Type 2 What can I eat?

[Dickensfan]

Hello Dickensian,i will ask @daisy1. To give you the info pack , have a good read and come back with any q's, clive

@Dickensfan, cannot help you regarding the allergies, perhaps someone else has some information or experience.

Please do not let being diabetic drag you down. All you have to do is change a few simple but ingrained eating habits, that is to drastically reduce your sugar intake and carbs. Everything you buy in a supermarket has a label with the carb content. Fresh produce does not but rule of thumb is if it grows above the ground it is ok, below the ground might it not be. You can find nutritional value of any raw ingredients online.

This link has lots of recipes if you feel unable to amend your own just now, http://www.diabetes.co.uk/forum/category/food-nutrition-and-recipes.3/

You will be fine, it is just a wee adjustment, in a few months you will own this low carb malarky, trust me.

Thanks Kate, and to be honest the things you've highlighted here I already know, indeed, has been my way of living pre diabetes, I've always cooked from scratch using fresh ingredients, so I don't use processed foods, and I only ever have drank, tea coffee and water, i don't take milk or sugar in anything, and I don't and have never drank fizzy drinks, have never even tasted coca cola and such like, the only reason I mention all of this is for the sake of others reading my posts, but I did have a weakness for pasta and cheese, I'd go so far as to say having had none of those or potatoes in the past month i feel a lot better within myself, though i've lost no weight which is a thing I have to get used to as my rate of losing weight has always been very slow unless on a very low calorie diet which always worked for me, but I realize I can't do so as a diabetic - thanks for all your input as i've taken it on board - one of the reasons i'm mystified at being diabetic is because I already had a good diet, with the exception of bread, cheese and pasta. I see from this site how popular the low carb diets seems to be, as long as I can still eat loads of fruit I'll be a happy bunny.

 

[Dickensfan]

If you haven't already can I highly recommend you take a look at this website (I've directly linked you to the vegetarian recipes for low carbing page)
http://www.dietdoctor.com/low-carb/recipes/vegetarian

It's a fantastic site and all the info is free - they don't try to sell you anything - although you can join and then get free access to even more info and various films and conference lectures on low carb higher fats way of eating. The site also links to Dr Jason Fungs work on intermittent fasting for weight loss which you might find interesting and the 'food window' where you restrict food to an 8 hour period in the day (most people skip breakfast and eat between 12 and 8pm). Lots of people have found this helpful in kick starting weight loss.

I joined as I believe this information needs to be spread widely to get people healthy whether they have diabetes or not. My non diabetic son has lost over a stone following the low carb life and considers it a minor miracle and he loves the food. Diet doctor totally cured my food confusion when I started researching what to eat.

It's just as well you don't like brown rice or pasta as they are really just as bad as white - will still spike your blood sugar but might take longer to get there. As long as you are not vegan then eggs and cheese are probably your biggest friends along with nuts and above ground veggies.

Personally I believe the paleo idea also has some merit (i.e avoiding as much as possible all processed food) but I definitely eat a lot of dairy so not a full fledged paleo person I love my berries and double cream as dessert and creme fraiche and mustard on veggies is divine.

Oh a quick tip on the boiled eggs - if you can give up the bread that will help so instead put butter on the eggs. I slice off tiny bits of butter and push it into the yolks - fantastic and then I don't miss the bread as it's the buttery taste I was missing not so much the bread....I also put loads of salt on (as I don't eat processed food (high in salt) or use salt in cooking much as I stir fry veggies in coconut oil mostly so I think I can have a bit of salt on my eggs!

If you can get strips prescribed then go for as many as you can. For a couple of weeks I was testing fasting BG then before and one and two hours after each meal and keeping careful notes. After a week or two it became pretty clear what i could eat with impunity and what I needed to avoid.

One other tip though if you find your BG raised a brisk 15-20 minute walk will usually do a good job of bringing it down (I've walked round the house or up and down stairs if necessary or marched on the spot in front of the TV!) and you can test if it's effective for you by using the meter.

Interested to read about the dry skin - I had small patches on my arms for years that looked like allergies or eczema but weren't. Since taking up the low carb high fat lifestyle they've vanished .

Hi seadragon, the skin thing really bothers me, and it's only been happening in the past six - ten months which unknown to me was me being diabetic, I wasn't sent to the doc for tests, I asked them to do the blood tests on me, initially I hoped to eliminate diabetes - but there you go, the skin on my eyelids is sore today, same thing a couple of weeks ago, means I can't wear any makeup. This is all bad for me, as I've often been complimented on my skin whatever my age, and i've always taken care of my skin, so for me to suddenly have these problems is a real downer and I can't put anything on my eyelids in case it goes into my eyes when i sleep, so I'm taking it step at a time.

I've seen the diet you've mentioned on diet doctor, I think that's an American site, and I'm not crazy about American sites, but I'll have a look at it again. I know and I do only eat now and in the past above ground veg, a lot of fruit. I personally won't eat cream or even creme freche I can't get my head around the stuff that blocks the arteries. I remember all the ho hum about the Atkins diet which I wouldn't touch with a barge pole, there is no way you could stay on that way of eating and remain healthy - if that's the case, I need to be convinced.
Thanks for your reply. Yes my doctor gave me, lances, testing strips and the blood sugar monitor, all free as we don't pay in Scotland.

 

[seadragon]

Hi seadragon, the skin thing really bothers me, and it's only been happening in the past six - ten months which unknown to me was me being diabetic, I wasn't sent to the doc for tests, I asked them to do the blood tests on me, initially I hoped to eliminate diabetes - but there you go, the skin on my eyelids is sore today, same thing a couple of weeks ago, means I can't wear any makeup. This is all bad for me, as I've often been complimented on my skin whatever my age, and i've always taken care of my skin, so for me to suddenly have these problems is a real downer and I can't put anything on my eyelids in case it goes into my eyes when i sleep, so I'm taking it step at a time.

I've seen the diet you've mentioned on diet doctor, I think that's an American site, and I'm not crazy about American sites, but I'll have a look at it again. I know and I do only eat now and in the past above ground veg, a lot of fruit. I personally won't eat cream or even creme freche I can't get my head around the stuff that blocks the arteries. I remember all the ho hum about the Atkins diet which I wouldn't touch with a barge pole, there is no way you could stay on that way of eating and remain healthy - if that's the case, I need to be convinced.
Thanks for your reply. Yes my doctor gave me, lances, testing strips and the blood sugar monitor, all free as we don't pay in Scotland.

I get very itchy eyes if my blood sugar is raised even a little bit - another reason to cut the carbs! Strangely I used to suffer from an irritating cough after every meal and since I've cut carbs and gone high fat that has simply vanished (and i'd had it for donkeys years!)
I understand people being sceptical of the higher fat aspect - believe me I was too. The diet doctor site is Swedish and Sweden now has lower rates of heart disease and diabetes since the low carb high fat has taken off. If you read around the site you will see there are many studies that show not only that much of the research that says high fat clogged your arteries was flawed but explains why the real culprit is high sugars and particularly high fat and high sugar together (which is basically what much of the western diet is these days).

It truly is not an American site - although there are links to some American doctors and films on there. Do you mean Jason Fung - he may indeed be American but if the diet doctor believes in him so do I. I spent weeks looking at everything I could find on the internet and came across many dodgy sites promising this and that and miracle cures but this is the most genuine and helpful site I have ever found. I joined not to get anything but because I believed in them so much i think more people should know about it.

I eat double cream every day and I smother my veggies in creme fraiche and peri peri seasoning and they are delicious. i have been doing this for nearly a year and my lipid profile is way better than before. Trigs halved and LDL halved and the protective HDL doubled. Can only be a good thing.

The Atkins diet was vilified largely by scientists and doctors who felt threatened - much as Yudkin who wrote 'Pure White and Deadly' about sugar back in the 70's was discredited unfairly by those who supported the Ancel Keys diet-heart hypothesis i.e 'fat is bad', (now shown to be totally flawed and even Keys himself backtracked but wasn't allowed to publish his backtracking.)

The Atkins diet has it's flaws too - I think it was a bit too high in protein and that could cause some people problems. Plus for some people you do get the 'carb flu' for a few weeks as the body adjusts - but I never had this I literally gave up eating bread pasta, rice, potatoes and anything carby overnight (and I used to live on toast!) and replaced them with good fats from whole fat dairy, double cream, cheese, creme fraiche, avocados, olive oil and for cooking coconut oil and for me animal fats too although I realise as a vegetarian you wouldn't eat these. I've been eating this way now for 10 months and I feel fantastic on it. I am never hungry despite losing weight (or more accurately fat as I have lost about 8% body fat) Lost 2 dress sizes without even trying (fat fills you up so much more than carbs and you don't get the carb crash or cravings (sugar is highly addictive)). It is sugar that is effortlessly turns to fat in our bodies not fat ( they just happen to share the same word). I am now fully fat adapted even if not always ketogenic (be wary of the people who confuse ketogenic (it's good ,it just means your body can burn fat as fuel) with keto-acidosis (life threatening condition typically experienced by some type 1 diabetics).

My weight is now pretty stable having lost over a stone, 8% body fat lost, lipid profile improved, BG now classed as non-diabetic (HbA1c of 35), skin cleared, many minor health niggles vanished, boundless energy , no carb crash or irritability caused by hunger. It has literally transformed my life for the better.

A good book based on the low carb lifestyle is' Lean in 15' can't remember who it is by but my son swears by it and has lost over a stone in weight too and feels fantastic on it while really enjoying the food (may not be so veggie friendly though)

The only fruit I eat is raspberries and blueberries - others have a bit too much fructose for me - you may be lucky and able to eat more fruits without spiking but testing with the meter is the way to go.

Rather than thinking fat makes you fat or clogs arteries (which has been shown to be untrue anyway ) I like to think of the fat oiling the joints and smoothing the way while sugar (which all carbs become in the body) gums up the works. When you think of it that way it reminds you to avoid the sugar and carbs.

I had a friend with a degree in nutrition who said 'but you need carbs to live'
My answer - 'Do I look dead?"

I am happier, fitter, lighter, healthier and I enjoy my food. Would I go back to the old way of eating or follow the NHS Eatwell plate - NO! Not unless I wanted to get sicker and I don't.

Take the dietdoctor low carb two week challenge (I think there is a vegetarian version now or they are working on it at least) and see how you feel then. Am I convincing? I promise I have no vested interest other than in other people's health and well being but feel very passionate about spreading the low carb/higher good fats word especially to diabetics.

 

[Dickensfan]

Thanks seadragon that was very helpful. I must confess to liking butter far better than any of the alternatives. I do love fruit and we be so lost if I couldn't have it. I eat a lot of strawberries, blackberries, love love love blueberries and go through a lot of them, the LCHF you mention for a short time, I assume that's just to get used to it, then you continue on it. My dinner tonight was half a cabbage and broccoli, to be honest that's what I had last night as well as sweetcorn on the cob LoL I get peckish at this time of night and want to eat something, even on days when I have had no carbs at all, I still feel hungry, but I'll go check out diet doctor again, thanks.

 

[Phub]

I'm very confused. I was diagnosed with type 2 only a few weeks ago, and I still am unsure what I'm supposed to eat most of, and eat less of. I don't see the dietician until the 27th, and I hope it's not a dietician who is going to tell me what to eat and what not to eat to lose weight - trust me, I know exactly what foods put weight on and thus should be avoided, so i don't want that kind of lecture as I already know, I'm hoping therefore, that she will explain to me what to eat and what not to eat only in reference to the diabetic side of my life.
I have read on here that one cat eat nuts (unsalted of course) berries and cheese, I've always been under the impression that dairy products and nuts were fattening, although I know nuts are also high in protein - I'd like someone to simplify all of this for me, in a 'nutshell' no pun intended, at least until I can ask the dietician.

 

[seadragon]

If you have a meter I'd test yourself after corn on the cob as it's not really a vegetable but a carby cereal type crop. You do need to replace the carbs with something ( not sure how you can fill up on broccoli and cabbage although smothering them in butter would help if you don't want to use creme fraiche) and good fats do seem to make the most sense as they are very satisfying. I bought loads of nuts to have as snacks but in fact find I never need snacks! Now have loads of nuts I need to eat up - time for a nut roast maybe

The low carb high fat diet challenge is just an introduction - they make it easy with recipes and shopping lists to encourage people to do it. They do have a lot of other recipes avaialable on the site though for when you realise this is a lifestyle change not a fad diet and you want to eat this way for the rest of your life!

 

[Phub]

Don't take this the wrong way, but your post suggests otherwise. Maybe I'm wrong, but it's important to understand that "Fattening" foods aren't necessarily those that contain fat.

There are a lot of misconceptions about what will or will not cause you to gain weight. It also has a great deal of relevance to what is good for managing your diabetes.

Ultimately, we know that a high carb/high fat diet is bad for you. The combination of carbs/dietary fats leads to energy storage in the form of body fat.

We also know that a high carb/low fat diet (considering total calories) can help achieve weight loss. That was popular several decades ago and it's largely still considered to be the "standard" advice offered to most people with diabetes. Unfortunately, we also know that carbohydrates can be converted into glucose which means this type of a diet can cause large blood sugar spikes. Many people's bodies have trouble recovering from those spikes within the standard 2-hr period.

Then, there is the high fat/low carb diet. The initial impression is often "You're crazy." However, it's a diet that's been around for over 100 years and was first popularized to address people who were prone to seizures. The diet is most effective because it generally does not require you to limit your calories and feel hungry all the time. Furthermore, by limiting your carbohydrates you're avoiding blood glucose spikes which has allowed many of us (in one way or another) to reach a1c levels we would otherwise be unable to achieve.

With that said, the low carb/high fat diet is not one to try for a week and then do something new. Some find it easier to sustain than others and it's ultimately a diet you would want to maintain for the rest of your life (or until your diabetes is "reversed"). The diet hasn't gained much popularity with dieticians and doctors, but personally blame that on the fact that it's not right for everyone (whereas everyone should exercise "portion control" in one way or another).

 

[Phub]

I think the HFLC diet has been around for a lot longer than 100 years, and I believe it's our natural diet. Imagine you are shipwrecked on an island where there is vegetation and wild life. You would be in the position in which our forefathers found themselves, before they knew how to make food, such as bread. Nothing to eat except game, fish, nuts and green veggies, and berries. Once you learned to hunt and gather; voila! Your natural diet! It's been around since our species evolved; and we haven't altered physiologically to this day. You could live on just vegetables, but not well, and only in season. The return in energy for all the foraging would be a shortfall. Sooner or later you'd have to catch fish or game. So if today you eat as close to that list as possible, your shouldn't have to worry about blood sugar, cholesterol, and obesity. Our forefathers didn't.

 

[Dickensfan]

If you have a meter I'd test yourself after corn on the cob as it's not really a vegetable but a carby cereal type crop. You do need to replace the carbs with something ( not sure how you can fill up on broccoli and cabbage although smothering them in butter would help if you don't want to use creme fraiche) and good fats do seem to make the most sense as they are very satisfying. I bought loads of nuts to have as snacks but in fact find I never need snacks! Now have loads of nuts I need to eat up - time for a nut roast maybe

The low carb high fat diet challenge is just an introduction - they make it easy with recipes and shopping lists to encourage people to do it. They do have a lot of other recipes avaialable on the site though for when you realise this is a lifestyle change not a fad diet and you want to eat this way for the rest of your life!

Oddly enough seadragon - the corn on the cob is something I rarely have, last time I had it was well over a year ago, I'm not that keen, so probably won't have it again for a very long time - now based on what you said, probably never again.

I know this diabetes is life changing, but i don't want it to be the be all and end all of my life, and that's what it has been since I was diagnosed, because too there is so much conflicting information around, that why I said i was confused. I must admit though when I got the results from the nurse/practitioner at my practice, that's all i was told was that I had type 2, no tips, help or information, I was left with it.

I'll go to the dietdoctors' website

 

[Dickensfan]

I think the HFLC diet has been around for a lot longer than 100 years, and I believe it's our natural diet. Imagine you are shipwrecked on an island where there is vegetation and wild life. You would be in the position in which our forefathers found themselves, before they knew how to make food, such as bread. Nothing to eat except game, fish, nuts and green veggies, and berries. Once you learned to hunt and gather; voila! Your natural diet! It's been around since our species evolved; and we haven't altered physiologically to this day. You could live on just vegetables, but not well, and only in season. The return in energy for all the foraging would be a shortfall. Sooner or later you'd have to catch fish or game. So if today you eat as close to that list as possible, your shouldn't have to worry about blood sugar, cholesterol, and obesity. Our forefathers didn't.

You do make some good points of course, and I take it on board. I could eat fish and chicken, but I have never even tasted red meat, lamb pork and loads more, but I have had chicken and fish so I could go from being vegi to being peski whats its name!

I love nuts - always the unsalted kind is my preference but only now and then. I read an article years ago which stated that the body needed only one nut per day - that nut was the brazil nut, it has everything our bodies need and I've always remembered that, and I can eat just one.

 

[Phub]

The two most suitable nuts are pecan and Brazils. Pecans are expensive in the UK but they are delicious! This is if you are on a HFLC diet btw. These two varieties re the lowest sugar 'spikers' for want of a better expression.
You wouldn't need to fill up on broccoli, if you eat meat. Protein keeps you sated for a longer time than veggies. If I breakfast on a cheese omelette using three eggs, I don't need to eat any more until evening when I have my meat course. I might snatch a few nuts at mid-day. I save my fruit for after evening meal!

HTH
Phub

 

[seadragon]

Oddly enough seadragon - the corn on the cob is something I rarely have, last time I had it was well over a year ago, I'm not that keen, so probably won't have it again for a very long time - now based on what you said, probably never again.

I know this diabetes is life changing, but i don't want it to be the be all and end all of my life, and that's what it has been since I was diagnosed, because too there is so much conflicting information around, that why I said i was confused. I must admit though when I got the results from the nurse/practitioner at my practice, that's all i was told was that I had type 2, no tips, help or information, I was left with it.

I'll go to the dietdoctors' website

The diabetes thing did seem to take over for a while and it is shocking and upsetting and confusing at first. Took me quite some weeks to work out what was worth listening to/ reading and what wasn't. I didn't discover this forum for quite a while and wished I had found it earlier to benefit from the wealth of experience of actual diabetics on here. I was given the leaflet from Diabetes UK but found they just followed NHS guides and diets which i now believe to be entirely unsuitable for diabetics and much of the information was aimed at insulin using diabetics rather than trying to help those wanting to avoid medications.
I read a load of books from Dr Bernstein, Dr Cavan etc etc and that's why I liked the diet doctor site so much as it seemed to bring together all the latest research in one place and have well documented success stories and clear information on the LCHF lifestyle and why it works. You are probably better off not having been given much info from doctors since NHS is still pushing it's Eatwell plate even for diabetics and I can't see how that can do anything other than make you sicker since they emphasise starchy carbs at every meal (if I followed their advice i'd have increased my carb intake considerably over what I ate before).

I can see why the NHS believe Type 2 is a progressive disease as if you follow their advice it will be. If instead you follow LCHF (or if you are masochistically inclined The Newcastle Diet which seems to work for many but involves 8 weeks of severe deprivation and I'm not into starving and suffering), then you will be much better off and stand a much better chance of regaining non-diabetic blood sugar levels. Do also have a look at the LCHF forum on here dn read the success stories too for inspiration.
For me it's been life- changing in a positive way as I am so much healthier and fitter now and i'd never have had the motivation to change otherwise.

 

[Dickensfan]

The two most suitable nuts are pecan and Brazils. Pecans are expensive in the UK but they are delicious! This is if you are on a HFLC diet btw. These two varieties re the lowest sugar 'spikers' for want of a better expression.
You wouldn't need to fill up on broccoli, if you eat meat. Protein keeps you sated for a longer time than veggies. If I breakfast on a cheese omelette using three eggs, I don't need to eat any more until evening when I have my meat course. I might snatch a few nuts at mid-day. I save my fruit for after evening meal!

HTH
Phub

Thanks Phub for the info - I always have pecans and brazils in my cupboard before and since being diagnosed with T2, the only way I would get the proteins is from chicken or fish, as I would never, never in a million years eat any other kind of meat been this way since I was 5 years old.

 

[Dickensfan]

The diabetes thing did seem to take over for a while and it is shocking and upsetting and confusing at first. Took me quite some weeks to work out what was worth listening to/ reading and what wasn't. I didn't discover this forum for quite a while and wished I had found it earlier to benefit from the wealth of experience of actual diabetics on here. I was given the leaflet from Diabetes UK but found they just followed NHS guides and diets which i now believe to be entirely unsuitable for diabetics and much of the information was aimed at insulin using diabetics rather than trying to help those wanting to avoid medications.
I read a load of books from Dr Bernstein, Dr Cavan etc etc and that's why I liked the diet doctor site so much as it seemed to bring together all the latest research in one place and have well documented success stories and clear information on the LCHF lifestyle and why it works. You are probably better off not having been given much info from doctors since NHS is still pushing it's Eatwell plate even for diabetics and I can't see how that can do anything other than make you sicker since they emphasise starchy carbs at every meal (if I followed their advice i'd have increased my carb intake considerably over what I ate before).

I can see why the NHS believe Type 2 is a progressive disease as if you follow their advice it will be. If instead you follow LCHF (or if you are masochistically inclined The Newcastle Diet which seems to work for many but involves 8 weeks of severe deprivation and I'm not into starving and suffering), then you will be much better off and stand a much better chance of regaining non-diabetic blood sugar levels. Do also have a look at the LCHF forum on here dn read the success stories too for inspiration.
For me it's been life- changing in a positive way as I am so much healthier and fitter now and i'd never have had the motivation to change otherwise.

I will certainly return to that forum and read up on it. I am due to see the dietician on 27th at my surgery - not looking forward to this as I believe she will be more concerned by pushing the nhs view and weight issues, rather than what's best for me in terms of losing weight and controlling my BS.

when I went to the practice nurse for my blood results at the beginning of March, she told me I was type 2 and that the reading to diagnose someone with type 2 was between 6 and 6.9, she looked at me and said 'and yours was 20.9, which tells me you've had this for a while' well you could have knocked me down with a feather when she said it was as high as that, so i'm working with meds, at bringing it down, and I realize this is very important for the rest of my life, my feet, eyesight etc, which is why I have become depressed about all of this, and I so desperately want to do the right thing, hence my panic about being on the right track.

 

[Phub]

My pleasure, but remember, I am speaking only from my own experiences. I am quite sure you can get by on chicken and maybe other poultry for variety. I cook chicken once a month; and it lasts my wife and I the whole week through, with salads. I don't eat potatoes with my meat, and fill my veg requirements with greens and peppers.
Best of luck . Now I am off to Bed, with a good book.

Ta Ta For Now.

 

[Dickensfan]

My pleasure, but remember, I am speaking only from my own experiences. I am quite sure you can get by on chicken and maybe other poultry for variety. I cook chicken once a month; and it lasts my wife and I the whole week through, with salads. I don't eat potatoes with my meat, and fill my veg requirements with greens and peppers.
Best of luck . Now I am off to Bed, with a good book.

Ta Ta For Now.

Thanks for reply, I'll check it out again, my fridge always has fresh veg and I adore peppars too.

 

[TorqPenderloin]

I think the HFLC diet has been around for a lot longer than 100 years, and I believe it's our natural diet. Imagine you are shipwrecked on an island where there is vegetation and wild life. You would be in the position in which our forefathers found themselves, before they knew how to make food, such as bread. Nothing to eat except game, fish, nuts and green veggies, and berries. Once you learned to hunt and gather; voila! Your natural diet! It's been around since our species evolved; and we haven't altered physiologically to this day. You could live on just vegetables, but not well, and only in season. The return in energy for all the foraging would be a shortfall. Sooner or later you'd have to catch fish or game. So if today you eat as close to that list as possible, your shouldn't have to worry about blood sugar, cholesterol, and obesity. Our forefathers didn't.

You're absolutely right that some humans consumed a low-carb diet well before the early 20th century. What I was speaking to was the popularization of the diet as a medical approach (originally with a purpose of minimizing seizures).

As far as your example about being on a deserted island, I agree with the general concept of what you're getting at, but you have to remember that carbs have been consumed by humans for tens of thousands of years. That's part of the reason why I think the "Paleo" diet is silly (mostly because of its name). While I appreciate the concept of what it is, there is plenty of evidence to show that humans had discovered how to bake and eat bread more than 30,000 years ago.

I will say that my beliefs are similar to yours. I believe it's important to consider your ancestry as different cultures have adapted to eating different kinds of foods. Fortunately, I'm part French (a culture known for eating bread) and part Japanese (a culture known for eating rice) which may explain why most dietary approaches work very well for me and I don't have a sensitivity to carbs like some do (However, type 2 diabetes does run in part of my family)

 

[amgrundy]

Thank you for all of your replies, and I shall give them my attention, I find some of the info here and elsewhere difficult mainly because I am a vegetarian, indeed, I've eaten no beef, pork etc. since I was five years old, possibly younger, I am now 67 so what I'm trying to do is work out what is best for me, as an individual, from the diabetes point of view.

Thanks for taking the time to reply.

Hi Dickensfan, Welcome to the forum best place for you to be. Lots of supportive and friendly people on here who will answer your many questions with good advice if they can we all have diabetes but some of us can tolerate different foods, so try and test 2 hrs after you have eaten. Here I go again, I tell every new member this please go to the forum " What Have You Eaten Today " it is a good forum especially for people who are struggling in what to eat. A lot of us put our daily meals on there and has some good ideas for us all to try. Good luck stick with us we are all in the same boat, you will not get better advice than on this site.

 

[Phub]

Points taken of course, but perhaps what I wanted to stress was the fact that all those years ago, we didn't eat a lot of starches. Certainly there were few 'simple carbs' such as bread, other pastries and refined sugar. I eat carbs, but only green vegetables, and an occasional serving of beans.

As an aside, because of the belief that fat is a problem, there is something dietitians might have overlooked. The fact is that whilst most 'junk/fast food' is a serving of meat, the biggest part of the 'dish' is bread, or a portion of french fries. (nothing to do with France BTW; but potatoes that have been 'frenched' into slices! ) Other examples are pizzas, again mostly pastry; hot dogs; served on a bread roll; a donna kebab; served in a pitta bread; (with a salad, healthy enough but carbs again.) A nourishing piece of cod; served in flour-batter with a portion of chips!

In other words when you eat fast food you consume a sizable amount of starchy carbs. With that in mind, I think it's no great leap of the imagination to suspect starch as the villain. So, maybe it's not the burger that does the damage, but the bun"! As recently as the 1980s, you could buy a loaf called 'Slimcea', a starch reduced bread for dieters. Maybe you still can buy it. If these days wholemeal bread is suddenly a healthy option, why was it then considered good to reduce its starch?

The dictate for diabetics was once a resounding, NO STARCH! What has changed? Economic s I think. The grain industry suddenly got bigger. Wholemeal bread is different to white bread only in the roughage it contains. So to me, bread is bread! A dollop of starch, and I consider it to be the Staff of Death rather than life!

PS .. I would eat bread if that's all there was, but only in that unlikely scenario!
Cheers.
Phub (John).

 

[britishpub]

Ythere is plenty of evidence to show that humans had discovered how to bake and eat bread more than 30,000 years ago.

I would think the Wheat used 30,000 years ago was very different to the Wheat used today.

That is probably the crux of the matter. It's not that Humans didn't or haven't eaten Carbs for thousands of years, it's the highly processed Carbs, that are grown for yield rather than quality, that we are force fed today that are the problem.