Newcastle Diet - to follow it and do shakes and veg, or deviate?

[memememeiii]

I know what the researchers say - it's just about doing 600 cal (actually 800 - I don't know why they call it a 600 cal diet, when the vegetables equate another 200 cal) - any food will do (presumably because most people don't have the muster to do protein shakes/meal replacement shakes. I'm at the start of my third week of this, and sick of the protein shakes, truly. And the limited veg...I have chosen NOT to use oil to cook anything, so I revert to salad at the end of a day.

It is my desire to duplicate the results of the diet. I question myself on this, however. I did this diet before for 5 weeks. Then rebounded/binged. I won't be doing it again, as I regained the diabetes, though it's low and I'm only on 2x500 mg Metformin a day.

I am attending a conference this weekend for four days in London - and I'm wondering (in some less lucid moments) whether I can deviate and have salads or anything up to 600 cal (within reason, of course) instead of following the shakes regime...to make this more palatable an experience.

So far, I am even keeled about this diet, though I get moody on Friday nights, and a bit down, frustrated...8 weeks feels like forever! But, for the payoff...I'm sticking with it.

Who else has done/is doing Newcastle? I am not compromising on my goal, because I'm not going through this again.

Thanks,
MM

 

[andcol]

yes you can. Vary your diet - keep it interesting. The shakes just make it easy nutritionally. Have 1000 cals one day if you want just do 200 more cals exercise to compensate. Be creative!

 

[NoCrbs4Me]

I'm not an expert on the ND, but if I were to try it I'd not include packets of powdered chemicals. I'd eat real, low carb food.

 

[NoCrbs4Me]

Now you're starting to get it!! Butter is a near ideal food. Even better is ghee:

http://www.details.com/body-health/diet/201405/ghee-superfood-butter-alternative

 

[NoCrbs4Me]

Sure. If you try the three sachets of powdered chemicals only a day diet, let us now how that goes. No cheating by eating any real food!

 

[NoCrbs4Me]

Wait, is the original ND the only realistic version or is the new and improved chemical only version the only realistic version? And why would they change it if it doesn't need to be messed with? I am so confused now even though apparently I agree with you. Please tell me what I am agreeing to. I humbly await your reply, sir.

 

[NoCrbs4Me]

After having a gander at what's in an optifast I would not want to consume even one sachet or feed it to a stray dog (wouldn't want the RSPCA after me!) and I find it curious that anyone would eat this except out of pure desperation to avoid bariatric surgery.

OPTIFAST 800® Shake Mix Ingredients: Nonfat Dry Milk, Fructose, Calcium Caseinate, Canola Oil (BHA/BHT to Maintain Freshness), and less than 2% of Salt, Potassium Phosphate, Magnesium Oxide, Mono- and Diglycerides, Choline Bitartrate, Potassium Chloride, Ascorbic Acid, Natural and Artificial Flavor, Alpha Tocopheryl Acetate, Ferrous Sulfate, Zinc Sulfate, Vitamin A Palmitate, Niacinamide, Copper Gluconate, Calcium Pantothenate, Manganese Sulfate, Vitamin D3, Color (Beta Carotene, Turmeric Oleoresin), Pyridoxine Hydrochloride, Thiamine Hydrochloride, Riboflavin, Chromium Chloride, Folic Acid, Biotin, Potassium Iodide, Sodium Molybdate, Sodium Selenite, Vitamin K1, Vitamin B12.

However,

Butter Ingredients: butter, salt.

I suppose if I had not already reversed my diabetes by eating real food (and lots of it!) and I had to choose between the two options I'd take you up on it and eat a starvation diet of butter rather than chemicals.

I am curious as to why, contrary to what Prof. Taylor says, you keep asserting that the only diet that will work is the starvation Newcastle diet exactly as used in the study? Or whatever it is you're trying to say. All I suggested was keeping the same calorie count but eating real food instead of chemicals. I haven't yet seen a reasonable or thoughtful argument from you against that idea.

As for your suggestion of a counterpoint to the Newcastle diet, I think I already have one: a diet of real food with no starvation.

Humbly awaiting you rely.

 

[Brunneria]

@memememeiii

Sorry your thread got derailed with bickering.

Hopefully you will get some more sensible answers along soon.

 

[NoCrbs4Me]

Honestly, I thought my answer was quite sensible!

 

[memememeiii]

You guys make me laugh, but it IS this kind of confusion that makes me wonder. I think the shakes were used as a way to absolutely maintain control of the results as much as possible. It's an easy measure. But I do find myself wondering if I'm punishing myself needlessly. It's the protein with minimal fat in the shake that I presume is the issue, too. I don't know. I'm guessing. The research team came back to me and told me I can add oil, but the results will take longer to achieve. My understanding was that any diet of 600 calories will work. I don't want this. I want to GET THROUGH THIS PHASE as soon as possible, because I consider this a form of torture, really. However, I try not to indulge that kind of thinking. I just crave a bit of steak or chicken and think...god, I'd kill for a piece of chicken in my salad. I won't do it, but the days are a draggin'.

 

[anna29]

Guys please don't get personal and head butt in this thread .
This just leads to derailing within a thread .
Use the PM source to discuss things of personal opinion's .

 

[NoCrbs4Me]

Sorry @memememeiii, I was trying to be helpful.

But seriously, if you are truly sick of the shakes I think it would be ok to replace them with an equivalent calories of something else, preferably low carb, although the experimental diet was quite strict about what they ate. I think 200 calories of steak or chicken instead of a shake would not derail your diet. The diet had "liquid diet formula soup" as an alternative to the shakes, so maybe that's an option.

You could always try emailing Dr. Taylor. I hear he responds to emails sometimes. Maybe someone could PM you his email address?

You may want to reread the booklet: http://www.nhslothian.scot.nhs.uk/S.../Documents/SJH NEWCASTLE DIET BOOKLET2012.pdf

 

[memememeiii]

Thanks for that. I have emailed them and the feedback was I can do it any way I like, but in truth the RESEARCH was conducted on the use of shakes - and presumably any deviation from that could arguably lead to slightly different results. Maybe my brain is too rigid here - it probably is.

But I am not going through this pain ever again (dieting to this extreme). I'm going to do whatever it takes, get there and maintain - because I'm angry now (with myself). It's a good driver. My BMI is 34.9! ARgh.

I guess I'll see how I get on and see whether I need to adjust.

Thanks for the report. Will read it.

MM

 

[andcol]

Did you read my reply at the top of the thread. I didn't use shakes ate normal food and had the same results. If you cannot handle the shakes be creative. For me carrot sticks were my life saver. Fibrous and stopped me feeling hungry. I still eat bags of them per week.

 

[memememeiii]

I know what you mean re. the register. And no, I hadn't seen that re. doing the diet on raw foods, but that's another common pathway, it seems. Thanks for the feedback, everyone. Really appreciate it.

 

[NoCrbs4Me]

I know what you mean re. the register. And no, I hadn't seen that re. doing the diet on raw foods, but that's another common pathway, it seems. Thanks for the feedback, everyone. Really appreciate it.

By the way, how is your progress up to now? Have you lost much weight?

 

[Brunneria]

If you are thinking of raw foods, you might want to consider green smoothies.
Filling, nutritious, endlessly varied flavours.
Bit of a phaff to make them, but you know EXACTLY what is in them.
See the link in my sig, for some recipes.
If they are made with the correct proportion of veg to fruit, they dont seem to spike blood glucose.

The ones I make are about 135 cals per 500mls.

If that doesn't float your boat, just ifnore the suggestion...

 

[Living-by-the-beach]

Did you read my reply at the top of the thread. I didn't use shakes ate normal food and had the same results. If you cannot handle the shakes be creative. For me carrot sticks were my life saver. Fibrous and stopped me feeling hungry. I still eat bags of them per week.

@Andrew Colvin that is interesting that you are eating what might be a Carb'y snack in carrots?

 

[memememeiii]

22 pounds off in 13 days and plowed to a complete stop, so have ramped up the exercise. I think weight training adds muscle but I'd say it's too early for that. I'm biding my time.

 

[memememeiii]

Just starting to drink espresso again after two weeks of no coffee. I hope it gives the metabolism a kick.