Frowned at by Nurse when I mentioned LCHF

[Li4m79]

this seems to be a very common thing, medical practitioners frowning up the thought that someone might want to control their diabetes with diet and not meds!!

I've only been diagnosed for a few weeks now but have been reading, watching videos etc regarding diets.

Upon diagnosis i was put on Glipizide as my BG was resting at about 24, A week after that they put me on Metaformmin as well as the Glipizide. I have been following quite a strict LCHF diet, and as a result gave myself a Hypo the other day after taking my glipizide. So on one hand my diet is doing what it should and bringing my sugars down, and yet the nurses are telling me to change my diet back and eat more carbs but stay on medication!! I am supposed to be on metaformman twice a day, and i'm very lazy with it, maybe 1 a day, sometimes none. Since I am type 2 I never received a monitor so I purchased a Codefree last week, it got delivered 2 days ago (and sods law, they gave me a monitor today as I mentioned the hypo, so i have 2 now ) so i have been checking frequently, and i seem to fluctuate between 6 and 9 throughout the day.

But back on topic, its so frustrating that I'm doing what steps I feel are the right ones and i'm being told things from professionals that I think is outdated info and pushed to be on meds for ever. I know that many many diabetics are on meds for ever, but many have been able to get really good control over their BG, and I think I stand a good chance at doing this. Even the big pile of "New to diabetes" bumpf they gave me was dated 2009....

my rant is over, just needed to vent a little!!!

 

[TorqPenderloin]

You mentioned that you were only diagnosed a few weeks ago...try to remember to keep that in mind. It's awesome that you're having such solid results, but this is a long game rather than a short one. Assuming your next a1c is a significant improvement, use that as leverage to ask for a reduction in your medication.

As far as the low-carb approach, it's to be expected that not every medical professional with see it as a good thing. In my GP appointment last month, one of the nurses gave me a lecture about how a high fat diet was bad. Then, my endocrinology nurse praised me when I discussed it with her.

Doctors and nurses are people too and they don't always have the answers. Keep up the good work, drop your a1c, and use that as prove that you can control things with diet-only.

 

[Li4m79]

I'll jump through the hoops until I get a much clearer understanding about my levels, and how easily they are affected by things and what those things are... I guess being taken off the glipizide is one step on this journey!! roll on a month or so, so I can get another a1c and really see whats going on

 

[wookie101]

Hey up, I got diagnosed a year or so ago, found this site, absorbed what everyone told me, bought myself a monitor and immediately started testing to see what foods (for me) where the worst ones so as to cut them out (as we're all different) but to enable 'me' to take control and immediately put me on the right paths.

It sounds like you're doing the same, so well done man! The only thing I'll say is listen a bit to monitor and if your body (while you're giving it this workout on the LCHF) if it says you need just a bi more food, then eat that salad or yoghurt (1Kg from Lidl's is cheap and does the trick). I adjusted my diet and also cut down the portion sizes, but I wasn't perfect and occasionally strayed but in the end I'm happy with the results.

Take care and I'll just @daisy so that she can attach her usual help tips, as they are excellent.

You're amongst friends, keep posting and asking questions

 

[librarising]

Well done Liam, you're doing everything right.
Sadly, too many HCPs are not as informed or up-to-date as members on this forum, so you'll have have to practise that 'disagreeing with a smile.'
However, more and more are learning about the validity of an LCHF approach. In the last six weeks, when my T2 turned into a LADA, I told both a GP and two Diabetes nurses about my low-carbing, and there was a simple acceptance of it. Quite surprised me !
One of the main effects of low-carbing is a reduction in the need for medication, so monitor your BS levels and if a reduction is necessary, that's better than taking unnecessary carbs.

You sound like a self-educator, which can only help you. You'll end up feeling you know more than the HCP dealing with you. There's so much good information out there these days. The days of higher carbs and the demonisation of saturated fats are numbered!

Keep up the good work !
Geoff

 

[Catlady19]

Well done @Li4m79 you are obviously approaching this with the right frame of mind, just remember Rome wasn't built in a day!

 

[eddie1968]

I don't do LCHF or any other diet but I am shocked that your personal choices are being debated and challenged by a nurse or doctor. If it works for you and lowers your HbA1c's and makes you feel better then who are they to question it ? It's your body and you should make informed choices to what you want health wise.

 

[Sean01]

this seems to be a very common thing, medical practitioners frowning up the thought that someone might want to control their diabetes with diet and not meds!!

I've only been diagnosed for a few weeks now but have been reading, watching videos etc regarding diets.

Upon diagnosis i was put on Glipizide as my BG was resting at about 24, A week after that they put me on Metaformmin as well as the Glipizide. I have been following quite a strict LCHF diet, and as a result gave myself a Hypo the other day after taking my glipizide. So on one hand my diet is doing what it should and bringing my sugars down, and yet the nurses are telling me to change my diet back and eat more carbs but stay on medication!! I am supposed to be on metaformman twice a day, and i'm very lazy with it, maybe 1 a day, sometimes none. Since I am type 2 I never received a monitor so I purchased a Codefree last week, it got delivered 2 days ago (and sods law, they gave me a monitor today as I mentioned the hypo, so i have 2 now ) so i have been checking frequently, and i seem to fluctuate between 6 and 9 throughout the day.

But back on topic, its so frustrating that I'm doing what steps I feel are the right ones and i'm being told things from professionals that I think is outdated info and pushed to be on meds for ever. I know that many many diabetics are on meds for ever, but many have been able to get really good control over their BG, and I think I stand a good chance at doing this. Even the big pile of "New to diabetes" bumpf they gave me was dated 2009....

my rant is over, just needed to vent a little!!!

I'll keep it short - uncharacteristic for me but here goes:

1. The only person who can truly tell you what it feels like to have your leg bitten but a shark is somebody who has survived a shark bite. The problem is that if you read enough about shark bite victims you can easily fall into the trap of thinking you are an expert.
2. Highly trained people often think that their tool kit of knowledge and skills is the sole solution to any problem. You should never get in a boat designed and built by a brick layer!

We have a medical profession that thinks that the only answer is medication and their way or no way. Incidently, we have a medical profession that is ever so slightly influenced by the drug companies.


But fear not newbie - welcome not to the land of milk and honey but the land of full fat cream and getting your energy from the right combination of fats, not carbs. For best results - combine with exercise.

Trust me, that was short!

 

[britishpub]

medical practitioners frowning

You're lucky mate.

My GP laughed at me, as if I'd told the funniest joke of all time.

 

[Mickyb0703]

I met a public health dietician yesterday while at karate and when I mentioned I had been diagnosised type 2 and was doing lchf, you would have thought lucifer had walked in the room and was stealing her first born.I am a senior HCP in the NHS and I'm sorry to say from the reaction I received yesterday I believe it will be a long time before the NHS moves away from its medication dependency, and maybe even longer before dieticians endorse it as a way forward.
I've been in health for 27 years and the information I have gained from this forum has been invaluable thanks

 

[JohnEGreen]

1. Highly trained people often think that their tool kit of knowledge and skills is the sole solution to any problem. You should never get in a boat designed and built by a brick layer!

Funny thing is one of the guys on my podiatry course built a boat in his back garden out of concrete and sailed it to the Caribbean and back.

 

[TorqPenderloin]

Mahesh, I appreciate you taking the time to share your qualified opinions and thoughts on the matter.

One thing that stood out to me was your mention of people with type 2 diabetes (not on a sulfonylurea or insulin) not needing to test frequently as their risk of hypos is extremely low. While I would agree with that, I would argue that there is a different reason that testing is important.

While the glycemic index is a general guideline for how your blood sugar will respond to food, it's certainly not a rule. Watermelon is a perfect example of a high GI food that has a very low glycemic load largely due to the high water content. Plus, you have to also consider that each person will respond differently to different types of foods.

Testing blood sugar effectively allows people to not only better understand how GI/GL impacts their blood sugar, but it also allows them to customize those indexes by quantifying how high their blood sugar spikes after a particular meal.

While an a1c test would effectively measure their progress on a macro level, it would fail at helping people realize what events throughout a typical day contribute to hyperglycemia and what events contribute to normal blood glucose levels.

 

[Dr__Mesh]

Dear TorqPenderloin,

Many thanks for your reply to my message. Even though I may be a doctor, what a doctor can learn from the experiences and knowledge of the patient is great, and I thank you for sharing your views with me as I have learnt something new.

This is something that I can certainly go away and research more on, and hopefully benefit my own patients with

Many thanks

Mahesh

 

[bulkbiker]

Hi everyone!

My name's Mahesh, and I'm a GP.

With respect to the LCHF diet, I must be honest, I don't know much about it.

Mahesh

Hi Dr Mahesh
You are quite brave to announce your GP status here as a lot of us have had less than ideal treatment from your colleagues.
You say you know little about the LCHF diet but then suggest it causes high cholesterol .. it may or may not and that may or may not be a bad thing but before you **** it forever I suggest you read some of the success stories on this forum to see what some of us have managed to do by going against your advice.
There are a few GP's in the UK who have realised that the NHS mantra may not be correct. Dr Rangan Chatterjee for example and Dr David Unwin also on the forum (recently shortlisted for the BMJ awards for his treatment methods for type 2 diabetes). I would suggest you read some of their work before damning what we have achieved. Your vegan diet may well suit you and your low GI carbs as well but you don't have Type 2 diabetes I assume. Many of us have found by testing our bloods (mainly self funded because our GP's refuse to prescribe test strips) that Low GI carbs have much the same effect as high GI carbs.. probably because they are carbs!
I am not trying to be nasty and welcome you joining the forum but your opening posts don't do you any favours.
So have a read of this forum
http://www.diabetes.co.uk/forum/category/success-stories-and-testimonials.43/
you might find out some surprising facts.. anecdotal it is true.. but real world.
In the meantime welcome.. we're pretty friendly and don't bite too often..
By the way these are all my own opinions and in no way do I reflect the views of other forum members..(except where they agree of course)
Regards
Mark

 

[bulkbiker]

Sorry @Li4m79 for hijacking your thread a bit.. something I do far too often.. apologies.
Regards
Mark

 

[Li4m79]

Sorry @Li4m79 for hijacking your thread a bit.. something I do far too often.. apologies.
Regards
Mark

No problem at all.. .. Although its not really hijacking when you have what I feel a valid point.

 

[Dr__Mesh]

Hi Dr Mahesh
You are quite brave to announce your GP status here as a lot of us have had less than ideal treatment from your colleagues.
You say you know little about the LCHF diet but then suggest it causes high cholesterol .. it may or may not and that may or may not be a bad thing but before you **** it forever I suggest you read some of the success stories on this forum to see what some of us have managed to do by going against your advice.
There are a few GP's in the UK who have realised that the NHS mantra may not be correct. Dr Rangan Chatterjee for example and Dr David Unwin also on the forum (recently shortlisted for the BMJ awards for his treatment methods for type 2 diabetes). I would suggest you read some of their work before damning what we have achieved. Your vegan diet may well suit you and your low GI carbs as well but you don't have Type 2 diabetes I assume. Many of us have found by testing our bloods (mainly self funded because our GP's refuse to prescribe test strips) that Low GI carbs have much the same effect as high GI carbs.. probably because they are carbs!
I am not trying to be nasty and welcome you joining the forum but your opening posts don't do you any favours.
So have a read of this forum
http://www.diabetes.co.uk/forum/category/success-stories-and-testimonials.43/
you might find out some surprising facts.. anecdotal it is true.. but real world.
In the meantime welcome.. we're pretty friendly and don't bite too often..
By the way these are all my own opinions and in no way do I reflect the views of other forum members..(except where they agree of course)
Regards
Mark

Hi Mark,

Thanks for your reply.

No no it's okay, I completely understand why people may feel some bitterness towards GPs/doctors.

I agree, it would be interesting to read up more on LCHF and read about the success stories. I'm sorry if I came across as not accepting of it or damning it, I'm not like that at all. As I mentioned, I'm open to new ideas, and certainly shall look at the link you have shared
I guess I was just sharing my limited views, but I know that I can learn so much more from those actually experiencing diabetes on a daily basis. So I thank you once more. Forgive me if I have angered or hurt you in any way.

Kind Regards,

Mahesh

 

[Dr__Mesh]

Just read an article about Dr David Unwin following through on a patient on a low-carb diet, and how the diabetes improved significantly. I completely believe and agree with this

 

[walnut_face]

Welcome Dr_Mesh, and may I applaud you for looking at things from the patients point of view. I had this discussion with my HCP when I pointed out that she had had contact with me not more that 6 hours over 10 years, while I had been dragging myself around for over 500,000!
As you read further you will discover that LCHF isn't very new, and before the discover of insulin was the only way for T2D. Back then T2D was called Sugar Diabetes, which I think was a more accurate description. And if your body is intolerant to sugar, or sugars worth (carbs) why put it in your mouth in the first place?

I do appreciate the difficulties you have in that if you go 'off piste' and your patient drops dead, it could end your career, whereas if you follow the NICE guidelines, and can evidence that then the patients death will not be attributable to you in any way.
I do hope you find this forum of use, and that you do not suffer any 'troll' abuse.

PS The only problem with everyone adopting a vegan diet is the fact that there wont be enough food to go round, about 3 Billion humans will have to starve!

 

[KevinPotts]

Hi Mahesh, as a practising Dr and somebody who is presumably used to reading some thought provoking but well reasoned scientific literature, I suggest you get hold of a copy of The Art And Science of Low Carb Living" Phinney & Volek, written principally to help the trained community and arguably the best reasoned, evidenced based treatise in book form.


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