Hi @Richard 2024 , welcome to the forum.I'm looking to increase the appeal of exercise and lifestyle changes as tools to deal with metabolic issues, and rather than be all arrogant and decide what customers want before they tell me. I'm here to get your specialist knowledge.
As a T1 with insulin resistance, more intensive exercise raises my BG.In turn, if you've got any questions about starting exercise or whether you're doing the right thing etc, feel free to ask away.
Hi Antje.Hi @Richard 2024 , welcome to the forum.
I'm not one to tell you anything about exercise (being a fat couch potato), but assuming you're talking about T2 and not T1 or the other types of diabetes, I'd start here
It's written by one of our members, and it tells you exactly how lots of our T2 members have managed non diabetic numbers for years, with or without exercise.
Use a meter to find out how you react to different foods, avoid the ones spiking you.
All carbs turn to glucose in the body. How much of them you can handle is only to be found out by testing.
As a T1 with insulin resistance, more intensive exercise raises my BG.
I can inject insulin for this, which works pretty well.
Except, my weekly intensive swim session is followed by a short cold swim in open water, which drops me like a stone, especially if I have active insulin on board because of the gym.
Any thoughts on how to tackle this best?
Also, with the water getting warmer, swims will be getting longer, I'll be farther away from my diabetes stuff, so hypos might become more of a threatening issue.
I have some thoughts about staying safe while still enjoying my swims, but with Diabetes Management as one of your specialist qualifications, you might have some ideas I haven't thought of before.
Any thoughts are welcome to me.
The combined glucose/fructose ones seem to work the quickest, but as with most things, the ones that you like would probably work best for you.
Whilst this advice is useful, it seems to ignore how we use insulin before (and after) exercise to avoid the drop in the first place.If it's your glucose levels that drop like a stone (hopefully it isn't you going into Davy Jones locker), a simple way to maintain glucose levels would be to have a few gel sachets under your cap, in your wet suit or your costume of choice.
Hi Ellie, I can't post links, but if you look at Open Water Swimming and their Gel Packs in Open Water Swimming article, that's the carb combo they looked at, a 2:1 ratio of glucose to fructose.Just a heads up that I'm not sure how useful fructose is in hypo treatments, as it doesn't directly raise blood sugar and is processed by the liver.
Hello there,Whilst this advice is useful, it seems to ignore how we use insulin before (and after) exercise to avoid the drop in the first place.
For those of us managing our diabetes with insulin (which can be Type 1, type 2 and Type 3c), we can do things like avoiding having active insulin "on board" when we exercise, and, if we are lucky enough to have an insulin pump, we can suspend our background insulin before we start.
Happy to elaborate but as you mentioned that most people you see have type 2 (and I assume it is not treated with insulin), that is probably enough info for now.
In addition to this, I'd mentioned a recent study looking at cold water swimming and blood glucose levels. I didn't post a link as I'd not made enough posts to do so, but the comment was moderated as I hadn't posted a link. The joys of newbie postingHi @Richard 2024 , welcome to the forum.
I'm not one to tell you anything about exercise (being a fat couch potato), but assuming you're talking about T2 and not T1 or the other types of diabetes, I'd start here:
It's written by one of our members, and it tells you exactly how lots of our T2 members have managed non diabetic numbers for years, with or without exercise.
Use a meter to find out how you react to different foods, avoid the ones spiking you.
All carbs turn to glucose in the body. How much of them you can handle is only to be found out by testing.
As a T1 with insulin resistance, more intensive exercise raises my BG.
I can inject insulin for this, which works pretty well.
Except, my weekly intensiveswim(edit, this should have said gym, not swim) session is followed by a short cold swim in open water, which drops me like a stone, especially if I have active insulin on board because of the gym.
Any thoughts on how to tackle this best?
Also, with the water getting warmer, swims will be getting longer, I'll be farther away from my diabetes stuff, so hypos might become more of a threatening issue.
I have some thoughts about staying safe while still enjoying my swims, but with Diabetes Management as one of your specialist qualifications, you might have some ideas I haven't thought of before.
Any thoughts are welcome to me.
Hello there,Hi and welcome to our forum.
I think the first thing is, we are all individuals. And what works for one may not work for someone else.
And for those like me, only a certain level of exercise is possible, not because of not being able to but because of the consequences. Having your energy levels supported by either natural resources such as glucogenisis or by replenishment as you suggest could cause a heightened level of BG levels that causes symptoms. And a further imbalance in the hba1c levels, if done too often and too severely.
The other primary concern is the fuelling up before exercise.
If carbs and sugars are the trigger for the heightened spikes, which are unhealthy for many T2s over time.
Then whatever is gained from exercise is outweighed by the carrbing up before.
T2s should not use gels or foodstuffs that are concentrated, even the majority of shakes, of many descriptions are too much for them.
Having rollercoaster BG levels is not healthy for T2s.
The answer to how to use exercise and dietary control, is similar to using trial and error.
And it must be tailored to what that person is capable of doing without causing further harm to them.
Hopefully this will raise more questions about how to help diabetic patients.
Hi Resurgam,@Richard2024 exercise might require glucose but it will not necessarily result in a reduction in blood glucose as there will be an outpouring into the bloodstream for many people.
Intense exercise will result in higher levels. A gentle stroll after meals is perhaps the most likely activity to reduce blood glucose, as I find pottering around the house to sort things out after the day results in a point or so lower reading at the 2 hour test.
Oh I was a mad cyclist and used to work my pulse rate up to stupid numbers on my lightweight sprinter. Lord alone knows what it did to my glucose levels.Hi Resurgam,
10 minute self paced walks have indeed been demonstrated to lower blood glucose levels, there was a University of Otago from 2016 study showing just that result, even compared to a single 30 minute walk.
There have also been studies on high intensity training lowering blood glucose levels over the course of several weeks; there's an article about it here on the site if you do a search for High Intensity Interval Training (appropriately enough).
At the end of the day though, what will work for you is probably what you enjoy doing. If the idea of hard efforts on a bike or whatever fills you with dread, and reminds you of school cross country runs, then I very much doubt that'd be something you'd stick to.
Richard
As a diabetic exercise trainer.Hi again
As a diabetic exercise trainer.
Food and exercise are doubly important to managing with T2.
Just being nosey, I would like to know how much importance is placed on dietary recommendations.
Do you give advice, cos of having been trained in diabetes nutrition?
Do you have a nutritionist to advise both the patient and yourself?
Can you give us a sample of what you recommend?
So that some of us, can understand what you do.
And possibly help and encourage us to try more exercise.
Thanks.
Oh yeah!
I was a cross country runner in my teens. 28th in my county.
I played semi pro football.
I played a lot of cricket.
Alas my condition now, would have my BG levels in rollercoaster numbers all day if I ran or lifted weights, circuit training etc. Strenuous exercise is a big no!
My exercise is the house and garden, chores and such, maintenance.
But I have a fifteen minute walk for fifteen minutes, after I have ate.
Much as you said before.
I can picture your dad and his mate setting off speed cameras were they out nowOh I was a mad cyclist and used to work my pulse rate up to stupid numbers on my lightweight sprinter. Lord alone knows what it did to my glucose levels.
My dad used to build bikes and tandems for speed trials and when he went out with his mate on 50 mile test runs on tandems they used to overtake cars. .
Dad's maternal grandfather was a champion speed skater on rollerskates.
I think there must be a genetic link.
I'm quite impressed with your programme.As a diabetic exercise trainer.
Food and exercise are doubly important to managing with T2.
Just being nosey, I would like to know how much importance is placed on dietary recommendations.
Do you give advice, cos of having been trained in diabetes nutrition?
For nutrition, I can only speak for myself, but my “ideal world” recommendation is for someone to use a continuous glucose monitor for a few weeks, to get a feel for how they react as an individual to certain foods, and indeed, life stressors.
That of course isn’t always possible, so as a general recommendation, I suggest an inventory of macronutrient intake; which is a poncey way of asking how carb heavy is someone’s diet.
This will generally be a lot higher than many people realise, with bread, rice and pasta quite often making up the bulk of daily calories. This in turn leads to a relative deficit of protein and fats, which for many increases hunger signals.
If a high carb diet is in place, I suggest a gradual reduction in volume (to avoid withdrawal symptoms after what is often decades of consumption), and an increase in protein and fats.
I also suggest a reduction in how often someone eats to control insulin release. Snacking is more often a habit than a need, so I recommend only having actual meals (2-3/day), with no calories in between (so no 1000 calorie hot milk shakes masquerading as a coffee as a comedic example).
Do you have a nutritionist to advise both the patient and yourself?
There’s no nutritionist input where I work, unless a patient asks to see an NHS one, or hires a coach themselves.
Can you give us a sample of what you recommend?
So that some of us, can understand what you do.
And possibly help and encourage us to try more exercise.
With exercise, the “it depends” card gets played from the start, as current fitness levels and exercise history will play a role in what is most appropriate.
I encourage people to not think of exercise (rather than daily activity) as a means to control a daily glucose reading (nor to burn calories), but instead to use it as a plan to build a better functioning metabolism over time.
Similarly, I try to get away from the idea that exercise must either be for a looooong time, or be an all-out, maximum effort. Generally doing less than you “could” do, being more tortoise than hare, allows you to gradually progress as and when you’re able, rather than always be recovering from being overzealous.
If we’re talking about someone who is already active and wants to add in some more structured exercise, then I believe it’s best to monitor and control how hard you’re working, rather than use speeds or levels, as this works with your body, not an arbitrary external target.
A Heart Rate Monitor will act like a rev counter for your body showing how hard your system actually is working. You do have to buy one though, so that’s a downside.
If you can still talk whilst exercising though, that’s generally a good enough guide that your muscles aren’t burning through so much oxygen that all you can do is gulp air in.
Likewise, if you can still breathe through your nose and exercise, that means oxygen demand isn’t outpacing supply.
Initially, 20-30 minutes of such work a few times per week can make a surprising difference without overtaxing your abilities.
Harder work doesn’t have to be death or glory either, as a step up from steady paced work a method called Tempo Intervals (not what distance runners think of when they hear Tempo, this is borrowed from sprinting) with 10 seconds at moderate speed and a minute easy recovery works a charm at 10 – 15 minutes all in.
It doesn’t have to be on foot either, bikes, rowers, cross trainers or swimming will all work here.
The first 7 or so minutes of this video do a better job than I at explaining these methods:
To labour the point, slow, managed progression is always the key, listening to what your body tells you it is capable of on the day, will always get better results than sticking rigidly to a Mystic Meg plan written weeks in advance.
With regards to strength training, an approach that works well, is to spend time learning the movements, with lower repetitions, but moderate loads. This could be doing sets of 5 repetitions, but with a weight you could get more than 12 with, if a lottery win depended on it.
Doing this with exercises that match human movement (push, pull, squat, hinge) a few times a week is a way to add in strength training, allow you to increase your range of motion in that exercise, all without your head turning purple.
Thanks.
Oh yeah!
I was a cross country runner in my teens. 28th in my county.
I played semi pro football.
I played a lot of cricket.
County standard is proper impressive, as is semi-pro football, both take a lot of dedication.
I was a right lazy so and so in my younger days, taking short cuts on school cross country, only jogging when the teacher was around etc.
Alas my condition now, would have my BG levels in rollercoaster numbers all day if I ran or lifted weights, circuit training etc. Strenuous exercise is a big no!
My exercise is the house and garden, chores and such, maintenance.
Daily activity is key for general health really, there have been quite a few studies that show even an hour in the gym 3 days a week doesn’t balance out an otherwise sedentary existence in the long run.
But I have a fifteen minute walk for fifteen minutes, after I have ate.
Much as you said before.
Yep that all adds up, keeping the electronic step monitors happy.
Richard
Hi Richard,What problems do you face in general, any barriers or concerns around exercise or activity, what outcomes would you like to get from such a programme, or anything else that comes to mind really.
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