High-fat foods can make your blood sugar stay up for longer

[kesun]

According to WebMD http://www.webmd.com/diabetes/daily-control-15/slideshow-blood-sugar-swings:
"When you dig into a plate of sesame beef or sweet and sour chicken, it isn't just the white rice that can cause a problem. High-fat foods can make your blood sugar stay up for longer. The same is true for pizza, french fries, and other goodies that have a lot of carbs and fat."

I've never noticed this, but then I didn't test my blood in the days when I ate high-carb, and now that I eat high-fat I don't combine it with carbs, so my meter wouldn't show the effect of high-carb plus high-fat. What's your experience?

Kate

 

[britishpub]

High Carb High Fat foods like Pizza are probably the least healthy foods you can possibly eat. And not just for your BG.

 

[bobrobert]

If you are eating rice and fat together how do they know it is the fat that keeps it high rather than the rice?

 

[amgrundy]

Now there`s a question with no answer unless try rice on its own don't fancy that, but it is something to think about I suppose.

 

[bobrobert]

My understanding is that fat in a meal means that a spike is less likely to happen. That post about fat causing a spike doesn't make sense.

 

[noblehead]

@kesun, I'm a type 1 and that is my experience. On MDI I would have to inject 2-3 times to deal with the slow but gradual bg rise, now on a pump so can manage the delayed spike better by using the extended bolus feature of my pump.

Here's a better article explaining the effects from the ADA:

http://care.diabetesjournals.org/content/36/4/810.full

 

[Brunneria]

I don't think the fat has any detectable effect on BG other than to slow the digestion.

So instead of spiking quickly, the same spike will be slower and probably more stretched out.

Fibre in a meal can have a similar effect.

There is masses on the web on the so-called 'Pizza Effect' that explains the process in detail.

 

[TorqPenderloin]

High Carb High Fat foods like Pizza are probably the least healthy foods you can possibly eat. And not just for your BG.

This.

It is the combination of a high-fat and high-carb meal that can cause these kinds of issues. Conversely, a high-carb/low-fat meal (in theory) would spike your blood glucose levels, but they would (in theory) return back to normal much faster. Ultimately, it should be one or the other (high fat or high carb).

 

[Oldvatr]

High Carb High Fat foods like Pizza are probably the least healthy foods you can possibly eat. And not just for your BG.

I find Sweet & Sour sauce to be problematic too. High fat seems to slow down the rate of digestion. This means that peaks are delayed, so the spike gets flattened and elongated. This means that the protein peak which occurs after the carb peak happens later (for T2's) but I understand that there is also an effect that has only recently been reported that affects Type 1's and that is ~Insulin resistance seems to increase after a high fat meal, which leads to timing issues with the bolus I am T2, so cannot vouch for this info. The delay can be of the order of hours.

The LC pizza recipe is brill, and does not spike me. Uses almond flour, and is delicious. Even my high carbing family enjoy it.

 

[Winnie53]

This is a none issue for me and other low carbers because we don't eat high carb high fat. Everything I've read to date from the low carb literature states to NOT do this. WebMD irritates me. I've stopped using it.

 

[bobrobert]

I eat ONE high carb high fat meal a week. Chinese noodles. The rest of the week I am definitely low carb high fat. Hence I have a passing interest in this thread. Can't be good all of the time and this meal is the highlight of the week and taken with some red wine and gymnema sylvestre

http://www.healthline.com/health/diabetes/gymnema-future-treatment

hopefully not too much "damage". My blood sugars are consistently low on other days.

 

[Winnie53]

bobrobert, another option would be to exercise after a meal like that. Yesterday at Trader Joes, a small package of almonds covered with dark chocolate for 99 cents caught my eye as I was checking out. I ate the whole bag. The count was likely about 15. Blood glucose was 160 mg/dL. Went for a 2 mile walk afterward. Blood glucose dropped back down to 105 mg/dL. Won't do that again for a long time.

No harm with the red wine. It's good for us.

 

[Kristin251]

Interesting timing. Recently I have wanted to drop a few pounds so I lowered my fat a bunch. I have kept everything else the same (except calories of course) and I have reduced my insulin by 60%. I have not taken basal in 6 days and I have only been doing this for 10 days. I also reduced my BF and lunch insulin in 1/2. Fat will extend the digestion and slow the spike but it also impedes insulin. Saturated fat is the worst for me. Olive oil seems to have little effect but butter, mayo, avocado and nuts do. Nuts make a big difference for me. I wouldn't necessarily go up with lots of fat but i would not come back down and it required more insulin (60%) I still eat SOME fat at all meals but not nearly as much as I was. I also lost over 5#'s in this 10 day period. 3 more to go. I cannot comment on any high carb meals as I don't eat them but this show the effect of high fat. I am now on the VLC, moderate protein (as usual) but now moderate fat vs high fat.

 

[ewelina]

According to WebMD http://www.webmd.com/diabetes/daily-control-15/slideshow-blood-sugar-swings:
"When you dig into a plate of sesame beef or sweet and sour chicken, it isn't just the white rice that can cause a problem. High-fat foods can make your blood sugar stay up for longer. The same is true for pizza, french fries, and other goodies that have a lot of carbs and fat."

I've never noticed this, but then I didn't test my blood in the days when I ate high-carb, and now that I eat high-fat I don't combine it with carbs, so my meter wouldn't show the effect of high-carb plus high-fat. What's your experience?

Kate

I definitely agree with this. Fat has an effect on blood glucose levels and when its combined with carbs its even greater. All carby meals with saturated fat, in my experience, require more insulin extended over few hours. I'm even running one right one, after large breakfast of cheese on toast. 6 unit at the start and 2u extended over 4h, which I suspect isn't enough as I'm 7.5 now and my breakfast was over 3h ago

 

[Kristin251]

All carby meals with saturated fat,

Do you find it just with saturated fat? And carbs? Does just a high fat and protein meal do the same thing?

 

[ewelina]

From my experience carbs in combination with saturated fat is the worst. With high fat/protein meal I still need insulin and extended bouls so I suppose its similar. With something low carb and lowish in fat/protein such as salad with avocado and a bit of chicken and olive oil I don't need much insulin.
My observation is that the higher calorie content the more insulin is needed. Ive been on low calorie (and lowish carb) for the last few weeks and noticed my ratios has changed with smaller meals which is a bit annoying as I cant see if there are any rules to follow. I suppose sticking to the same nutritional components is the answer.

 

[noblehead]

Do you find it just with saturated fat? And carbs? Does just a high fat and protein meal do the same thing?

There's a few good articles on the web to suggest that the type of fat plays a role in insulin resistance (although these article are aimed at type 1's), here's a quote from one:

This is what causes the gradual, delayed blood glucose rise after consumption of large amounts of fat. The response seems to be “dose-dependent” – the more fat you consume, the more insulin resistant the liver becomes, and the more glucose it produces. The type of fat also appears to play a role. Saturated fats (the type found in dairy and animal products) seem to cause more insulin resistance than monounsaturated and polyunsaturated fats (the type found in vegetable products).

http://www.mendosa.com/The-Fat-of-the-Matter-How-Dietary-Fat-Effects-Blood-Glucose.htm

 

[Kristin251]

I definitely need to bolus for protein. I take 1/2 unit per 10 g and anything much over 20 I need a slight bolus later. I find EVOO to have very little effect on BS if that helps. Different fats do different things to me and as you said saturated is worst. I still weigh protein because I cannot eye ball that for some reason and I only eat 30-35 g a day (kidney stones). Reducing fat (mostly mayo, but I was eating much more than I thought) has made me have to cut meal insulin in half and stop basal. That was an eye opener for fat.
I do eat the same components at each meal so I could find my dose and not yo yo. I also don't like adding extra boluses so I keep them small and precise. I eat different proteins and veggies but same size everything. I cannot eat a meal of lean protein and veg without some fat or I pop up and stay up. So since starting this weight loss/smaller meal/ less fat plan BF is still 1/2 an avocado smashed with celery (1/2 unit), lunch is 1.5 oz protein with 1 T mayo (not 3 haha) on a lettuce wrap and dinner is 3 oz protein usually with 1 T mayo and a salad or some cooked veg. IF I snack it is a few nuts seeds or olives. Keeping my meals 'balanced' has helped me find my dose and makes this whole game easier. My body does not like insulin so I feel much better with lower doses. Not sure what I will do if I lose too much weight. I really don't want to up fat again and adding a little extra protein won't take me too far. My digestion is so much better this way too. My goal was to lose 10 #'s and in less than 2 weeks I have lost 6. I really don't want to lose more than 10. Any ideas? lol

 

[Kristin251]

This is what causes the gradual, delayed blood glucose rise after consumption of large amounts of fat. The response seems to be “dose-dependent” – the more fat you consume, the more insulin resistant the liver becomes, and the more glucose it produces. The type of fat also appears to play a role. Saturated fats (the type found in dairy and animal products) seem to cause more insulin resistance than monounsaturated and polyunsaturated fats (the type found in vegetable products).

Thanks, I have read this before and it is very true for me. Just by cutting fat I have cut insulin in half and still have the same numbers.
The problem I may have soon is losing too much weight but I don't want to up my fats again as I feel much better with less. Fat can make me very hungry and cravy. I digest small meals much better but not sure what to do when weight goes too low.

 

[Winnie53]

I've only been on the low carb high fat (LCHF) diet for a year. During that time I've done a lot of reading trying to find the magic combination of diet and exercise that works best for my type 2 diabetes. I want to briefly introduce two other things to consider...

1) My journey began with the book, Dr. Bernstein's Diabetes Solution, 4th Edition (2011) by Richard Bernstein M.D. Over four chapters he details the diet he created and refined more than three decades ago for his type 1 and type 2 patients. An important point that he makes is that everyone responds uniquely to the foods they eat, so it's important to test to determine how each food affects your glucose levels.

2) Throughout the low carb literature, I've seen it stated that the LCHF diet worsens health markers in some people, which validates that there is no one diet that works for everyone and that includes people with diabetes. Dr. Mercola has been discussing this on his website since 2002 and since that time has been refining three different "nutritional types". To learn more, start here - (it includes a free nutrition typing assessment)...

http://products.mercola.com/nutritional-typing/?x_cid=youtube

This is not information that I've explored yet, but I wanted to link to it so those of you who have more time than I do right now can take a look at it.