Newly Diagnosed Type 2 Diabetes session

[Dexterdobe]

I went to my local village hall today to experience the Newly Diagnosed Type 2 Diabetes session.
There were about 20 of us. We were treated to a three and a half hour lecture on the NHS guidelines for the management of T2.
The dietician explained that we should include between 100 and150 gms of starchy carbohydrates in our daily diet. I asked why and was told that the body needs carbohydrates to provide energy. I explained I have followed a very low carbohydrate diet and that I have lost weight and feel fitter and healthier. She replied that very low carbohydrate diets cannot be followed long term. She was horrified at the thought of increasing fat intake to replace energy obtained from carbohydrates.
As the meeting went on and I questioned other NHS dogma such as "Type 2 diabetics don't need to test their blood glucose levels".
The NHS professionals clearly thought I was disrupting the meeting and preventing them from getting their vital message across.
When we broke for coffee a number of my fellow victims asked me more about my cult diet. I gave them the address of this website and hopefully, at least a few of them will be curious enough to take a look.
Quotes of the day from the main speaker, a diabetic nurse:
" The NHS currently spends 10% of its budget on treating diabetes and it's side effects, but we don't screen people for diabetes because it's too expensive" and
"I know I'm not diabetic because I don't have any of the symptoms".

It would be funny, were it not so sad.

 

[eggs11]

[QUOTE="
"I know I'm not diabetic because I don't have any of the symptoms".
.[/QUOTE]
That last sentence is gobsmacking and flies in the face of common knowledge - I thought even from the NHS, that there are often no symptoms at all.
Well done for trying to get the word out on low carb and this site.

 

[gardengnome42]

The NHS approach to diet just makes me so angry. A neighbour of mine is a diabetic nurse and evidently they have to follow the official guidelines and dish out this dreadful information. When I was diagnosed with borderline diabetes I saw the nurse at my own practice and she even had the Eatwell plate as a poster on the wall! I told her I thought it was irresponsible so please not to waste her time telling me to follow it. When I mentioned Michael Moseley's 8 week blood sugar diet she informed me that she had several copies that she lent out to patients. But still they have to follow the NICE guidelines. Shocking.

 

[Guzzler]

I sometimes think that there are so many of us now seeing success with the lower carb approach that the authorities have to be aware of this, after all, it took just one patient's success to pique the interest of David Unwin enough for him to at least explore the possibilities and he now counsels other GPs in how to get around the system and advocate for this approach.

Well done on spreading the word and well done on your improved health. Keep it up.

 

[Dexterdobe]

[QUOTE="
"I know I'm not diabetic because I don't have any of the symptoms".
.

That last sentence is gobsmacking and flies in the face of common knowledge - I thought even from the NHS, that there are often no symptoms at all.
Well done for trying to get the word out on low carb and this site.[/QUOTE]
She contradicted herself almost every time she opened her mouth. I had to back off in the end as she was beginning to look very foolish.
Some other stupid comments from the dietician:
"Fruit contains nutrients and minerals you can't get from any other foods!
"The brain needs the glucose it gets from carbohydrates to function."
"Yes, ketones can power the brain, but the process is much slower and not efficient".
And my favourite- "Eating carbohydrates has enabled humans to live longer, healthier lives."

 

[Dexterdobe]

I sometimes think that there are so many of us now seeing success with the lower carb approach that the authorities have to be aware of this, after all, it took just one patient's success to pique the interest of David Unwin enough for him to at least explore the possibilities and he now counsels other GPs in how to get around the system and advocate for this approach.

Well done on spreading the word and well done on your improved health. Keep it up.

They did acknowledge that there is new research like the Newcastle Diet, but the jury is out and the NHS advice is based on , proven scientific research.

 

[eggs11]

She contradicted herself almost every time she opened her mouth. I had to back off in the end as she was beginning to look very foolish.
Some other stupid comments from the dietician:
"Fruit contains nutrients and minerals you can't get from any other foods!
"The brain needs the glucose it gets from carbohydrates to function."
"Yes, ketones can power the brain, but the process is much slower and not efficient".
And my favourite- "Eating carbohydrates has enabled humans to live longer, healthier lives."[/QUOTE]

Wow - that's crazy!

 

[Guzzler]

They did acknowledge that there is new research like the Newcastle Diet, but the jury is out and the NHS advice is based on , proven scientific research.

'Proven Scientific Research'? Did he/she mean the proven, scientific research that shows the growing epidemic of T2 with all the misery that it can bring if one sticks with the findings? The model has failed to keep up with the changes in dietary/excercise regimes of modern times as well as the science. Over forty years of this proven research and its failings have proved only that it is outdated.

 

[Rachox]

Words fail me! (< I hope that a rolls my eyes emoticon!)

 

[Dexterdobe]

'Proven Scientific Research'? Did he/she mean the proven, scientific research that shows the growing epidemic of T2 with all the misery that it can bring if one sticks with the findings? The model has failed to keep up with the changes in dietary/excercise regimes of modern times as well as the science. Over forty years of this proven research and its failings have proved only that it is outdated.

I really did have to bite my lip and shut up. I did have the opportunity to talk to a number of the attendees during the morning and several took this forum address away with them. We have to understand that these healthcare professionals are obliged to spout the standard NICE doctrine. The message they were putting across was:

1. They don't hand out test kits because people don't use them
2. If you follow their healthy eating plan you may delay the onset of serious diabetes, but it will get you in the end
3. Eating complex carbohydrates is essential to good health
5. They spent an hour telling us how to examine and protect our feet (To spot the damage caused by their bad advice)
4. There is lots of rubbish on the internet and only NHS sites can be trusted to give good advice.

Most will have gone away from the session convinced that eating all food types is good, but that the side effects of our disease can only be delayed whatever you do.

If I only saved one convert yesterday, then my work was done.

 

[eggs11]

I really did have to bite my lip and shut up. I did have the opportunity to talk to a number of the attendees during the morning and several took this forum address away with them. We have to understand that these healthcare professionals are obliged to spout the standard NICE doctrine. The message they were putting across was:

1. They don't hand out test kits because people don't use them
2. If you follow their healthy eating plan you may delay the onset of serious diabetes, but it will get you in the end
3. Eating complex carbohydrates is essential to good health
5. They spent an hour telling us how to examine and protect our feet (To spot the damage caused by their bad advice)
4. There is lots of rubbish on the internet and only NHS sites can be trusted to give good advice.

Most will have gone away from the session convinced that eating all food types is good, but that the side effects of our disease can only be delayed whatever you do.

If I only saved one convert yesterday, then my work was done.

How sad that all those messages are a bit of vicious circle - if you eat complex carbs you still get high sugars - this fits in with their notion that you can only delay the onset of serious diabetes - you won't bother testing because you know it's going to be bad whatever you do - and so on...

 

[Bluetit1802]

Funny, ridiculous, and so sad that such rubbish is given out. I really feel for all the newly diagnosed that don't find their way here.

Well done for sticking to your guns, and for directing some of the others to this forum. Lets hope they come and join us. Cult diet indeed!!!

 

[NicoleC1971]

This is a good take on the 'Eatwell' EatVeryBadly plate from Zoe Harcombe. She has also done a video on questions to put to dieticians/doctors when they question eating more fat/less calories etc. such as where is the evidence that low fat diets work? Where is the evidence that saturated fat is linked to a shorter lifespan?
Good work on pushing back against the low fat dogma but the wheels of the NHS grind exceding slow and nuritional trials are notoriously difficult and expensive so it may be some time before the tide turns...

 

[Sue192]

I'm beginning to think that I'm lucky to have avoided any sort of follow-up/course from the day of diagnosis and stumbling across this Forum is the best thing that happened. Well done for getting the message out there, @Dexterdobe, in the face of such opposition! It's hard work - I've come across diabetics in a group session who have rigidly stuck to the Eatwell Plate for years and think it's healthy. And they have been on medication for years.... In fact, I self-funded a foot check the other day (never going to get one via my GP) and the podiatrist was absolutely scathing about the usual advice given out, and the NHS in general regarding the treatment of diabetes. I learnt a great deal from her. Stick to our fad/cult/silly/dangerous/unsustainable diet everyone! @Guzzler is right - the powers that be HAVE to take notice of the success from the low carb way of eating.

 

[Tabbyjoolz]

Guideline Bingo, anyone? Just tick the platitudes off as you sit through the course.

@Dexterdobe, did you get the "diabetes is a progressive disease" statement? To prove her point, the nurse who was running the one I went on told us she'd been T2D for some years and was now on insulin. This was after an extremely bossy dietician talked at us for an hour about the Eatwell Plate. During breaks we attendees swapped stories and I did mention LCHF and this forum - quite a lot.

We had to fill in a feedback form at the end so I just let rip.

 

[PenguinMum]

I went to my local village hall today to experience the Newly Diagnosed Type 2 Diabetes session.
There were about 20 of us. We were treated to a three and a half hour lecture on the NHS guidelines for the management of T2.
The dietician explained that we should include between 100 and150 gms of starchy carbohydrates in our daily diet. I asked why and was told that the body needs carbohydrates to provide energy. I explained I have followed a very low carbohydrate diet and that I have lost weight and feel fitter and healthier. She replied that very low carbohydrate diets cannot be followed long term. She was horrified at the thought of increasing fat intake to replace energy obtained from carbohydrates.
As the meeting went on and I questioned other NHS dogma such as "Type 2 diabetics don't need to test their blood glucose levels".
The NHS professionals clearly thought I was disrupting the meeting and preventing them from getting their vital message across.
When we broke for coffee a number of my fellow victims asked me more about my cult diet. I gave them the address of this website and hopefully, at least a few of them will be curious enough to take a look.
Quotes of the day from the main speaker, a diabetic nurse:
" The NHS currently spends 10% of its budget on treating diabetes and it's side effects, but we don't screen people for diabetes because it's too expensive" and
"I know I'm not diabetic because I don't have any of the symptoms".

It would be funny, were it not so sad.

There was a lot of silliness at my DESMOND course also. My favourite one was meter testing just makes you anxious. I said well when you eat food how do you know if it was a good or bad choice. She said you will know by how you feel!! Did she mean Divine Inspiration I wonder! I gave up tripping her up after a while because it wasnt going anywhere. I really got shot down badly by suggesting home cooking tips.

 

[Dexterdobe]

There was a lot of silliness at my DESMOND course also. My favourite one was meter testing just makes you anxious. I said well when you eat food how do you know if it was a good or bad choice. She said you will know by how you feel!! Did she mean Divine Inspiration I wonder! I gave up tripping her up after a while because it wasnt going anywhere. I really got shot down badly by suggesting home cooking tips.

oo tired off fighting against the dogma. I still think the daftest thing I heard was the nurse's statement that she isn't diabetic. How does she know? Because she doesn't have the symptoms, she replied. I didn't say so, but I bet she knows because she tests herself, a luxury that her patients are denied because it's too expensive.

 

[flexi06]

My first DN told me to eat 300g of carbs a day- I was so pleased. Then I realised (after a day of testing and lots of looking on this fantastic forum) that her recommendation was madness. Then my second one ( never gonna see the first one again, she told me so much dangerous rubbish) told me 250 ish is the recommendation- but she was challenging it. I gonna listen to this forum and my heart and eventually aim for lchf, possibly lchf +if. No wonder there’s an epidemic. Probably all the NICE board members have shares in testing strips/metformin/insulin.

 

[Dexterdobe]

Guideline Bingo, anyone? Just tick the platitudes off as you sit through the course.

@Dexterdobe, did you get the "diabetes is a progressive disease" statement? To prove her point, the nurse who was running the one I went on told us she'd been T2D for some years and was now on insulin. This was after an extremely bossy dietician talked at us for an hour about the Eatwell Plate. During breaks we attendees swapped stories and I did mention LCHF and this forum - quite a lot.

We had to fill in a feedback form at the end so I just let rip.

Every health professional I have seen has told me it's a progressive disease and that whatever I do it will get worse. All I can hope to do is to delay the inevitable. I'm sure they are right. If I live long enough my pancreas will age just like the rest of me and sooner or later it will cease to be efficient enough to keep my blood glucose under control. Kowing that, I intend to do everything I can to delay that deterioration until I'm too old to care. An important part of that process will be to continue to stop eating the foods which raise my glucose levels. Isn't that just common sense and if it is why can't the NHS see it?