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Discussion in 'Diabetes Complications' started by Junior_Jones, Apr 1, 2015.
Very interested in what you have to say about how you treated your neuropathy, but am I right in thinking that you were on the omnipod/pump but now you've gone back to MDI - any particular reason?
been type 2 for 32 years,but broke and dislocated my ankle in january.while going through the healing process my freezing/burning pain in my feet has got unbearable.Dr has put me on gabapentin but not sure about that.my diabetic nurse has given me capsaicin cream which seems to work but burns when i shower. my bs readings since i have used the gabapentin have gone from my usual 5to8 to 12 to 15..Will try some of the suggestions.Thanks
@joesat52 I'm so sorry to hear you're in so much pain. Do you have any insight as to why the gabapentin is raising your blood glucose levels? I certainly understand your concern. What a horrible choice: pain or high blood glucose levels. What does your diabetic nurse say? Are their any other options?
In one of my more recent posts here - (post #140) - there's a study abstract that lists the nutrients researchers used to reverse/reduce their patient's neuropathy, but there's valuable experiential knowledge throughout the thread too, so worth the read while taking notes.
Hello! I've been suffering with neuropathy in my feet for a few weeks now, what I'm really confused about is that its only started as I've gotten tight control over my sugars.
The last couple of months its been very rare for my sugars to go over 9, and there generally always below 6.5 (but this follows a period of burnout).
It's so frustrating that after getting control back, I'm now getting complications!
I've forgotten what a good nights sleep is and it is absolutely driving me insane!! It's hard to imagine how much it can effect quality of life before it happens.
I'm going to the doctors tomorrow, but my question is - does it ever go away? Or is it all painkillers to cover it up?
Also, are there such things as massaging socks? I feel like those would help a lot ^^
Some are using r-ala supplement and experiencing improved nerve feeling. Do a search on the threads for more info?
I've posted on here recently, I'm taking alpha lipoic acid, vitamin b12 (methyl) and vitamin b1 (benfo) and my neuropathy is greatly improved to the point where it is uncomfortable but not painful.
@emilyj17 I agree with ickihun and encourage you to make a little time each day to read this entire thread. It's about an hour and a half read. As you read through it, note 1) member names, 2) post number, 3) what nutritional supplements they're taking, frequency, and dosage, and 4) how it's helping their symptoms. If you can do that, you'll have a nice cheat sheet on how to get started and what to expect.
One thing that a number of people here have speculated is that as you improve your blood glucose levels, you're nerves begin to regrow, and it's painful, but the problem is only transient. Hopefully that's what's happening. I had no neuropathy pain, only numbness, before getting my glucose levels down. Then I had neuropathy pain in the top of one of my feet. But I stuck with the diet and the daily walks. Not sure how long it took but the pain went away.
Here's the supplements that all type 2 diabetics should consider taking...
B-complex - 5 of the 8 B vitamins play a role in nerve health and are used to treat neuropathy. If pain continues and doesn't go away, I'd add the B1, B6, and B12 B vitamins individually.
D3 - plays an important anti-inflammatory role in the body among other benefits. It commonly takes 6 months or more to get your levels up if low. Have the blood work done to determine your baseline D level then test again in three months. Too much or too little Vitamin D can be a problem. Your doctor will help you with this.
Some D3 formulations now contain vitamin K2 too (because D3 increases your bodies ability to absorb and use calcium and the K2 insures that the calcium goes into your bones not your arteries).
fish oil - anti-inflammatory; improve omega 6 to omega 3 ratio. If you haven't already stop using omega 6 heavy industrial seed oils - (corn, soybean, saffola, canola, sunflower, cottonseed, and peanut) - use olive oil, ghee, butter, coconut oil, and avocado oil (for high heat) instead.
magnesium citrate or another form - most important mineral we take; it's needed in 300 processes in the body, and few of us are eating enough vegetables to meet our minimum intake requirements.
Alpha Lipoic Acid - 400 to 600 mg a day total; I take 200 mg in the morning, 200 mg in the evening.
I take all of the above.
Going to take a quick look around to see if there's anything I should add to the list...be back soon. Okay, here's the list of ingredients in a nutritional supplement specifically for neuropathy...
This specific type of vitamin B-12 is the best absorbed and most effective type of B-12 available for nerve support. It has demonstrated significant improvement in nerve regeneration and function, leading to decreased nerve pain, numbness and tingling.
A better source of vitamin B-1, Benfotiamine is more readily absorbed and therefore the most effective form of B-1 for nerve support. It helps to decrease nerve pain and improved nerve function from neuropathy. Benfotiamine also provides protection from nerve injury and prevents the blood vessel damage seen in diabetes which significantly affects nerve function.
R-Alpha Lipoic Acid
The most effective type of lipoic acid, which is used to produce energy and acts as a very potent antioxidant. It improves nerve function and blood flow. R-Alpha Lipoic Acid decreases pain caused from neuropathy, nerve compression and other nerve injuries. It also decreases cellular aging and is therefore critical component of anti-aging products.
Produced by the body and critical for proper functioning of the cell, CoQ10 is located primarily in the mitochondria, which produces the majority of energy used. It significantly improves symptoms from neurodegenerative diseases (ALS, huntington’s, parkinson’s). CoQ10 can improve nerve function and decreases symptoms such as numbness from neuropathy. It can also protect nerves from injury in some cases.
Acetyl L Carnitine
An acelylated derivative of L carnitine (amino acid found naturally in body) with much greater bioavailability. It helps the body turn fat into energy and is a very effective antioxidant. Acetyl L Carnitine improves pain, nerve regeneration and nerve function from neuropathy, neurodegenerative diseases (Parkinson’s, Alzheimer’s), and nerve injury or compression. Also improves learning and memory function.
As a derivative of the amino acid Cysteine, N-Acetyl Cysteine improves nerve function and regeneration from neuropathy, neurodegenerative diseases, (Parkinson’s, Alzheimer’s) and nerve injury. It also decreases nerve pain associated with diabetic neuropathy. and acts as an antioxidant. Moreover, it improves blood flow to nerves.
Part of the B complex. Vitamin B6 decreases the perception of nerve pain and improves the symptoms of nerve pain and function. Deficiencies of B6 are often seen in some nerve syndromes.
This fat-soluble vitamin is generally obtained from diet and is also synthesized from exposure to sunlight. However, studies show that many people are deficient in this critical vitamin. Deficiency leads to nerve pain and abnormal function, even increasing risk of conditions such as multiple sclerosis. Vitamin D decreases nerve inflammation, improves nerve regeneration, and prevents damage to nerve myelin (protective sheath).
Bromelain is a Proteolytic enzymes extracted from pineapples. It possesses natural anti-inflammatory effects and significantly decreases swelling and pain after surgery. Bromelain improves recovery after nerve injury.
An anti-inflammatory proteolytic enzyme used in Europe and Asia for nearly 30 years, serrapeptase significantly decreases inflammation and pain from nerve compression, injury and after surgery. It also decreases the risk of infections including Methicillin-resistant Staphylococcus Aureus (MRSA).
The active compound found in the curry spice Tumeric, curcumin actually decreases inflammation and oxidative damage. It also decreases pain from chronic nerve compression and improves nerve regeneration. Curcumin plays a significant role in improving neurodegenerative diseases such as Parkinson’s and Alzheimer’s.
Bioperine is an Extract from the black pepper fruit, cultivated from the nutrient rich soil of southern India. It enhances the bioavailability of supplement nutrients through increased absorption.
Hmmm... magnesium isn't on the list. Here's two reference on why magnesium is important for type 2 diabetics...
This link provides lots of helpful information including how to figure out the best form of magnesium to take, and why we take K2 with D3...
Hope this helps. Nerve pain hopefully will get better soon, expecially if you're walking everyday. That really helps in addition to a low carbohydrate diet.
Thank you so much, very helpful! I will read through as you've suggested and with the Dr's tomorrow hopefully things will become clearer and I'll get some relief!
@emilyj17 apologies, I was still writing as you were reading my post, so you might want to reread for the info I added. The cost of supplementing adds up fast. If I could only do three supplements, it would be the B-complex, D, and magnesium. That said, the alpha lipoic acid lowers glucose levels... It's hard to narrow it down to just a few...
Oops, just noticed that you have type 1 diabetes Emily. Perhaps taking Methylcobalamin (B12), Benfotiamine (B1), D3, K2, and magnesium would be most helpful.
At the beginning of Tom Malterre's most recent online presentation, he talks about vitamins D3 and K2 (to turn off inflammation, build healthy bones, and to keep calcium out of the arteries)...
Tom is the author of three books including The Elimination Diet (2015) - (this book is for people like me who have autoimmune conditions and food sensitivities that are making them sick). He also is a leader within the Functional Medicine community in the USA.
To learn more about magnesium benefits, do a search on "magnesium type 1 diabetes".
If I were to only take 3 high doses I would take what I'm taking now, as mentioned above, ALA , b12 methyl and b1 benfotiamine. Works for me, my neuropathy is vastly improved. I also take a multi-vit which contains b6, d, k etc.
@Juicetin I take a nutritional supplement regimen similar to yours, though with a few additions: multi-vitamin*, A (1 teaspoon cod liver oil), B-complex*, C*, D3*, K2 (MK-7), 400 mg alpha lipoic acid (diabetes), 15 mg zinc citrate (diabeties, thyroid), 450 mg magnesium citrate (diabetes, thyroid), 200 mcg selenium (thyroid), fish oil, and CoQ10. *sourced from whole foods. Congrats with your good results. Does your doctor have an explanation as to the cause for the neuropathy? Was it caused by a medication you were taking or eating a restrictive diet that caused a deficiency in your B vitamins? I ask only because I didn't know neuropathy was possible so early in the disease process.
I have chosen to not take supplements (or medication) to lower glucose levels, but the alpha lipoic acid does have that effect. I crossed over into type 2 diabetes in 2005, and didn't begin managing my diabetes until early 2015. Only complication has been swelling and numbness in feet (10 years; resolved with short-term use of 500 mg pantothenic acid B5), and nerve pain in top of right foot briefly after staring the LCKD. All diabetic complications have resolved on the low carbohydrate ketogenic diet with supplements, and walking. Knock on wood.
Hello the neurologist was not completely surprised he says he has seen before instances of neuropathy in prediabetic cases, although rare. "Unlucky" he said of me. I'll say. My b12 was on the low side of normal when tested, hence the supplement.
Still experimenting, trying different doses, I've recently added methyl folate to the list of supplements I'm taking as that was a bit low too.
Pretty pleased my feet are a lot better now but I'm not celebrating too much just yet, I know the nature of the beast and it could get worse again in the future.
The study I have been reading found that at least 10% of people with prediabetes have neuropathy compared to 28% in people diagnosed with diabetes.
Wow, that suggests strongly to me nutritional deficiencies. I was lucky. In my late 20's I started taking a B-complex and a few other nutritional supplements. Every time I'd go off them, I just didn't feel right so would go back on them and begin to feel better again within weeks. Later I'd learn that I had inflammatory bowel disease (IBD, 1999) and non-celiac gluten sensitivity (NCGS, 2011), so I'm going to speculate that one or both of those conditions were interfering with my ability to absorb nutrients from my food. Perhaps that's why I didn't develop neuropathy? I had hypoglycemia in my early 20's, gestational diabetes during my pregnancy, pre-diabetes and diabetes in my 40's. I'm in my mid-50's now. I feel very fortunate.
Thank you Alison for answering my question. Would be interested in a link to that study.
I did a quick search, and this is the first article I read... http://www.endocrinologyadvisor.com...ropathy-diabtes-complications/article/424325/ What's sad is that the researchers throughout the article are saying neuropathy isn't reversible, then that it is in some cases. I don't get it. I've read so many testimonials here and elsewhere by people who ARE reversing it, including my hero, Richard K. Bernstein, M.D., author of The Diabetes Solution, 4th Edition (2011). Sad, so very sad. We have a few clinics in the USA that are reversing it. Perhaps the researchers should contact them...[sigh]...
I was looking for information about eye complications in prediabetes and found this and saw the statement here
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4598604/ This links to the abstract study at ref 135
Information about a later study found here with much higher levels in this group http://www.endocrinologyadvisor.com...ropathy-diabtes-complications/article/424325/
@Juicetin apologies, I didn't see your post until just now.
Two books influenced my understanding of how to reverse neuropathy. The first was... https://www.amazon.com/Neuropathy-R...TF8&qid=1485650924&sr=1-9&keywords=neuropathy The second was - (I skipped through the first part of the book because the authors were so critical of conventional medicine and went directly to the treatment strategies)... https://www.amazon.com/Defeat-Neuro...TF8&qid=1485650924&sr=1-2&keywords=neuropathy
In a nutshell, treatment is low carbohydrate high fat diet or low carbohydrate ketogenic diet that includes leafy greens and vegetables, specific nutritional supplements, exercise, and well managed insulin and glucose levels.
Please keep us informed of your progress. I think you're off to a good start.
Alison, have you had your eye exam yet? After being re-diagnosed with type 2 diabetes in early 2015, I immediately scheduled an eye exam. Hoping you've had yours too and the news was good. I was so scared waiting for the results.
That NIH article looks good. Will look at reference 135 too. Just finished reading the other one you linked to a half hour ago. Thank you. Will fix dinner and come back to read the first one.
Thanks for those links, very interesting.