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How do you manage your diabetes WITHOUT following lchf?

Discussion in 'Ask A Question' started by Alisonjane10, Jun 16, 2015.

  1. Alisonjane10

    Alisonjane10 Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    Hi @4ratbags,

    What a lovely reply. Thank you for your comments. As @VinnyJames said in his post...it's ok to relax lchf if your BG numbers allow, but not to the point of being complacent. Hear hear VJ. Excellent piece of information. It's been a very interesting set of replies that I've received. I'm glad of your contribution 4RB, & that you've enjoyed reading the posts too. Btw, love your avatar photograph. Good health & best wishes.

    Alison. X
     
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  2. Alisonjane10

    Alisonjane10 Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    I read this on an old post from 2011. I thought it interesting as well as relevant, hence the reason I decided to include it in my post.

    "Still eating foods you've always loved that are carby and eating them in 'moderation' - much less than you used to - requires a great level of will power. I can control my BG levels with portion sizing, and still eat any food I want and maintain my weight or lose - simply by changing portion size. That takes a certain discipline."

    As individuals, we all have to decide the best way to manage our blood glucose levels. As long as those BG numbers stack up right, then I'm happy. Long may it be so. Good luck to us all in our endeavour to safely & effectively manage the big D.

    Thank you & Goodnight. X
     
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  3. Mrsmac247

    Mrsmac247 Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    Thank you for posting this thread as I have had some teething problems on lchf and often wonder if there is an alternative. Having said that though the low carb way of eating has definitely brought my numbers down in the time I have been on the plan and I've never really understood eating to my meter as I eat from the recommended lists and am too scared to try some of my old foods!
     
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  4. Mrsmac247

    Mrsmac247 Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    Oh yes, when I say i don't understand eating to the meter, what I meant to say was that I am using the foods lists for lchf and nothing on there spikes me according to the meter so I am scared to add something like rice or pasta and see a spike
     
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  5. MarkE

    MarkE Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    Aye, we haven't got the options- seems a tad ironic that we're the ones with the "milder" form of the problem, yet we find it harder to manage our sugars...

    Incidentally, one thing I did cut out right away on diagnosis was the booze: turns out that all I really miss is the Talisker! Hi ho...
     
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  6. Alisonjane10

    Alisonjane10 Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    Hi @Mrsmac247,

    Unfortunately, testing when adding a previously "restricted" food is the only way you can find out if that food is ok for you to have. I only test out one food per day. I start with a small portion (tablespoon size initially) of a "new" food & test every 20 minutes for the first 2 hours. Then once an hour for the following 2 hours. If my bg doesn't spike, then I may try a bigger portion the following day. But that's purely my own testing preference. I'm sure other forum members follow a different, though similar, protocol. If I'm testing out fruit, I eat something like half a medium size Apple, funsize pear or banana. You quickly build up a variety of foods that can be safely tolerated & eaten in moderation. But you've gotta get the portion size right. The worst that could happen when trying a new food is a bg spike for a short period of time. Your blood glucose WILL drop back to the pre-testing level..and, you've learnt not to eat that food again. The rise is temporary. But I do understand your fear. When you've worked hard to gain good glycemic control, you just don't want to risk jeopardising it.

    If you decide to give it a try, I wish you luck. You never know...you may very well be able to introduce some new healthy foods into your diet. Best wishes.

    Alison. X
     
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    #26 Alisonjane10, Jun 18, 2015 at 8:12 PM
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 18, 2015
  7. Mrsmac247

    Mrsmac247 Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    I will try one day lol maybe when I am a little but more confident with my meals and I get my morning bs down. Having said that I'm sure it may happen over summer as that is when we tend to visit friends and family more!
     
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  8. catherinecherub

    catherinecherub · Guest

    The thread is asking people to let us know how they manage their diabetes without using the LC/HF method. but seems to have been taken over. Please keep on track
     
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  9. kevinfitzgerald

    kevinfitzgerald Type 1 · Well-Known Member

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    Hi there. I have never followed a specific diet of any kind. I enjoy pasta and rice in moderation and still eat bread.

    Moderation, a good understanding of my own diabetes and a little common sense is my key, though granted this is mainly due to many years experience of having the illness.

    We are all different and I have read some amazing posts here from people who now follow a LCHF regime but this is not for me.

    I inject however much I need for whatever it is I decide to eat. I don't abuse my diet by I enjoy the freedom it gives me and allows me to treat myself once in a while also. This is also good for me mentally and for me this is as important as being physically well living with diabetes.
     
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  10. Alisonjane10

    Alisonjane10 Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    Hi @kevinfitzgerald,

    I completely agree with your comment about having a treat once in a while, & the impact this has on emotional wellbeing & mental health. I too believe it is as important as good physical health when living with Diabetes. And I'm not really bothered if others disagree with me on this opinion. It's so easy to fall off the wagon when following any strict eating regime. I know I had a blow out when I was eating lchf, & beat myself up something terrible. A couple of very kind & helpful forum members supported me through that tough time & helped me realise that my very restricted diet was damaging my emotional health. Consequently I began easing off the lchf & started re-introducing the foods I previously restricted, such as fruit & wholegrains. I still watch my carb intake, via portion size, eat healthily overall & I'm successfully eating to my meter. More importantly, I'm much happier. I'm lucky that I'm able to eat this way without losing good glycemic control, or to gain weight. It does also take self discipline too. It's not a cop out nor an easy option, which I suspect some forum members may perceive my diet choice to be. Mmeh! :meh: I'm glad you raised the issue of mental health being equally important as physical health when managing the "Big D." Thank you for your post.

    Alison. :)
     
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    #30 Alisonjane10, Jun 19, 2015 at 8:49 PM
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  11. kevinfitzgerald

    kevinfitzgerald Type 1 · Well-Known Member

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    Hi Alison,

    You have to do what works for you. There are too many variables with this illness and what works for some will undoubtedly not work for others.

    It doesn't matter what others think. I've had diabetes for well over three decades. I've had my ups and downs and have a few complications but I'm generally very well and I make sure the diabetes is just a part of my life and not the only thing in it. I refuse to carry it around with me like a ball and chain !

    If you can keep your sugars in range Alison do it whatever way you like ! :)
     
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  12. Daphne917

    Daphne917 Type 2 (in remission!) · Well-Known Member

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    I have just had 5 days away in Geurnsey and stayed in a hotel on a half board basis. I ate large b/fasts each day, had a slight snack for lunch - usually a sandwich, sometimes a scone with cream and had a three course meal at night - I tried to eat as low carb as I could but, with the choices available, it wasn't always possible particularly when it came to tbe puds!!! I tested before bed each night and the highest was 6.8 approx 3 hours after eating and the lowest 5.2. My morning readings were still in the 5s. I was also doing a lot more walking than usual so this may have helped. However to put it in perspective another guest was a cealiac which meant that she HAD to be careful what she ate and her choices were restricted whereas for me a few extra carbs were not the end of the world!
     
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  13. Winnie53

    Winnie53 Type 2 · BANNED

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    Alison, I'm also new to this. Learned my type 2 diabetes had significantly worsened back in February.

    I'm curious about all the diets used to manage type 2 diabetes, so have done a lot of reading over the last four months. The book I'm reading now, Fat Chance: Beating the Odds Against Sugar, Processed Food, Obesity, and Disease (2013) by Robert H. Lustig, M.D. covers a lot of ground.

    This quote that really resonated with me today: "As you will see, all successful diets share three precepts: low sugar, high fiber (which means high micronutrients), and fat and carbohydrate consumed together in the presence of an offsetting amount of fiber. Anything after that is window dressing." (Chapter 17: Altering Your Food Environment, page 184)

    Of all the books I've read or am reading right now, this book has been the most interesting because it's well referenced and doesn't limit its focus to only one diet. You might find it helpful as you continue to explore what works best for you. :)
     
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  14. Sid Bonkers

    Sid Bonkers Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    I think most older members here will already know that I do not follow a lchf diet and never have but for the newer members who may not know I will outline my story as briefly as possible.

    I was diagnosed in 2009 I think it was and prescribed metformin, one to start with to be increased gradually to 4 a day, that was on a friday but on the following monday my wife made me go and see the doctor again as I had not felt well over the weekend the doctor I saw couldnt get a blood pressure reading so told me to go straight to A&E as it was at the time.

    I arrived at A&E feeling quite normal and saw the triage nurse who immediately told me to lay on a stretch and I was whisked into the resuscitation unit, it transpired that I had suffered an SVT which basically means the two sides of my heart were beating out of time with each other, it was for this reason that I had no detectable blood pressure reading, I had to have my heart chemically stopped and restarted again!!!

    I had to stay in hospital for several days under surveillance as it was thought by my cardiologist that I had suffered a mini stroke which can apparently cause an SVT but after extensive tests this was ruled out. And due to my recent T2 diabetes diagnosis and the fact that my bg was measured at 29 mmol/L with an HbA1c of 12.6% I was placed on an insulin drip to get my bg levels down and was seen by a specialist diabetes nurse who told me I would have to start using multiple daily injections (MDI) of insulin, I was shocked and stunned at this news and asked her if it would be for life and she said that if I could lose weight I may be able to wean myself off insulin, my weight had ballooned to 18.5 stone (259 lbs) due to my having been on steroids (prednisolone) for 2.5 years following respiratory failure.

    The diet part
    I was so scared by this news that I was diabetic and had to start MDI treatment that i was determined to lose weight and after a lengthy talk with my sdn and reading several books on diabetes management a started to diet by cutting down on everything I ate, a few weeks later after searching the internet for more information I found this forum and luckily for me at that time there was far more information available here than the lchf that is the only method mentioned here now. Back then it was lc there was never any mention of lchf at all.

    The main message here then was to test everything you ate before and after eating and adjust the carb portion of that meal down until you were happy with the effect on your bg levels, most members advised that it was best to see your levels returning towards your pre meal level after two hours. No one suggested that all carbs should be avoided it was all about ones individual insulin resistance as to how many carbs and what sort of carbs one could manage.

    I found that I could ate fewer carbs in the mornings and a few more in the afternoons/evenings and I settled into a regime that suited me which saw me eating around 60g of carbs most days although this was never rigid as some carbs I could eat more of than others ie white bread and pasta affected me more than potato and basmati rice. This is why I have never set a max carb level as all carbs affected me slightly differently.

    I was very very motivated and strict with my diet and over the following 10 to 12 months lost 4 stones (56 lbs) and managed to wean myself off insulin although I was still taking 4 metformin a day, at no time did I increase the fat in my diet as i felt that it would be counter productive to my losing weight as fat has double the calories of carbs and protein and it is eating fewer calories that makes one lose weight not eating more fat.

    After the first year and after stopping my insulin treatment I became more relaxed about my diet, I didnt go back to my old ways of eating two or three choc bars a day and having two rolls or sandwiches and two packets of crisps for lunch and filling my plate full to overflowing at diner time and over time I have become used to eating less, I truly believe that most people eat way too much for their needs which is why this country is now suffering an obesity epidemic.

    Over the next couple of years I lost another stone (14lbs) and I have maintained my weight loss eating an almost normal diet although I still rarely eat pasta and never white bread and I still watch the portion sizes of my meals although now I cant eat a large meal as I presume my stomach has shrunk over the years I have eaten only what I needed to fuel my daily activity.

    Oh and a couple of years back now I also reduced my metformin down from four a day to two day and could probably stop altogether but i am happy to take the two a day as they are said to help prevent certain cancers.

    As I needed to lose weight it never made sense to me to increase the fat in my diet and I am glad I didnt as it has worked wonders for me as I now have non diabetic HbA1c's which I have held since the second one I had.

    Of course I could have made all this up but I didnt and here are the before and after photos to prove it :)

    [​IMG]
     
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  15. Alisonjane10

    Alisonjane10 Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    Hi @kevinfitzgerald, @Daphne917, @Winnie53,

    GREAT posts with good points raised & interesting comments. I really appreciate your input. Winnie, I've never heard of this book, but I'll check it out. Sounds like it could be useful. Kevin & Daphne... love your attitude & positive vibe. Thank you all. Good health & best wishes.

    Alison. X
     
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  16. Alisonjane10

    Alisonjane10 Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    Hi @Sid Bonkers,

    What a great post. I really appreciate you sharing your personal story & how you turned your life around after such a horrible health scare. I loved reading about your journey & think you're a great example of determination over adversity. You really should be immensely proud of your achievement. The cherry on the cake is how great you look now. Well done you...you're a real inspiration.

    Alison. X
     
    #36 Alisonjane10, Jun 20, 2015 at 10:21 AM
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 21, 2015
  17. RuthW

    RuthW Type 1 · Well-Known Member

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    That's really inspiring, Sid. It shows how we can take charge of our lives by changing our behaviour, and improve them so much.
     
  18. Winnie53

    Winnie53 Type 2 · BANNED

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    Sid, thank you. Stories like yours are of tremendous interest to me because there's a possibility that I am an outlier, meaning I also may have to alter the LCHF diet for myself, and also for my closest friend.

    Interestingly, on the LCHF diet, I lost weight for one month, then went into a three month stall. Now, unexpectedly, I've begun losing weight again. I believe this was due to small changes I made.

    I'm now eating three meals a day that include a high fiber carb (vegetables/leafy greens), a fat (Kerrygold butter or extra virgin olive oil), and a protein (egg; hard cheese and nuts; or meat). I limit snacks to nuts, or perhaps half an avocado in the afternoon, but only if I know my next meal will be delayed an hour or more than usual. Also, as much as possible, I'm no longer eating 3 to 4 hours before bed. Drinking green tea (black tea or chamomile tea) between meals calms thoughts to "have a little more of something to eat".

    When I first started the LCHF diet, I was using fats to 1) increase satiety and 2) to keep my calorie intake at a reasonable level. What I've discovered over time is that the former continues to be very important, but not the latter so much because I'm overweight and still have an adequate reserve of fat to burn through ketosis. What I'm also realizing is that after I've lost the weight, more types of whole, plant based carbs may be possible for me, which your experience confirms.

    What remains to be seen is how the LCHF diet will affect my lipid panel. I'm also considering getting a baseline and follow-up particle size test because I believe I have atherosclerosis, and this diet worsens atherosclerosis in a small subgroup of people.

    I think we all need to question what we're doing and make adjustments along the way based on the results we're getting: insulin and glucose levels, weight, and through appropriate lab tests.

    Some of us have genetic differences that affect the way we process macronutrients. My friend may be one of them. Reading the book Fat Chance by Lustig is helping me learn more about this. I encourage anyone who is not getting expected results with the LCHF diet to read this book. :)

    And thanks for including before and after pictures. It's great seeing how much your health has improved. :)

    I just realized that I forgot to mention that I'm walking every day too, one to four miles a day depending on my other obligations. This is helping me to further control my blood glucose levels. If I get an unexpected high level, walking knocks it back down. My plan is to add a weight resistance type exercise next.
     
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    #38 Winnie53, Jun 20, 2015 at 7:16 PM
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  19. Totto

    Totto Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    I'm a great fan of LCHF as it works so well for me. I do however have Sunday off if I want to so can't really say it's too restrictive. But as I said, my WoE works for me. I'm on no meds at all for diabetes, of normal weight and eat a lot of fat and very few carbs generally and have a very puzzled diabetes nurse as my BG is normal indeed at all times - almost.

    This is long term thing so whatever road you choose @Alisonjane10 it has to work for you. If you are fine with the meds you take and your way of eating with a bit more carbs and your BG is under the control you want, excellent.You have done LCHF with great success before and can do it again should you want to. It's a tool in your tool box. It's not Gospel. Go ahead and do what works for you.

    I couldn't manage my diabetes on a diet higher in carbs without meds and possibly not even on meds.This is my choice and only mine and everybody else does as fits them.

    On a final note I find it slightly problematic with type ones on threads like this. Yes of course you can eat what you like as you are on insulin to manage your diabetes. Comparably few type twos are on insulin and many of us rely on diet alone and do it well. As type two we can never, ever disregard diet as a tool for control while type ones apparently can and instead choose to inject to the amount of carbs eaten.
     
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    #39 Totto, Jun 20, 2015 at 7:36 PM
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  20. Alisonjane10

    Alisonjane10 Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    Hi @Totto,

    When I posted this thread, I didn't want just to hear from Type 2's. The views & opinions of Type 1's are also of interest to me. I don't find that a problem at all. We all have to manage our Diabetes safely & effectively to prevent the risk of complications. We're all at risk of those whatever type we are. I can honestly say I've enjoyed reading all of the posts in this thread, whether they be from a type 1 or 2. I'm always uncomfortable when type 1's & type 2's are made a comparison of & pitted against each other in threads....which I've witnessed on several occasions on various questions posed. As I say, I wanted to hear from any forum member & the question I raised was never meant to be exclusive.

    Getting back to the thread... It's great to hear you manage your Diabetes so effectively on your own terms. Following lchf, but also having a "Sunday off" when you want is clearly working for you. Like many dietary strategies, yours displays self discipline to ensure those Sunday's off don't turn into a Monday & a Tuesday off as well. That's admirable, and your BG results affirm that your eating style is working for you. The fact that it leaves your diabetic nurse puzzled is not surprising & makes me wonder how many are actually familiar with the principles of long term lchf. You're quite right in saying that managing Diabetes is an individual, personal choice & we should do what fits us. I totally agree.

    Thank you for sharing how you manage your Diabetes, & for your positive comments.

    Alison. :)
     
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    #40 Alisonjane10, Jun 20, 2015 at 9:58 PM
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 20, 2015
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