Way too high blood sugar Readings

[Pam]

I was dignosed Type 2 about 3 years ago and taking Metformin, my bs levels were always around 8 or so my metformin was gradually increased to the maximum dose, this didn't seem to lower the levels but i was ok although often tired and took naps. It was so consistent that i stopped blood testing after about a year, but levels were still always about the same on my 6 monthly fasting tests
About 8 weeks ago the result of my last fasting blood test came back at 12 so i was given Gliclazide as well.

Oh i forgot to mention during the 3 years i did not really watch what i ate as nothing seemed to affect my bsl i would even eat Bigmacs and cream cakes! Anyway since the high result i have been extremely careful with my diet eating nothing that i was not allowed, no sugar at all, no fats etc

I had another fasting blood test 4 weeks later and the result was 18!!
Gliclazide was increased and i carried on with my strict diet, about a week later i was horrified to get a reading of 33! My medication has now been changed to still Metformin & Gliclazide but slow release. Still seems to have no effect on my bsl in fact it is extremely erratic, varying between 5 and 22. I am so confused about why the sudden change and why nothing i do seems to have any effect. I actually was taken out for my birthday and had a huge roast dinner followed by chocolate fudge sundae with fresh cream and my level after this was only 13

After 3 years the doctor asked me what had the diabetic clinic said about the change, well this was the 1st i had ever heard of a diabetic clinic but i now have an appointment at the end of this month

Have posted this here in the hopes i can go to this clinic armed with any relevant info that might be useful to help them and me figure out whats going on

I have racked my brain to think of anything different that could have caused this, I took a 10 day course of Champix to help stop smoking about 12 weeks ago, actually did great cut down from 40 a day to 4 in 10 days but the doctor would not give me another prescription because i had not stopped completely, (i have read online that champix can influence bsl) i also had bout of thrush which i cleared up with cream from the chemist, have taken much more regular exercise been eating far less and better foods, doctor said none of which could be the reason! I also feel much more awake than i have for ages and rarely drop off watching TV and i don't have any of my original symptoms of diabetes its almost as if i feel better with high bsl

btw i was also put on Thyroxine about 3 months after the diagnosis of diabetes that medication has never been changed, although i think that i was more lively when i was on Metformin only for 3 months

Would be grateful for any advice or views on this please

Thanks
Pam

 

[fergus]

Not unusual I'm afraid, Pam.
Insulin resistance, followed by insulin overproduction, exaccerbated by Gliclazide, leading to beta cell burnout and uncontrollable blood sugars.
You could do a lot worse than ditch all the empty starches, sugar, pasta, bread, rice, potatoes so your pancreas doesn't have to work so hard. Fats aren't the problem, they can even be the solution.
With bg's in the 30's you might be out of time. See if you can get your numbers down by cutting out the carbs. They're making you ill.

All the best,

fergus

 

[Pam]

hi thanks for the reply but i have already really cut down all the empty starches, sugar, pasta, bread, rice, potatoe....

Apart from one day (my birthday) i have eaten only foods that i am allowed, yes maybe occasional pasta, bread potatoes but only small amounts and not every day (get so much conflicting advice, my doctor said eat baked potatoes and pasta) What are the best foods to help lower the levels?

Also the high numbers came before i was put on Gliclazide and they haven't stabalised since in fact they appear to be going up since the dose of Gliclazide was increased last week

Nice note to go to bed thinking that i might be out of time??
Pam

 

[Spiral]

Welcome Pam. I agree totally with what fergus says.

Whatever stage your diabetes is at and treatment you end up with, cutting the carbs will probably help your health by stabilising your blood sugars and mean that whatever medication you need has a chance to work efficiently.

Running high numbers is likely to make you more prone to developing things like thrush and cystitis as there is so much available food (sugar) for the bugs. The high numbers are probably what is responsible for a lot of the fatigue, although low thyroid function can do that as well. Thyroid problems can sometimes go hand in hand with diabetes.

Apart from this website, the one I found most helpful in getting my act together with my diet when I was first diagnosed was http://www.bloodsugar101.com However, this is an American website and they measure a different figure :roll: The US uses plasma calibrated meters which are mg/dl and require a conversion of dividing by 1.12 then dividing by 18 to get the relevant mmol/L UK number, simples! I know the others have their own favorites too

You need a diet you can stick to for the rest of your life, succesful diabetics reduce the amount of carbohydrate they eat, whatever diet they adopt. Take a look around here, especially in the food and diet forums. Ask questions, the advice and support here is really good

 

[Pam]

Either I am not expressing myself too well or you are not reading my posts, i am NOT feeling tired since the high bsl's in fact i am feeling better than i have over the last 3 years since I was diagnosed and I HAVE been eating correctly for the last 8 weeks since the 1st high bsl!

My problem is that the bsl's have suddenly become high & erratic and i want to know the reason and what i can do to get them down, as what i am eating doesn't seem to have any effect on my bsl. The one time i pigged out my bsl was actually lower than after eating low carb meals

Pam

 

[cugila]

Hi Pam.

The advice from you have been given so far has been very good. You state that you are eating correctly, what would a typical days menu consist of ?

In view of the fact that you are having these problems it may be better if you get a referral to an Endocrinologist who is an expert in all these matters. Your GP is not exactly on the ball if he wants you to eat baked potato and pasta ...!!!

 

[hanadr]

Pam
You ask about sudden changes
Could you be carrying an infection?
that could make a sudden change
Also the pattern f deterioration you describe is typical. It's what the doctors expect to happen to all T2s and it usually leads to insulin therapy, because there's nothing else left.
I was warned it would happen to me 5 years ago, but it hasn't. In fact my use of medication is now minimal. Metformin only.
It's down to reducing my carbohydrate intake 8)
Why the medics tell diabetics to cut down on fats, when we can metabolise them perfectly well and to base our eating plan on carbs, which we cannot? It is madness.
If you have totally wiped out your beta cells with Gliclazide, there will be nothing but insulin left for you, but if you still have some beta cell activity,cutting your carbs back drastically should help. In any case, it won't hurt to try.

 

[Pam]

Hi yes i realise the advice given is good advice but i can't see the relevance to my circumstances. Today (morning bsl 11.9) i slice of Weightwatchers wholegrain bread toasted with a thin scraping of Flora extra light for breakfast (2 hour bsl 11.7), this was at 11am as i overlayed, no lunch as i was out until 5pm (bsl 7.7)then had 2 boiled eggs, 1 slice WW bread followed by some melon & grapes bsl 12.8. Yesterday after the same breakfast (always the same) bsl was 23.1

Yes i have a referral but not until the end of the month and am trying to gather as much info as possible before the appointment
Thanks
Pam

Hi Pam.

The advice from you have been given so far has been very good. You state that you are eating correctly, what would a typical days menu consist of ?

In view of the fact that you are having these problems it may be better if you get a referral to an Endocrinologist who is an expert in all these matters. Your GP is not exactly on the ball if he wants you to eat baked potato and pasta ...!!!

 

[Pam]

Actually the doctor thought at first i was coming down with an infection but 8 weeks later no infection, the only infection i had a while back was thrush which cleared up in a couple of days, can we carry infections and not know about them?

I have only been on Gliclazide for about 6 weeks but it was increased this week by the doc, doesn't seem to have had any effect on the bsl's at all

Thanks
Pam

Pam
You ask about sudden changes
Could you be carrying an infection?
that could make a sudden change
Also the pattern f deterioration you describe is typical. It's what the doctors expect to happen to all T2s and it usually leads to insulin therapy, because there's nothing else left.
I was warned it would happen to me 5 years ago, but it hasn't. In fact my use of medication is now minimal. Metformin only.
It's down to reducing my carbohydrate intake 8)
Why the medics tell diabetics to cut down on fats, when we can metabolise them perfectly well and to base our eating plan on carbs, which we cannot? It is madness.
If you have totally wiped out your beta cells with Gliclazide, there will be nothing but insulin left for you, but if you still have some beta cell activity,cutting your carbs back drastically should help. In any case, it won't hurt to try.

 

[sugarless sue]

Hi yes i realise the advice given is good advice but i can't see the relevance to my circumstances. Today (morning bsl 11.9) i slice of Weightwatchers wholegrain bread toasted with a thin scraping of Flora extra light for breakfast (2 hour bsl 11.7), this was at 11am as i overlayed, no lunch as i was out until 5pm (bsl 7.7)then had 2 boiled eggs, 1 slice WW bread followed by some melon & grapes bsl 12.8. Yesterday after the same breakfast (always the same) bsl was 23.1

Yes i have a referral but not until the end of the month and am trying to gather as much info as possible before the appointment
Thanks
Pam

Hi Pam,can I ask,are you on any other medication? Medications such as steroids can make your BG go up a lot.
As regards your diet, grapes are high in carbs and it is not a good idea to go too long between meals as you tend to liver dump and send your blood sugars way up.
What was your morning fasting level before you had the bg of 23.1?

 

[Pam]

are you on any other medication? Medications such as steroids can make your BG go up a lot

The only different medications i have been on are Champix & thrush cream

grapes are high in carbs and it is not a good idea to go too long between meals as you tend to liver dump and send your blood sugars way up

i didn't know that grapes were high carb, knew they are high sugar but read that the skins are good for diabetes plus i love them

What was your morning fasting level before you had the bg of 23.1?

15.0

Thanks Pam

 

[cugila]

Hi Pam.

Grapes are 16.5g carbs for a very small portion of around 80g weight. Just a few grapes only. I love them too but I know not to eat them like I used to - by the dozen or more !! I steer well clear of them and cherries. If you want the benefit of the grapes try drinking the odd glass of a good red wine instead. Very beneficial.

 

[sugarless sue]

Champix:

The FDA also received 544 reports suggesting varenicline may be related to a loss of glycemic control, including many cases of weight loss or gain that could have alternative causes, but also identified numerous cases of symptoms and laboratory tests consistent with new onset diabetes.

http://www.news-medical.net/news/2008/05/25/38637.aspx

This may or may not have a bearing on your erratic BG levels, best to discuss with Endocrinologist when you see him.

 

[Pam]

Actually have only started eating grapes since the high blood sugar using them to munch on as i thought better than M&M's or biscuits guess i had better sip red wine instead but i have read that they may be quite good for diabetics
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2008/03/080318094514.htm

Hi Pam.

Grapes are 16.5g carbs for a very small portion of around 80g weight. Just a few grapes only. I love them too but I know not to eat them like I used to - by the dozen or more !! I steer well clear of them and cherries. If you want the benefit of the grapes try drinking the odd glass of a good red wine instead. Very beneficial.

 

[Pam]

Hi Sue and thanks I have read this on the net too and will certainly discuss at the clinic later this month, i have mentioned this to 3 doctors at my practice and none have thought it could have any bearing on my high levels but I hadn't seen the article when i mentioned it, in fact the non smoking clinic asked for my doctors approval before she would prescribe them and it was given!!

I started taking Champix on 15th June but my high bsl was up before this at the fasting blood test on 1st June (12) , Doc put me on Gliclazide on 15th July and i had another fasting blood test on 21st July and bsl was 18, (prior to this it was always about 8 or 9 for 3 years)the highest bsl was on 26th July and it was 33.3

My concern is that if Champix can cause diabetes how does it affect people who already have diabetes?
Pam

Champix:

The FDA also received 544 reports suggesting varenicline may be related to a loss of glycemic control, including many cases of weight loss or gain that could have alternative causes, but also identified numerous cases of symptoms and laboratory tests consistent with new onset diabetes.

http://www.news-medical.net/news/2008/05/25/38637.aspx

This may or may not have a bearing on your erratic BG levels, best to discuss with Endocrinologist when you see him.

 

[Pam]

Another point about Champix is that usually the drug is only taken for 10 days as by Day 10 you should have stopped smoking so its not a long term medication, if it does cause damage it must be fairly quick acting and long lasting

 

[cugila]

Grapes. Don't believe everything you read...it's not the grapes that are good for you but the skins which contain Resveratrol, a compound present naturally in grape skin, can protect against the cellular damage to blood vessels caused by high production of glucose in diabetes. This is what you get in Red Wine as well.

So you would be better off peeling the grapes and eating the skins, or the easy way....a glass of Red wine instead. Enjoy.

 

[hanadr]

Pam looking through where you have emphasised something you are eating, "Thin Scraping of FLora extra light" "better than M&ms or biscuits" It looks to me as if your eating focus is on fats and sugars and you are unaware of the effects of the so-called "complex carbohydrates" which many medics seem to think are good for diabetics. Unless you can incease the amount of insulin in your circulation, they will push your BG up.
Check out the Sticky on carbohydrates. Also get a copy of Collins Little Gem Calorie counter. It contains nutritional information on hundreds of foods and costs about £5. It's also small enough for a handbag.
You need to find out if you still have functioning beta cells. If as you say, Gliclazide isn't doing anything, that doesn't look too good. If they've gone, insulin is all that's left really,unless you can get your doctor to let you try one of the new medications. Byetta, Victoza. Sone PCTs don't fund them because they are expensive.
I'm not sure how they work when insulin production is gone.
It's a terrible shame that the medical esablishment is so wedded to the "eat carbs and take more medicines" method of diabetes control. If they were less pig headed, Fewer T2s would need to use insulin.
Hana

 

[Pam]

I will indulge in a glass of red wine now and again its one of my fav drinks, i did more or less gave up alcohol about 10 years ago but still have an occasional tipple usually the odd glass of champagne or a pimms, actually when i pigged out on my birthday i had a glass of red wine too maybe thats why my bs didn't go sky high after all the stuff i ate i shouldn't have

Wonder if anything is produced from the grape skins alone eg some type of supplement?

Grapes. Don't believe everything you read...it's not the grapes that are good for you but the skins which contain Resveratrol, a compound present naturally in grape skin, can protect against the cellular damage to blood vessels caused by high production of glucose in diabetes. This is what you get in Red Wine as well.

So you would be better off peeling the grapes and eating the skins, or the easy way....a glass of Red wine instead. Enjoy.

 

[cugila]

You can actually buy high strength patches here if you wish.
http://www.resveratrolpatch.co.uk/