VICTOZA users

Changing from Byetta to Victoza

I think this may get moved but never mind!!

To those of you who have been on Byetta and changed to Victoza, what I want to know is who agreed the change and prescribed it for you? I should have seen the Consultant in January, when no appointment had arrived by April I chased it up and was given one for July 14th. Then at the end of May I received a letter cancelling it and moving it to 13th October, so IF I get to see him then it will be 13 months since I saw him and last September he said "see you in 4 months".

I have been wanting to discuss changing to Victoza mainly because of it being one injection daily because I am also dealing with IBS and that makes my diet even more difficult. I am waiting to speak to my practice nurse to see what she says.

Jude 8)

Re: Changing from Byetta to Victoza

Hi Jude
I'm as anew girl to this , but if its any help to you . I too have changed to Victoza, and apart from feeling very sick whilst getting used to the high dose its brilliant. on the lower dose it ok,
hope that helps. :wink:

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Have spoken to the nurse practitioner this afternoon and she says it does need to be prescribed by the specialist team so she is going to speak to the DSNs next week and find out the best way forward. The one thing that bothers me particularly is that I do still get the nausea with the byetta and was hoping the victoza may be better?!! :lol: Jude

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Hi, I've just been prescribed Victoza to replace Byetta, what is the best time of day to inject?
Thanks
Vivienne

Re: VICTOZA

Vivienne said:

Hi, I've just been prescribed Victoza to replace Byetta, what is the best time of day to inject?
Thanks
Vivienne

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Here is a copy of a post I made earlier in this thread:

This is an extract from the official summary of product characteristics, lodged with the EMEA. The licencing authority.

Method of administration
Victoza is administered once daily at any time, independent of meals, and can be injected subcutaneously in the abdomen, in the thigh or in the upper arm. The injection site and timing can be changed without dose adjustment. However, it is preferable that Victoza is injected around the same time of the day, when the most convenient time of the day has been chosen.

Pharmacodynamic effects.
Liraglutide has 24-hour duration of action and improves glycaemic control by lowering fasting and
postprandial blood glucose in patients with type 2 diabetes mellitus.

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You should discuss the timing with your GP/DSN/Endo as to when they want you to take it.

Ken

Re: VICTOZA

yer you right ken as always if you start in the morning with first one you must stick to th mornings around same time you cant do morning one day then afternoon the next day exactly as you said and doesnt matter if you have food before or after the injection i have mine in morn and do it every morning same time its great i never feel sick hope jude can try this hi jude if you read this luv to all vivkaroo special paracetamol for you ken case i have given you headache :lol: hope you enjoying your hols xxx

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Thanks for the speedy response, I'll try tomorrow morning then!

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Can anyone offer any help or comments please?
I've been on 1.2 Victoza since the beginning of July, no sickness or anything.
My appetite and food intake have been down, but because I've hardly been eating I've sometimes felt very lifeless, tired and generally kind of not too brilliant.
In 2 weeks I'd lost about 11lb.
In the last week my appetite has returned and I'm eating more and feeling hungry again, almost as before I started on the injection and around 3 or 4lb in weight has returned.
Is this an indication that Victoza is no longer having the desired effect on me now?
I'm due back at the hospital on Monday to see the nurse.
I'd be really greatful for any comments, help or advice from anyone.
Thanks,
Jackie

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Jackie1966 said:

Can anyone offer any help or comments please?
I've been on 1.2 Victoza since the beginning of July, no sickness or anything.
My appetite and food intake have been down, but because I've hardly been eating I've sometimes felt very lifeless, tired and generally kind of not too brilliant.
In 2 weeks I'd lost about 11lb.
In the last week my appetite has returned and I'm eating more and feeling hungry again, almost as before I started on the injection and around 3 or 4lb in weight has returned.
Is this an indication that Victoza is no longer having the desired effect on me now?
I'm due back at the hospital on Monday to see the nurse.
I'd be really greatful for any comments, help or advice from anyone.
Thanks,
Jackie

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Whilst it is possible that Victoza is not having the desired effect I think I would be more inclined to see what sort of food you are eating .....are they carb laden perhaps ? Can you give us some idea of a typical days food intake and also your Bg levels especially after meals ? This might help us to help you.

A couple of questions for you.....are you still taking Insulin and has the dose been reduced since going onto Victoza ?

Ken

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Hello Ken,
Thank you for getting back to me, I really appreciate it.
I am still taking my Lantus injection at night. I've reduced my units from 80 to 40. And I still take 2 Metformin tablets with each meal.
My BG levels aren't too bad.
On waking they're around the 5 mark and the sameish before bed time too.
When my appetite was down I wasn't interested in eating hardly anything, a typical days food from my diary is this:-
(before 4.7) A small bowl of cornflakes (30g) with skimmed milk and a sprinkling of Canderal sugar and a cup of tea, skimmed milk, no sugar. (2 hours later 10.1)
(before 5.4) Later on 2 slices wholemeal bread, Flora spread, with mature grated cheddar cheese and pickle, handful of grapes (2 hours later 10.1)
Carbs didn't really interest me or sweets or cakes. Wasn't hungry late at night.
But now I'm finding they do interest me, I'm eating more of them now, plus I'm feeling hungry again at night.
Todays food has been:-
(before 5.8) 2 slices white bread, Flora spread, thin slices of mature cheddar cheese and a sliced tomato sandwich, bananna and 4 small fruit sweets (after 7.7)
(before 8.8) for tea, 7.30pm - small homemade veg lasagne with a salad garnish and a couple of boiled new potatoes (used 2 sheets of pasta 35g raw) Then had a bag of Walkers crisps and a chocolate wafer bar and a handful of red grapes (after 13.9)
Feeling peckish again now and could easily eat something.
My waking hours are later as my sleeping hours are later - I never sleep before 3am.
This is a random run down of BGs from my diary:-
(The figures in brackets show before eating then 2 hours later)
(3.9 - 9.2) (8.0 - 11.1)
(5.0 - 13.9) (5.7 - 7.8)
(3.9 - 5.2) (4.3 - 7.2) (4.4 - 6.8)
(5.9 - 9.8) (4.7 - 7.5)
(3.6 - 10.1) (7.1 - 8.2) (5.3 - 6.1)
(4.6 - 6.4 ) (3.8 - 10.6)
(5.7 - 13.5) (6.2 - 13.9)
(6.7 - 10.9) (7.1 - 8.3) (6.6 - 11.4)
(4.7 - 9.4) (4.8 - 7.8) (6.0 - 7.0)
(4.6 - 5.9) (7.4 - 10.0) (6.0 - 12.0)
(6.4 - 8.7) (5.0 - 13.9)

Thanks Ken, I hope the information I've given you will help
Kind Regards
Jackie

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Hi Jackie.
Thanks for the info....very helpful.

I really do think you need to attack your dietary intake first before thinking that Victoza isn't working. You still seem to be eating a large amount of carby foods which will obviously have a detrimental effect on your Bg levels. It will also feed the craving to have more carbs....not good.

If you will forgive me I think you should take a read of the advice we regularly give out to newbies as the information in there should help you to cut back on things and get the Victoza working efficiently. Pay particular attention to the advice regarding carbs and the effect on Bg levels. Check out food labels carefully to avoid those carbs. You don't have to give them up completely but for a while at least you need to cut them down quite a lot. Here is the advice:

Here is the advice we usually give to newly diagnosed type 2 diabetics.This forum doesn't always follow the recommended dietary advice, you have to work out what works for you as we are all different.

It's not just 'sugars' you need to avoid, diabetes is an inability to process glucose properly. Carbohydrate converts, in the body, to glucose. So it makes sense to reduce the amount of carbohydrate that you eat which includes sugars.

The main carbs to avoid or reduce are the complex or starchy carbohydrates such as bread, potatoes, pasta, rice, starchy root veg and also any flour based products. The starchy carbs all convert 100% to glucose in the body and raise the blood sugar levels significantly.

The way to find out how different foods affect you is to do regular daily testing and keep a food diary for a couple of weeks. If you test just before eating then two hours after eating you will see the effect of certain foods on your blood glucose levels. Some foods, which are slow acting carbohydrates, are absorbed more slowly so you may need to test three or even four hours later to see the affect that these have on your blood glucose levels.

Buy yourself a carb counter book (you can get these on-line) and you will be able to work out how much carbs you are eating, when you test, the reading two hours after should be roughly the same as the before eating reading, if it is then that meal was fine, if it isn’t then you need to check what you have eaten and think about reducing the portion size of carbs.

When you are buying products check the total carbohydrate content, this includes the sugar content. Do not just go by the amount of sugar on the packaging as this is misleading to a diabetic.

As for a tester, try asking the nurse/doctor and explain that you want to be proactive in managing your own diabetes and therefore need to test so that you can see just how foods affect your blood sugar levels. Hopefully this will work ! Sometimes they are not keen to give Type 2’s the strips on prescription, (in the UK) but you can but try !!

As a Type 2 the latest 2010 NICE guidelines for Bg levels are as follows:
Fasting (waking).......between 4 - 7 mmol/l.
2 hrs after meals......no more than 8.5 mmol/l.
If you are able to keep the post meal numbers lower, so much the better.

It also helps if you can do 30 minutes moderate exercise a day. It doesn't have to be strenuous.

Ken/Sue.

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Re: VICTOZA

Thanks Ken for you time and help,
Ok, I will try harder with what I eat and the carb intake.
Thanks for the info, was interesting to read and I've taken note.
I'm sad to think Victoza might not work on me because I was really excited at the prospect of it helping me to lose weight.
Mind you, I didn't like the below par, unwell (not poorly as such) feeling i was getting when I wasn't interested in eating, but at least I was losing the weight, all beit rather drastically though..
And now I'm eating more and have an interest in food again, yes I'm feeling perkier in myself, but I'm disappointed thinking that it isn't working now, as I'm not getting that 'full feeling' so much now, therefore I'm needing and wanting to eat more, which will result in no more weight loss and I will probably gain all that I've lost....
I'm wondering if anyone else has had a similar experience and what was their outcome...?
Thanks again for the tip on the carbs Ken, I will certainly try and do better.
Kind Regards
Jackie

Re: VICTOZA

Hi Jackie ~ I wish Ken had been around when I was first diagnosed Type II. Maybe my life would have been easier! The biggest thing I've found is that the more carbs I eat, the more I want. If I eat more carbs in the evening before bed, then I'm actually hungrier in the morning than if I had eaten some protein before bed. Also, I discovered that even 5 grapes at bedtime will cause my readings to be extremely high in the morning.

I had to keep working at it... my first 3 months have been rough, but I wasn't about to let this med beat me. And now I've learned to work around it and have lost 42 lbs. Keep up the good work and follow Ken's wise advice. :wink:

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MomSherlock said:

Hi Jackie ~ I wish Ken had been around when I was first diagnosed Type II. :

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Hi.

I wish I had been around when I was diagnosed 13 years ago.......I was left to my own devices and made all the mistakes under the Sun !

It was only by researching for ages and then coming here that I turned my life, my Diabetes around.
I owe this place big time and I am just giving back a little of what I learned here and elsewhere. If it helps somebody then it makes me happy too.......

Ken

Re: VICTOZA

I collected my latest pen from my Pharmacist yesterday and had an interesting conversation.

Seems that the NHS are trying to force Novo Nordisk to change their pricing for Victoza. The problem being that Byetta charge the same price for both doses, I was paying £85, but Vitoza is £120 for the 1.2 dose and £163 for the 1.8 dose, the NHS are talking to Novo Nordisk to try and get this figure down to the same cost as Byetta.

This ties in with what I have been told by my GP, I can get Byetta on a NHS prescription, but my local PCT will not fund Victoza due to cost.

Re: VICTOZA

humph said:

I collected my latest pen from my Pharmacist yesterday and had an interesting conversation.

Seems that the NHS are trying to force Novo Nordisk to change their pricing for Victoza. The problem being that Byetta charge the same price for both doses, I was paying £85, but Vitoza is £120 for the 1.2 dose and £163 for the 1.8 dose, the NHS are talking to Novo Nordisk to try and get this figure down to the same cost as Byetta.

This ties in with what I have been told by my GP, I can get Byetta on a NHS prescription, but my local PCT will not fund Victoza due to cost.

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I do not understand how Victoza can be charged by injection dose rate as its a dial-up type of pen where the user decides how much of the liquid is injected from the pen ... 15 days of Victoza per pen if the 1.2 dose is selected each day, and obviously this will be less days if the 1.8 is selected.

Re: VICTOZA

Hobs said:

humph said:

I collected my latest pen from my Pharmacist yesterday and had an interesting conversation.

Seems that the NHS are trying to force Novo Nordisk to change their pricing for Victoza. The problem being that Byetta charge the same price for both doses, I was paying £85, but Vitoza is £120 for the 1.2 dose and £163 for the 1.8 dose, the NHS are talking to Novo Nordisk to try and get this figure down to the same cost as Byetta.

This ties in with what I have been told by my GP, I can get Byetta on a NHS prescription, but my local PCT will not fund Victoza due to cost.

Click to expand...

I do not understand how Victoza can be charged by injection dose rate as its a dial-up type of pen where the user decides how much of the liquid is injected from the pen ... 15 days of Victoza per pen if the 1.2 dose is selected each day, and obviously this will be less days if the 1.8 is selected.

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It is easy, for a 1.2 dose for 1 month, you get a 2 pen box which is £120, for a 1.8 dose for 1 month you get a 3 pen box at £163. There is a slight discount for the third pen. Thats how they do it, they charge by the pen, you use more pens for a higher dose, so you pay more.

Novo Nordisk will have to change if they hope to get final NICE approval for the 1.8 dose, my pharmacist reckons that is unlikely unless they change their pricing in line with Eli Lily.

She has no NHS patient on Victoza and here pharmacy is next door to the local hospital.

Re: VICTOZA

Hello Humph

Why have you changed to Victoza? I thought you were doing okay on the Byetta? I have been struggling trying to see the consultant (they keep changing my appt) and today I have successfully contacted the diabetes nurses and one of them is coming to see me on Thursday morning with a view to changing me on to Victoza. My main reason is because the Victoza is one dose daily - trying to accommodate my IBS as well as Diabetes I have found it very difficult. Anyway, I wait to see what Thursday will bring!!

Jude :roll:

Re: VICTOZA

good luck jude i still get a bit of irratable bowel but i do get quite lot of bloating i am on 1.2 mg but apparently not mant people get to the higher dose1.8 they order my pens in in advance as in hull were i live hardly anyone on it obviously due to the cost one reason i get 3 pens they last 6 weeks omg didnt know it was that expensive i must be one of the lucky ones i guess well good luck jude i always say anything is worth a shot were all trying keep chin up jude missed talking to you wish we lived nearer together be nice to meet you keep smiling hun xxx vivkaroo/ oh and hope you had nice holiday ken hope you got plenty of headache pills stocked up vivkaroo :lol: xx

Re: VICTOZA

Hi Viv.
Nice to hear from you again........(gritted teeth :wink: )

I had a fabulous time my 2 week break went into 5 weeks in the finish.........bliss ! I can recommend it to all.

As for the headache pills......yep, got the GP to give me a job lot, I told him that Vivkaroo is back again. He said, "Oh, better give you some extra strong ones then !" :twisted: :lol:

Seriously, glad things seem to be working out for you now. Always nice to see success stories.

Regards
Ken xx