LCHF diet to help you lose weight, not diabetes

Have you ever tried it?

The reason why is because it works. Do you know anyone who has gained better control by increasing carbs ? The initial confusion is because of conflicting NHS information or lack of in my opinion. Of course it's up to the individual but surely it's better to give a message that works as early as possible ? I can tell a person to quit smoking but many will ignore me. Does that mean we shouldn't tell people to quit ?

Hi. I know that Daisy always tries to get a post in fairly quickly but I'm sure that is not always possible. Currently on the forum the use of the term LCHF is very common; something I strongly dislike and have said so. The important thing as Daisy says is to control the carbs. You then need to have enough protein and fats to provide a range of nutrients and enough energy and to feel full. You certainly don't need to stuff yourself with fat. If you search the available scientific evidence you will find a poor correlation between fat intake and deposited fat in the arteries; you will need to make your own decisions on that. Sadly much of the advice offered by the NHS with regard to diet for diabetes is not evidence-based which is why many of us are prepared to criticise some of the NHS advice offered. We have a right to expect evidence-based medicine from the 'experts'. You are right that we need to be careful not to diagnose from afar but the LC advice will do no-one any harm unless it is taken to extremes. The advice given to some newbies by HCPs to have starchy carbs with every meal can be downright harmful and not based on any scientific evidence.

LCHF is a very easy way to control blood glucose. As this way of eating tends to normalise a lot hormones in our bodies, compared with the high-carb advice given, it usually also normalises weight.

And fat doesn't cause heart problems, but high bg does. The fear of fat has no scientific base but was built on falsified data.

Most of us were told by HPCs to eat a lot of carbs, not test bg and come back three months or half a year later. I think that is bad advice indeed.

While Dietdoctor builds his advice on solid science and a lot of us who have followed his advice see vast improvements in several areas, as in bg control, BP, cholesterol, liver function and weight.

You are free to post about what changes in life style and diet worked for you.

And as long as I without effort can keep my bg and all other tests and stuff normal and myself properly fed on LCHF I will keep doing it, and tell about it.

Perhaps it's because there are so many people on here for whom LCHF (it's a lifestyle not just a weight diet) has been very successful. Why should they not pass on that enthusiasm as an option? Nobody is forcing anyone, just providing information that they would not generally get from the GP.

I could go on but this OP seems to me like an attempt to provoke another unnecessary argument.

sanguine said:

Perhaps it's because there are so many people on here for whom LCHF (it's a lifestyle not just a weight diet) has been very successful. Why should they not pass on that enthusiasm as an option? Nobody is forcing anyone, just providing information that they would not generally get from the GP.

I could go on but this OP seems to me like an attempt to provoke another unnecessary argument.

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Perhaps there is already a plan to post certain information to new members ....

izzzi said:

I am confused to why a LCHF weight diet seems to be the answer to the long term control to Diabetes. High fat and heart problems comes more to mind.
When a member on this forum says our or your Doctor is incorrect to her Patient, a Patient we do not even know or have any in-house information is Dangerous and beyond belief.
Maybe it is just me being just being a little unfair, yet when a new member gets a welcome from @daisy1, before or after comes the LCHF diet recommendation's, it just seems wrong not to give the new member a chance to make sense of the forum and what it is all about.
Come to think about it maybe the system could be set up that new members get the welcomes firstly from Daisy1 and Admin;to ensure a better start.
Sorry in advance if I have offended any member, it is that something is not adding up

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Doctors will give advice based on NICE and NHS guidelines, forum members will give advice based on their personal experiences. I was wondering whether to mention my flu jab yesterday, your message has encouraged me to do so. I was sitting in the waiting room and got talking to the lady next to me who by coincidence had lived in the same area as I had grown up some 35 miles away from where I live now. A further coincidence was that both her parents were born and raised in the Swansea Valley as was my father. She was also type II diabetic although slightly older than me, but had been diagnosed about the same time. Similarities ended there.
She was astounded that I had been able to throw away the Gliclazide and Januvia (and statins as it happens) just by cutting my carb intake to about 80 gms per day. I have not deliberately increased my fat intake because I can't stomach it although I tend to eat more cheese and yoghurt than I used to. I now only take Metformin for the diabetes and my last two HbA1cs have been the best ever, my GP even puts well done in my notes. My last two total cholesterol counts were under 5.5, a little higher than they'd like but I've got a few more things I can do with resorting to statins. I have also lost three stones.
She on the other hand was now taking insulin and metformin and the statins were causing her bad muscle pain in her legs, a connection she had not made, she was also sleeping poorly and her memory was bad. She had been gaining weight gradually despite taking care and following the eat well plate.
Anecdotal evidence it might be, low carb has to be tried. Doctors might say that we need carbs for energy, but if we're gaining weight then we're obviously consuming too much "energy".
As for the higher fat thing and heart problems I personally don't have anything to say. I've just had a heart echo cardiogram to add to the ECGs and treadmill ECG I had a year or so ago and my heart is fine, but I have avoided fat for many many years.

izzzi said:

I am confused to why a LCHF weight diet seems to be the answer to the long term control to Diabetes. High fat and heart problems comes more to mind.
When a member on this forum says our or your Doctor is incorrect to her Patient, a Patient we do not even know or have any in-house information is Dangerous and beyond belief.
Maybe it is just me being just being a little unfair, yet when a new member gets a welcome from @daisy1, before or after comes the LCHF diet recommendation's, it just seems wrong not to give the new member a chance to make sense of the forum and what it is all about.
Come to think about it maybe the system could be set up that new members get the welcomes firstly from Daisy1 and Admin;to ensure a better start.
Sorry in advance if I have offended any member, it is that something is not adding up

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I am really concerned about the dynamics that are happening ....I don't think diet should be the first big discussion for someone here who is new or not so new ....people are of course free to follow what ever diet they wish , but let a person have time to breath first ....there is so much to,digest and people are all just shocked in many cases ...I know what diet I follow and choose but I would never push it at anyone ...like me telling everyone meat is bad for you , yes I choose not to eat meat , up to others what they do ...
Yes I agree it is dangerous to , we just don't know the facts and are not qualified to say .....suggestions and our experiences are all we can share ...but when you come here and are baffled with the diet that you should or should not be following while trying to get a grip on what is happening with your life and health is just not right ...that is how it feels ...
I like the information daisy gives ....as long as it stays within nice guidelines ....what is wrong with it ....it does highlight diet choices as well ...

Seems like the us and them again , I wonder why ....

my ears were burning, seems I found out why, I welcome any advice to provide more balance

I post LCHF
I post Newcastle diet
I post LC Mediterranean
I post a LC dietitian
I post about food craving

http://www.dietdoctor.com/lchf it’s a long page and a video
http://lowcarbdiets.about.com/od/lowcarb101/a/firstweek.htm

http://lowcarbdiets.about.com/od/lowcarbliving/a/Food-Cravings.htm because carbs don’t give up easy.

testing
http://www.phlaunt.com/diabetes/14045524.php
food count
http://www.myfitnesspal.com/

Newcastle diet aims in 8+ weeks to mimic or better the rate of ~80% remission, for surgery T2
http://www.ncl.ac.uk/magres/research/diabetes/
http://www.diabetesforecast.org/2010/mar/weight-loss-surgery-and-type-2-diabetes.html

http://diabeticmediterraneandiet.com/low-carb-mediterranean-diet/
http://www.lowcarbdietitian.com/blog/carbohydrate-restriction-an-option-for-diabetes-management

these seem to be supported by American Diabetic Association
( http://www.professional.diabetes.org/)
http://www.professional.diabetes.or...=DP&s_src=vanity&s_subsrc=nutritionguidelines

Evidence is inconclusive for an ideal amount of total fat intake for people with diabetes;
therefore, goals should be individualized; fat quality appears to be far more important
than quantity.

In people with type 2 diabetes, a Mediterranean-style, MUFA-rich eating pattern may benefit
glycemic control and CVD risk factors and can therefore be recommended as an effective
alternative to a lower-fat, higher-carbohydrate eating pattern.

equipoise said:

Reading this thread, the only 'us and them' attitude that I can see is in the OP and in your good self. You got your insinuations of a conspiracy in very quickly. Has it ever occurred to you that accusing other people of being divisive might itself be divisive?

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We should all be supporting each other ...what ever diet we choose ...I agree with that
And the for and against or the us and them is like the thread which was closed ....

Sorry, but I don't see what all the fuss is about. People can choose to take advice, or ignore it, just like the advice their GP gives them. It's all "stuff" to think about in my opinion.

Kat100 said:

We should all be supporting each other ...what ever diet we choose ...I agree with that

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Then we are friends really.

equipoise said:

Then we are friends really.

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I should hope so life is to,short not to,be ....
But I do wish we could all find away to work together whatever our beliefs ....
Lots of fights or disagreements regarding diets and I think there comes a time when enough is really enough ...

izzzi said:

Yes you make good point. My diabetes is not weight related, that is my point.
Everything I read regarding LCHF is beneficial, I have no problem with that. I just think your message comes across a little heavy handed.

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By 'your message' do you mean mine personally? LCHF is a good healthy lifestyle choice for anyone. You don't have to be overweight. That's the whole point! You stick to the amount of protein your body needs (1g per kg of weight, I believe) and you lower your carbs gradually until your BG's are under good control. The fat element is the adjustable bit, you eat enough so that you maintain your weight if your weight is OK to start with. This way you don't feel hungry. If you have weight to lose you have to be careful not to over consume fat because you won't lose weight that way. Of course exercise and drinking enough water come into the equation too, but that's the same with any lifestyle plan.

izzzi said:

Yes you make good point. My diabetes is not weight related, that is my point.
Everything I read regarding LCHF is beneficial, I have no problem with that. I just think your message comes across a little heavy handed.

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you are welcome to your opinion, as we all are. Just remember it's just your opinion

So what is everyone suggesting we say to those that are struggling ? Should we just tell them to carry on eating what they like ? Chances are, that's one of the main reasons they're here. I've only been on this forum a short time but I haven't come across any aggressive pushing of diets either way. For anyone to make a choice, they need options. Those that don't think lowering carbs works are extremely rare, in fact, I've never met one. As for fats, people assume that to replace the carbs we are eating deep fried lard. There are healthy fats as well as unhealthy fats. Low carbing is a good base to start, after that, people will customise their diet to suit.