just started insulin

markymark2406

Member
Messages
19
I have just started taking insulin, i inject before breakfast, dinner and tea on novorapid and before bed time a one lasting levemir.

I take 6 units over night of the levemir which is working well as i test myself before breakfast and im below 10.

But im not getting to grips with the rapid acting insulin example i tested myself before tea this evening and i was 17.4 i then took 5 of the novorapid, and then ate 2 small pieces of pizza 2 hours after that i tested at a level of 13.4.

I understand that i need to be below 10 after 2 hours so just want to know what sort of insulin i need to inject.
 

suzi

Well-Known Member
Messages
754
Dislikes
people who are rude and ignorant, and people who have no patience in queues.
Hi Mark,
to be able to know how much insulin to inject you need to carb count, have you been doing this? Pizza is one of those foods full of carbs/fat that play havoc with bs numbers. After a lot of trial and error we found my son needs half his insulin dose before and the other half about half an hour later to get his bs results on an even keel.
Hope this helps a bit, any more questions, feel free to ask,
Suzi x
 

markymark2406

Member
Messages
19
No i don't know how to carb count, They just told me to experiement, maybe you can teach me.

I have just taken 5 units of rapid, and have a turkey sandwich (2 rounds of warbertens bread)
 

suzi

Well-Known Member
Messages
754
Dislikes
people who are rude and ignorant, and people who have no patience in queues.
Hi Mark,
your hospital should really send you on a course to carb count, or do it via the net. What carb counting basically is, is injecting your bolus to cover the carbs you eat. ie 1 unit of bolus(novorapid) to 10g of carbs. Naturally everyone is different and some people need different requirements at different meals and with different acting carbs.
As it can become very confusing, best to start off with 1unit bolus to every 10g carbs, it means reading the labels on everything and working it out, but does become second nature as you get to grips with it.
Are you T1 or T2?, because if your T2, not sure if my advise is worthy, as i'm basing you on being T1 and don't know if a T2 on insulin would need the same requirements as a T1.
Suzi x
 

cugila

Master
Messages
10,272
Dislikes
People who are touchy.......feign indignation at the slightest thing. Hypocrites, bullies and cowards.
Username: markymark2406
Diabetes type/interest: Type 2
Medication treatment type: Oral
Years diagnosed: 1

That's the user profile, a T2.
 

Tom R

Member
Messages
5
Hi Mark,
Have been on the same insulin for some time and, at first, I got the same sort of results, do the following might help.
When you do your test, try 1 unit of insulin for every whole number above 8, then look at what you are about to eat and try and calculate how much carbs the are (example, one slice of bread is two units). When you have had a guess at the carbs (there is a difinitive listing availlable from your diabetes clinic, or, if not try searching on line) take two units for each of the carb value.
So, if your carb total is ten, imject twenty units.
As a type 2 patient, you will probably find that you are producing some insulin, but, as with my case, your imune system sees it as an invader and wipes out most of it, so you have to compensate.
The Novorapid has a life span of about three hours so to take it about 15-30 mins before eating is a good timeline.
The levermir lasts about 24 hours. Presumably you take it at night which will have a direct bearing on your morning bg count. Try taking a little extra and see how the morning results fluctuate, but don't forget that even a slight change in your body temperature can change the bg numbers. If, for example, you have a virus (like a cold) your bg numbers can go balistic.

Tom
 

phoenix

Expert
Messages
5,671
Type of diabetes
Type 1
Treatment type
Pump
I would do some testing to start with, peoples insulin carb/ratios vary considerably. Many type 2s on insulin do carb count and learn to adjust their insulin. Typically, they take larger doses than people with type 1. Your present starting doses are quite low and blood glucose targets quite high, I'm sure that this is deliberate to make sure that you take things slowly and safely.
this is my take on a way to start carb counting but it would be a good idea to discuss things with your nurse/doctor.


How to carb count.
For your sandwiches if you checked the label on the bread, you would find that there was about 18g of carb per slice. There would be no carbs in the turkey. A turkey sandwich would therefore have about 36 g of carbs.

For mixed meals you need to take account of carbs in starches( bread,pasta, rice, pots etc), jams, cakes, biscuits, fruits and fruit juice, milk, and yoghurt, some processed meats like sausages, sauces , and vegetables. The biggest amount will normally be in the starches , bakery products and fruits, to start with you should at least weigh these. You may be able to estimate the carbs in the other items.

From the label or from a carb counting book you will find how many gms of carb there are in 100gs of the food.
If there are 33g carbs per hundred grams, thats 33%
Weigh the portion you want to eat then multiply the percentage of carbs by the weight.
eg. If the food has 33% carb and your portion is 160g you find 33% of 160.
(0.33x 160g= 52.8g)

(take care particularly with things like rice and pasta that you are using the right figure: cooked and uncooked carb counts are very different)
Total your carbs for the meal.
A calculator in the kitchen is a big help.

Just carb counting your meal won't do anything, you need to record it and then use the information .
1)your bg levels before and 2 hours after the meal.
2)the number of carbs in the meal,
3)the insulin dose
4)(and its helpful to record the food as well)
5) Any exercise you have done in the period before the meal. (or if you have been ill etc). Exercise may mean that your insulin is more effective, an illness may mean that you have more insulin reisitance.
6) take notice of the rise from before to 2 hours afterwards, at this point your bolus insulin will still be working and glucose levels should decrease further still before the next meal ( novorapid has an onset of 10-20 minutes, Maximum effect: 1-3 hours and Duration: 3-5 hours)

When you have done this for a while you will begin to get an idea of how many carbs each unit of insulin 'covers.' in your body.

A couple of tips that might be of help.
1)At the start your records won't be of much use if your meals vary a lot in carb content from day to day. If you find your normal breakfast has say about 35 carbs, try to stick with this amount for
other breakfasts , similarly for lunch and dinner.Regularly timed meals helps too.
The amount of carbs you eat is individual and should be dependent upon your age, weight, activity etc . If you eat very large amounts of carbs, you will normally need larger amounts of insulin. This is where you should have individual advice.
2) At the moment your insulin doesn't seem to be reducing your levels to your target levels. You are starting the meal outside the target. This may be cumulative through the day.
It maybe that (with the guidance of your health care team) you will need to adjust the bolus dose even before you've worked out approximate ratios. Do it gradually (unit by unit, don't change too much before you understand its potential effect.
Again this is much easier if you eat to a regular pattern.

3) As pizza is a mixture of fat and cheese it's very awkward to dose for, quite frequently people are much lower at the 2 hour level but blood glucose rises, somtimes many hours, afterwards. This is quite probably what happened with your pizza meal. I'd avoid very fatty meals at the moment.

A last point the purpose of your basal insulin is not to reduce glucose levels but to keep them stable overnight and beween meals, but thats another chapter!

I assume that you have been told what to do if your glucose levels go too low ie a hypo.
 

markymark2406

Member
Messages
19
yes thanks everyone for the info, lots to be going on with i do have another complication which i didnt mention i have cronic pancreatitis which has stopped my producing enzymes, i take creon 40000 at every meal and im sorted now.
The doctors tell me that i pos had a virus which damaged my pancreas.

Im T2 by the way