exist.
Now don't get upset children. we re all friends really. Shouldn't you be in school anyhow?

Indy51 said:

If there are members who are that traumatised by reality, then I think they probably need psychological help dealing with their issues. I doubt if any amount of sensitivity would help.

Click to expand...

Exactly Asleigh. ctually this poll nd Pneu's comments are very apposite. It occurred to me earlier hat the testing Strips
Petition in itself could be a source of anxiety to many. They may be nmade to lose trust in the advice given by their HCPs because hey are being denied what many consider o be an essenial tool in controlling diabetes.
In fact T"s are actively discouraged from testing at all on various spurious grounds/

It would surely be better to tell peope hat testing is helpful but the NHS can't fund it - in the same way as many of us are advised o buy our own blood pressure monitors .

If the HCP s are wrong about moniors then maybe they could be wrong about other aspects of dibetes care...
This might upset sensitive newly dignosed person. How o help these people without lying to them or undermining their rust in the NHS and DUK advice?

I must say finding out that I had been given advice which didn't help at all but made mtters worse was the most difficult thing for me. Had I been old this at the ery beginning I don;'t think I could have hndled it.
I was issued immeditely with a meter and strips . Had I been told by the HCPs that I oughn't to test I doubt I would have in the bsence of any oher advic
If someone is searching for advice on he internet then the implicaion is that they wnt advice. Just as we cannot know just how much information hat individual can take we don't know he best way o presen the information to that person.
So many of us are honest and straightforward.

Had I had any idea that a sensitive poster such as Mongoose would be uoset by feeling he ws being forcefed then I would have requested admin to delete all threads menioning any sort of dietary advice.

t that rate here wouldn't be much left. Someone somewhere is going to be upset by anything posted , however it is phrased for reasons personal to them >

My sister is also a T2. She is needle-phobic nd won't test. She can't even read abut it let lone look t my meter and strips.
Mybe the petition shuld be withdrawn because she occasoionally reads the forum . Together with all references o blood ests , of course!
It is an impossible stance . There re many people posting here . Why don't we matter s much as those unknowns who "might " be upset by our "lack of sensiiviy.

I wonder hat such sensitive souls mabnage to eist on a day to day basis. If they really do exist.
Now don't get upset children. we re all friends really. Shouldn't you be in school anyhow?

The unfortunate point is that frank discussion and a forum where problem members were removed is counter productive to the business that owns this forum... It is in their interest to generate traffic and get people to this site... it's in their interest to try and stop eat to your meter becoming this forums mantra..

A quote from SiteFinders the owners of this site (go and have a look at what other sorts of websites they own....) about DCUK...

"Lead generation is simple. Why? When you're using targeted domains and expert user profiling you know exactly how to approach your visitor. More than that, you know what they want; and you know why they've just popped into your store. Our sites hosting forms have unique visitor to lead conversion rates of over 30%. Our front end team are world experts in maximising lead generation conversion."

Does it sound like community is top of their list of priorities?

I wish administration would just be honest rather than trying to protect the ridiculous position they have taken... people are angry because they can see that what is going on is unjustified and not fair.. that policy is not applied evenly.. that different people get different treatment and that the overwhelmingly active membership on this board that support "eat to your meter" get treated like 2nd class citizens.

They can dress what they are doing up however they like.. it is censorship via the backdoor.. who wants to be on a forum whose policy is "you can't say anything in case it worries people"...

Unbeliever said:

There re many people posting here . Why don't we matter s much as those unknowns who "might " be upset by our "lack of sensiiviy.

I wonder hat such sensitive souls mabnage to eist on a day to day basis. If they really do exist.

Click to expand...

Exacty, they probably dont.

Hi all. Have I been asleep for the last week or two? I haven't noticed any posting that is negative towards 'eat to your meter'? There have been criticisms of low-carbing posts which I understand but don't necessarily agree with but nothing I've seen about 'eat to your meter'. With regard to sensitivity issues I agree with most of the posts above. Diabetes is a serious illness that needs to be taken control of by the 'owner' to avoid the sad end results. When I post to newbies I try to be fairly direct but I hope sensitive if I can see someone who is in denial; usually concerning their weight sometimes their love afair with sweet carbs. Most of the reactions I've seen are positive and I think for the greater majority it works. The majority of newbies have just been diagnosed and have been given no info by the HCPs (join the club). They are not so much shocked as lost. By giving them a range of facts based on experience by many contributors appears to work by giving them a context to work from.

anna29 said:

What if we have a member(s) who is/are too terrified to accept the reality of the worst of the facts .

They are so traumatised to relax trust info/frank/blunt debates to even attempt to control their diabetes more.
What 'if' they cant sleep at night from sheer fright and genuine worries .

Click to expand...

Come on. If they are really like that, then it means they already know about complications, otherwise they wouldn't be so terrified. What they need is the message that yes, that is a possible outcome, but if you get your BGs under control you have an excellent chance of avoiding it. That is likely to make them feel better. Pretending it doesn't exist as a problem won't, because they simply won't believe you! The only people who may receive posts about complications if BGs are ignored (so called "grim reaper" tactics) are the blase ones who think it's not a problem, and need to know it is.

The eat to your meter mantra is possibly THE most important advice any diabetic can be given. There is absolutely no other way of keeping your BG in check without doing so. How that is achieved is personal, but the mantra remains the same no matter what.

Frank discussion is what this country was built on. Have you seem MP's at question time? Waving their order papers and acting like overgrown children, shouting over the top of each other. From that chaos (sometimes) order and sense can be made. People the world over enjoy debate, maybe not as free as we do in the west, but even within families, discussions take place. Sometimes I think it could be prudent to let a debate rage, so long as it doesn't get personal, that for me is a bridge to far.

borofergie said:

Sarah69 said:

I'm glad there is someone else who says they won't strictly low carb. I have tried it but cuts out too much food I like. I certainly wouldn't be able to eat like that for the rest of my life!

Click to expand...

That's true. But please be aware, especially as a diabetic, that your choice of what you eat has a direct influence on exactly how long "the rest of your life" will probably be.

Click to expand...

I think the question of whether this type of question, for instance, is appropriate on a forum like this still remains?

Read one way it's helpful advice
Read another way, it reads like a threat

benedict said:

borofergie said:

Sarah69 said:

I'm glad there is someone else who says they won't strictly low carb. I have tried it but cuts out too much food I like. I certainly wouldn't be able to eat like that for the rest of my life!

Click to expand...

That's true. But please be aware, especially as a diabetic, that your choice of what you eat has a direct influence on exactly how long "the rest of your life" will probably be.

Click to expand...

I think the question of whether this type of question, for instance, is appropriate on a forum like this still remains?

Read one way it's helpful advice
Read another way, it reads like a threat

Click to expand...

Sorry, I genuinely can't see a threat. For a diabetic what they eat could well have a direct influence on their future. If they eat so BG's are sky high, then they could well be inline for complications. I am not suggesting any one diet here, simply that if any of us eat to where we have high BG a lot of the time, that does damage our bodies - fact!

Not sure I understand, benedict?

Borofergie's comment can be read as threatening - the same way as a parent telling their kids not to play with fire is threatening.

Sarah69's comment, is the equivalent of the child saying "I won't be able to avoid playing with fire all of my life".

benedict said:

borofergie said:

Sarah69 said:

I'm glad there is someone else who says they won't strictly low carb. I have tried it but cuts out too much food I like. I certainly wouldn't be able to eat like that for the rest of my life!

Click to expand...

That's true. But please be aware, especially as a diabetic, that your choice of what you eat has a direct influence on exactly how long "the rest of your life" will probably be.

Click to expand...

I think the question of whether this type of question, for instance, is appropriate on a forum like this still remains?

Read one way it's helpful advice
Read another way, it reads like a threat

Click to expand...

:shock:

Well it just goes to show, that if you want to, you can take anything out of context and twist it to mean whatever you want to.

I'd hope that, after almost 3000 posts to this forum, you'd realise that I'm not the type of person to threaten anyone with anything. I think that my posting record speaks for itself, and I think you've delberately taken this out of context to prove a poorly made point.

If you really think that I was trying to threaten Sarah69 Benedict, I think that it would be better off for everyone if you just carried out your threat and gave me that lifetime ban. If you listen very carefully, you'll hear the sound of me not caring very much.

Not questioning your intentions borofergie, I'm looking to get a rounded sense check on how people interpret such a reply.

Benedict