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Water Fast and Christmas Past

Discussion in 'Diabetes Discussions' started by BloodThirsty, Jan 15, 2019.

  1. BloodThirsty

    BloodThirsty · Well-Known Member

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    Yesterday, upon waking, I started a 12 day water only fast.
    I state this not to seek encouragement (or sympathy) but to ensure that I stick to it rather than publicly own up to dismal failure.

    During the past 28 days my moving average FBG had increased from 5.5 to 6.0 and my bedtime average from 5.4 to 5.8. Christmas and New Year had a lot to do with it, particularly the copious bottles of red plonk which I'd thrown down my neck in short order. Also, although I have not “knowingly” deviated from my low carb diet (apart from the booze) I had avoided ketone testing like the plaque because I knew it wasn't going to be pretty.

    So, at weigh-in yesterday my weight was 73.1 kgs and my BMI 22.5. FBG was 6.0 and the earlier bedtime reading was 5.9. HbA1c was 38 in September 2018.

    For any bored soul that might be mildly interested I intend to add my daily figures along with a short comment concerning how I feel. From day 3 I will also include evening ketone readings taken with a GlucoMen LX Plus meter.

    This is hardly climbing the Matterhorn… but into the fray dear friends!
     
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  2. JohnEGreen

    JohnEGreen Other · Expert

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  3. Jim Lahey

    Jim Lahey I reversed my Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    From the data you’ve provided it’s my opinion that you’d be better suited to just the odd intermittent 24h fast here or there. I’d class twelve days as an extended fast that would best serve a very obese diabetic in need of drastic intervention.

    But that’s just my view and it’s not my intention to change your mind. Good luck, stay safe and keep us posted :)
     
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  4. bulkbiker

    bulkbiker Type 2 · Master

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    I'd second a 12 day water fast as being a very extreme therapy. Have you done anything like that before? Your BMI is hardly excessive (mine is still 27.6) and I do a max of 7 days and not water only (coffee with cream being my addiction). Maybe some alternate day fasts or something a bit less drastic even one meal a day could be beneficial?
     
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  5. BloodThirsty

    BloodThirsty · Well-Known Member

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    Thank you for the link... I particularly like the references to focus and concentration 'cos, as an old fart, I sometimes forget who I am.

    However, I experienced something similar when I was well into my keto diet, but Christmas, like my Mum and Dad, has ****** me up.
     
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  6. JohnEGreen

    JohnEGreen Other · Expert

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    Yes however most of her observation wher largely subjective though being an MD she was able to monitor her physical condition pretty well and the complete blood work up she did after did not throw up any really detrimental effects on her physiology.

    So have at it I say but maybe discuss it with your doctor first. Though I think I know what their reaction would be. Skepticism to say the least.

    Be careful.
     
  7. BloodThirsty

    BloodThirsty · Well-Known Member

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    Thank you for your kind thoughts but I think I need something beyond a 24h fast to get me back on track.

    Our local practice nurse is of the very, very, very strong opinion that T2D is a progressive disease and once you've started the journey it's downhill all the way.

    I therefore fully intend to follow the example of various folk on this site and place myself firmly in remission, not only for my own good but also to demonstrate that she spouts absolute ********.

    I really shouldn't get so worked up, but when the best she can propose is metformin, statins and a high Carb "eat well" menu then I guess it's time to make a point.

    Consider the damage that such thinking is doing to those who follow blindly, or are on the dot org site and truly don't understand that any old Carb is to be avoided (red wine excluded).
     
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  8. bulkbiker

    bulkbiker Type 2 · Master

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    Well you seem pretty determined but please remember if you feel ill at any point then eat something.. and keep on checking in so we can keep an eye on you...
     
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  9. BloodThirsty

    BloodThirsty · Well-Known Member

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    If common sense prevailed I guess you would be right, but it's less about weight loss and more to do with curbing my average BSL's trajectory.

    I also recall a posting of yours that touched on the possible regeneration of beta cells.

    The following paper gives me some hope that a mixture of keto and fasting might help facilitate that very thing:
    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/28235195

    Here's hoping.
     
  10. bulkbiker

    bulkbiker Type 2 · Master

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    Not sure you necessarily have any beta cell problems with T2 just ineffective insulin production because of insulin resistance but it could help. Longo's work is usually on mice and I gave up even reading mice studies a while ago..
    Good luck with it and keep us informed...
     
  11. Jim Lahey

    Jim Lahey I reversed my Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    Send her round my house for a cup of tea and a chat. Hold the biscuits.

    I’ll set her straight.
     
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  12. Ponchu

    Ponchu · Well-Known Member

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    Blood Thirsty, I agree w others re short intermittent fasting but do not wish to discourage you.

    I think that longer fasts are best for combatting illness.

    I wonder if you feel this psychologically necessary

    I hope it’s not “penance” for holiday eating.

    A motivation of A1c change as well as “anti establishment” can fuel resolve.


    I look forward to reading your progress.
     
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  13. BloodThirsty

    BloodThirsty · Well-Known Member

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    That's fighting talk!
     
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  14. Jim Lahey

    Jim Lahey I reversed my Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    I’ll run her through all the hospital appointments I’ve had. Laser surgery. Injections in my eyeballs. Sleepless nights in unspeakable agony with neuropathy pain in my feet - like someone setting fire to my toes and then twisting a dagger into the soles. All of the above now fixed simply by taking control of it myself and ignoring every last shred of ridiculous made-up advice of the kind she seems to be clinging to.

    It only has to get worse if you do what these people tell you. If you don’t, it gets better. I’d be polite about all this, but rest assured she would leave with a very different viewpoint on diabetes prognosis and treatment ;)
     
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  15. BloodThirsty

    BloodThirsty · Well-Known Member

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    Self flagellation is not one of my vices but I do have an obsessive personality which drives me down innappropriate routes on occasion.

    However this time I want to simply try something that might produce some long-lasting benefits as well as kickstart a new keto / intermittent fasting regimen.

    Nonetheless, your kind words are greatly appreciated.
     
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  16. Sue192

    Sue192 Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    Could you try a 7/8 day fast at first @BloodThirsty? Some good advice here re long fasts but like others I am concerned that this is too drastic, particularly for someone of your weigh and BMI. As @bulkbiker says, keep us informed and please break the fast if you feel unwell at all. You may like to try the coffee and cream approach (if you wouldn't find it 'distracting') - that works a treat for me, thanks to @bulkbiker, and it really keeps me going from, say, 7pm until after well after 1pm, although that's obviously IF not continuous fasting. Good luck.
     
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  17. BloodThirsty

    BloodThirsty · Well-Known Member

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    Thank you everyone for your kind words of caution. Although I am unduly obsessive I will not continue past the point that I feel unwell. I am now well into day 2 and am feeling absolutely fine and up for it.

    Interestingly, my blood glucose yesterday bedtime was 5.2 yet 5.7 upon waking. By the end of this exercise I should have a much clearer idea of the dawn phenomena influence on my own metabolism.

    I will sign in tomorrow AM with my bedtime and waking readings along with my weight.
     
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  18. CherryAA

    CherryAA Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    I have just done a 5 day water only fast during which I lost 4 kg, followed by a week refeeding . the attached photos show what happened
     

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  19. CherryAA

    CherryAA Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    By D4 the dawn phenomenon had alsmots disappeared and at D5 I was starting to hit a longer term blood sugar low. I have managed to keep the weight lost off 10 days later - despite some celebrations. I am now doing OMAD for a few days before having another go next week. No discernibl improvement in my dawn phenomenon when actually eating as yet !

    It is true that the hardest days are the first couple, after that the urge to eat reduces dramatically.
     

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  20. BloodThirsty

    BloodThirsty · Well-Known Member

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    Very well done and thank you for the graphs.
    It will be interesting to see if my own dawn phenomena drops off as yours has.
    I am presently writing from a mobile phone so I will open your post later on a tablet to take a better look at your results.
    BTW did you hit any walls during your fast?
     
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