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Mark says hello

G

Ginge

Member
Messages
7
Hi,

My name is Mark (Ginge) and I was diagnosed with diabetes 2 around 7 years ago.
Had thought it was a disease of overweight and the old. As I was in my late 30's (now 44) was a bit surprised I got it. Not known to be in my family either. When I told my doctor I thought I had diabetes he was very sceptical. My symptoms suggested to me it could also have been kidney problems, so quite relieved. My blood/sugar level was 27 (or was it 24?). Within a week, with exercise and tablets it came down to 13.

Have since been diagnosed with Glaucoma which seems under control.

Although am interested to know how all diabetics get on with their medications / life; my main incentive to come on to this forum is to talk to other diabetics who have never been overweight or old.

Used to be full time in manual work but now very part time, as the disease has influenced me to follow a dream "job".

Can't say I am the best patient; diet (I believe) is o.k., but still don't take enough exercise.

Will be going for my diabetic review in a few days so fingers crossed.
At the moment I take 2 gliclazide (80mg) tablets in the morning.
1 drop of timollol eye drops in the morning then 1 at night with 1 of Xalatan Latanaprost.

The other day in a stupid moment: I got straight on the computer in the morning and got so involved, 12 OClock came without a breakfast. When eventually I decided to get something, I could feel what I can only describe as a sort of minor pins and needles in my forehead. Although not dizzy, on the way out to the kitchen I bumped in to the door frame; then dropped a spoon I tried to pick up. Thought better to have a couple of biscuits. As don't have them very often, they were soggy, stale things. Serves me right. Soon felt o.k. Was this a hypo?

Ginge
 
Can you tell us what your present Bg levels are fasting (waking), immediately before meals, and two hours after meals. It would also help if we had an idea of a typical days food / drink intake. That way we might be able to help you better.

Ken
 
Re: Not over-weight, Not old, but type 2

Postby borderter » 01 Aug 2010 15:13

Ginge I am sure your nurse is wrong re most type 2s being old fat etc ,I am not fat walk 5 miles daily and was diagnosed before I was 50 ,as family history has a large bearing on this diabetes lark lots of us are ordinary average sized folk and not the fat lazy gluttons the media would have you believe :D

borderter
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Re: Not over-weight, Not old, but type 2

Postby Ginge » 01 Aug 2010 19:12

Whether my nurse was right or wrong.
There are differences between what an overweight diabetic has to do and a slim person. Obviously I don't have to pay as much attension to fatty foods etc. Sure there are others.

Have you Borderter, or anyone else got any advice for me?
Are there any disadvantages of being slim with diabetes?
Are we more likely to get certain complications?

Ginge
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Advice for best control is keep your carbs as low as you can,you do need some so just cut back on them quite a bit,sugar is an obvoius no-no, add excercise and keep any alcohol to a minimum,but then just live life as normal its really not too bad and if you can keep bgs low by this you shouldnt be at too much risk of complications.Wishing you well . 8)
 
Thanks Borderter,

Just been for my check up with the diabetic nurse.

She reasures me that I should NOT be on a low carb diet as such, but what I've been eating recently has been too much carb. So will cut down.
When I was first diagnosed I needed to cut down considerably on the sugar intake. The easiest way (for me) to do that was to up carb levels to fill me up, as didn't eat many carbs then. Which worked quite well at the time (not reccomended if you are overweight). Could get through 6 slices of bread a day. Is less now. I like to make my own bread (Panasonic bread maker). Don't particularly like 100% wholemeal so mix it with white and Grannary. I don't have a lot of salt in my diet. Do have a packet of crisps a day (usually unsalted). Will have to cut down/out the Doritos. And potatoes, just having more meat and green veg with the roast! Similar thing to Pasta, more tuna (tinned) and peas, less pasta.

On the subject of fish: Been told I need to eat more fresh fish. I don't like preparing it, anyone got any alternatives / tips? Do eat tinned mackeral which is apparently better than other tinned stuff.

I don't drink tea or coffee which might have been part of my problem before diagnosis. To give an energy boost in the morning used to start with a glass of Lucozade! Then plenty of orange juice or sometimes squash during the day. Sugar, sugar, sugar... Drink mostly my favourite drink of all now, tap water! Though probably not enough of it (around 3 pints, if that, a day). I've never been one for alcohol, just an occasional pint of bitter; and never taken a drag in my life.

Here are my results (path tests for past year) that my nurse thought you might want to know; for anyone with a statistical mind:

Hb1c level 7% (53mmol/mol IFCC)
GFR MDRD > 90 mL/min/1.73m2
Plasma HDL choleserol level = 0.71 mmol/L Low
Plasma total cholestorol level = 4.1 mmol/L

I am 44, 5'10" and 11st 8lbs.

On the border line for Insulin now, but by cutting out some carbs and stepping up the exercise may put that off for a litle longer. You've inspired me Borderter to walk more. Living in the countryside on the northern Hampshire / Wiltshire / berkshire border, it's great rambling country. Did a 3 hour walk yesterday, 1 1/2 hour one today. Taking a detour back from the surgery.

Any more advice welcome. If you want more information let me know.
Sorry about the duplication, just wanted to make certain I had the right advice, as not a typical type 2.

Thanks
Ginge
 
A Type 2 is a Type 2 regardless of their weight and the same advice is given here for all. 20% of newly diagnosed are not overweight. Doesn't mean that their dietary needs are different from other Type 2's. Some find it difficult to maintain their weight when they switch to a suitable diet but we are all in this together regardless. We try not to stereotype here as some find it upsetting.
You are far from unique.
 
catherinecherub said:
A Type 2 is a Type 2 regardless of their weight and the same advice is given here for all. 20% of newly diagnosed are not overweight. Doesn't mean that their dietary needs are different from other Type 2's. Some find it difficult to maintain their weight when they switch to a suitable diet but we are all in this together regardless. We try not to stereotype here as some find it upsetting.
You are far from unique.
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That is exactly the opposite of what I've been told today by my diabetic nurse. There are differences for those slim and overweight. Am not having a go at overweight people, it's just what I've been told by more than one medical proffesional. I am not trying to stereotype anyone, so please do not try and stereotype me as a "fat hating slim bloke". I have sympathy for everyone with diabetes and don't judge people by their size. I know there are many so called overweight people who are a lot fitter than me.

It's just:
I was only told today, "there are fewer things we can do with you regards non-insulin remedies, because you are not overweight". As in: If I was overweight there would be more things she could tell me to do to prevent me going on insulin.

I am only telling you these things because I do not want to be given the wrong advice. Please don't take it as a slight against the overweight. Nothing to do with being "unique" or whatever. I am no better or worse than anybody else Catherine.
 
I agree with Catherine, a Type 2 is a Type 2. There are many Type 2's who are underweight, normal weight or over weight. The media stereotype Type 2's and the general impression,even amongst HCP's unfortunately, is that Type 2's are all large people!

Here is the advice we give to all new diabetics, it may be of help. As a slimmer Type 2 the best thing you can do is test frequently before and two hours after meals to see how the carbs are affecting you. If you can eat a certain amount of carbs to keep your weight up so much the better but the important thing first is to get the blood sugar levels under control then tweak your diet so you do not lose weight.


Here is the advice we usually give to newly diagnosed diabetics. We hope that these few ideas gained through experience help you to gain control and give you some understanding of Diabetes. This forum doesn't always follow the recommended dietary advice, you have to work out what works for you as we are all different.

It's not just 'sugars' you need to avoid, diabetes is an inability to process glucose properly. Carbohydrate converts, in the body, to glucose. So it makes sense to reduce the amount of carbohydrate that you eat which includes sugars.

The main carbs to avoid OR reduce are the complex or starchy carbohydrates such as bread, potatoes, pasta, rice, starchy root veg and also any flour based products. The starchy carbs all convert 100% to glucose in the body and raise the blood sugar levels significantly.

If you are on Insulin you may find that reducing the carb intake also means that you can reduce your dose of insulin. This can help you to keep weight gain down as Insulin tends to make you put on weight and eventually cause insulin resistance. This should be done slowly so as not to cause hypos.

The way to find out how different foods affect you is to do regular daily testing and keep a food diary for a couple of weeks. If you test just before eating, then two hours after eating, you will see the effect of certain foods on your blood glucose levels. Some foods, which are slow acting carbohydrates, are absorbed more slowly so you may need to test three or even four hours later to see the effect that these have on your blood glucose levels.

Buy yourself a carb counter book (you can get these on-line) and you will be able to work out how much carbs you are eating, when you test, the reading two hours after should be roughly the same as the before eating reading, if it is then that meal was fine, if it isn’t then you need to check what you have eaten and think about reducing the portion size of carbs.

When you are buying products check the total carbohydrate content, this includes the sugar content. Do not just go by the amount of sugar on the packaging as this is misleading to a diabetic.

As for a tester, try asking the nurse/doctor and explain that you want to be proactive in managing your own diabetes and therefore need to test so that you can see just how foods affect your blood sugar levels. Hopefully this will work! Sometimes they are not keen to give Type 2’s the strips on prescription, (in the UK) but you can but try!!
If you are an Insulin user in theory you should have no problem getting test strips.

The latest 2010 NICE guidelines for Bg levels are as follows:
Fasting (waking).......between 4 - 7 mmol/l.(Type 1 & 2)
2 hrs after meals......no more than 8.5 mmol/l. ( Type 2)

2hrs after meals....... no more than 9 mmol/l (Type 1)

If you are able to keep the post meal numbers lower, so much the better.

It also helps if you can do 30 minutes moderate exercise a day. It doesn't have to be strenuous.

The above is just general advice and it is recommended that you discuss with your HCP before making any changes. You can also ask questions on the forum on anything that is not clear.

Sue/Ken.
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Ginge" It's just:
I was only told today, "there are fewer things we can do with you regards non-insulin remedies, because you are not overweight". As in: If I was overweight there would be more things she could tell me to do to prevent me going on insulin.
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All good advice from everybody so far.

As for the comment about Insulin. Not so, there are alternatives available which with careful attention to diet can all achieve good Diabetic control, oral Med's etc. These could be considered as an alternative. Insulin in itself can cause weight gain so that too has to be carefully monitored. Maybe the DN needs to put his/her thinking cap on instead of just going for the 'biggest spanner' in the box. One of the cheapest as well, that often has a bearing on what is prescribed.

It's good you say you are going to reduce the carbs, that can be one of the best steps to take. You don't have to low carb, just a good reduction in your present intake and types of foods. You can up your calories if you find that weight is starting to drop.

Ken
 
Never said type 2's were ALL large. Just MOST are either large or elderly, which is a fact.

Thanks for the advice Sue.

I will be cutting down on the carbs as I do eat too many. But WON'T be going against my own medical advice and making it a LOW carb diet. :) Not that you said that exactly. But every type 2 should not be treated the same.

Cugila,
I know there are alternatives to insulin, am on gliclazide now. She did say we might be able to up the dose if things get a bit worse, but I am a probable for insulin later. How much later depends on my diet and exercise.

Am sure if my doctor and nurse tell me in future "insulin is the best thing for you", it will be the best thing for me.

I came to hear how people in a similar situation to mine coped with diabetes. Not to be told the medical professionals dealing with me don't know what they're on about or may only be telling you this because of cost.

Ginge
 

If you wish to follow advice from elsewhere then that is fine as far as we are concerned here.
Our advice is advice from our own experience, between us over 16 years. You can ignore it if you wish, we are after all different.

If you have excellent advice at present from your HCP's then that is good, many members don't get such advice and we post accordingly. Sometimes it may well differ from what the Professional's tell you, however if you look around this Forum many member's have done exactly the opposite of what they have been told by HCP's........those same HCP's have then been amazed at the results that the self same advice from here has produced.

Please don't rubbish well intentioned advice it really is not needed on the Forum.

cugila and sugarless sue
Forum Monitor's
 
Ken and Sue,

Thanks for the advice, I am sure it is well intentioned and that you've both helped a lot of people on here over the years. As my medical team also have my best intentions at heart and have many years of experience.

"Please don't rubbish well intentioned advice it really is not needed".

I totally agree, but it works both ways. Am I rubbishing your opinions or defending my doctor and nurse's prognosis? Who is rubbishing who?

Little surprised you are advising people to go against their own medical advice and that they'd want to, but that it is up to them. Suppose can understand it if nothing is working for them. Luckily everything they've said (that I've followed) has worked for me so far.

Hopefully I will not feel the need to defend my doctor and nurse in future.

Ginge
 
We are glad the advice works for you . The advice we give here is mainly dietary. The mainstream advice from many, but not all, HCP's involves telling diabetics to eat carbs with every meal. This may be good advice for medicated diabetics but for new diabetics who try and control their diabetes like this it is flawed. That is why we advocate the reduction of carbs and, in the beginning, frequent testing as this is the only way to get to know just how your body responds to carbs.

In most of our posts you will see the rider : please discuss with your GP/HCP. We give members fuller explanations about some of the treatments they get so that they can fully understand and self empower themselves and be better placed to discuss and understand their treatment. After all it is OUR diabetes, each and everyone of us is different and needs slightly different treatment. Too often a generic advice is handed out which may or may not fit that person. On here we simply help members to be in control of their own health.

No one has advised people to go against medical advice only offered alternatives that have worked for many members on here, all members are free to ignore such advice if they think it is not for them, the ethos of this forum is support and advice through experience, and that is what members do here, offer their experiences back to newer, confused members.

sugarless sue and cugila.
Forum Monitor's.
 
cugila said:

however if you look around this Forum many member's have done exactly the opposite of what they have been told by HCP's........
cugila and sugarless sue
Forum Monitor's
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You now say "no one has been advised to go against medical advice"? There must have been some pretty strong language used in those "alternatives" to make them do "exactly the opposite of what they were told by HCP's". :shock:

Ginge
 
Enough of this. You are in contravention of forum rules and are targeting a Monitor which is not tolerated on this forum.

Your conduct here is not acceptable and you will be suspended for 7 days to reflect on your behaviour. The Monitor's have other members to offer advice to who are more appreciative.

If you find the ethos of this forum not to your liking then please feel free to look elsewhere.

Mod 3.
 
Well I came here because the advice and instructions of my HCP's weren't working for me. (AND incidently their instructions were different to advice from my previous HCP, when I lived elswhere.) It wasn't working and I had had to start taking medication and that medication was being increased, I needed the support of others who had been through it, to take control of my own health. Since I took control and stoped following the HCP's orders I have had my medication reduced and lost several stones in weight.

If you are one of the lucky ones whose HCP actually know what they are talking about and treat you as an adult and their advice works for you, then great, go for it. Sadly too many of us here, have found that the one size fits all advice that we were being given did not suit our bodies, and that we had HCP's who were not prepared to listen to us. Diabetes is a very compex and individual condition and too many of us have had HCP's who are not experts in it.

This site is about explaining options and treating us as indivuduals who can judge our own bodies, and take care of ourselves, and supporting each other. The advice that is given is always about testing your own body and seeing what works for you.

This forum doesn't always follow the recommended dietary advice, you have to work out what works for you as we are all different.
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