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EU - In or Out + Poll.

EU: Leave, stay or undecided?

  • Leave

    Votes: 83 42.3%
  • Stay

    Votes: 101 51.5%
  • Undecided

    Votes: 12 6.1%

  • Total voters
    196
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So if it hasn't been achieved already, whilst in. Why would it happen if we stay in?
Cut our losses and stop relying on others to secure our future!?
It hasn't happened (and won't change) while we stay in as the ECJ ruling is in place.

If we leave, it will go.

It's part of the City of London and probably accounts for between 30% and 50% of the jobs in the City and the taxes earned from the City. It's not a case of relying on others to secure our future. We have it. We leave, we don't have it. Instant reduction in employment levels and tax takings.
 
The referendum was promised to keep the Conservative party together ahead of the last general election. Essentially it was a play to avoid Eurosceptic MPs absconding to UKIP and splitting the Tory party vote. It had little to do with the reality of the rest of the world.
But they make promises they don't keep all the time (ie immigration numbers), we have been promised a referendum for years - so why did he do it now? If it is all such a terrible idea and the country is going to fall into such a terrible disaster zone, why did he do it?
 
But they make promises they don't keep all the time (ie immigration numbers), we have been promised a referendum for years - so why did he do it now? If it is all such a terrible idea and the country is going to fall into such a terrible disaster zone, why did he do it?
If you looked at the polling mid the last term, it all pointed to the UK voting for a hung parliament. It looked as though there would be no Conservative government but another collaboration. In the context of that, it was an empty promise and there would be no referendum. Instead, the Conservatives won, and had to follow through on this promise in order to maintain the whole of the Tory party voting with the government, given the small majority, rather than the Civil Ware of the last small majority during the Major era.. It wasn't a promise made to the people of the UK, it was a party politics play that massively backfired.
 
VOTE REMAIN

Apart from being the right thing to do for any number of reasons the ONLY way Brexit can win is if enough normally nice and sensible people side with the racists and fascists much as the average German person-in-the-street was persuaded to by Hitler prior to WW2. So be one of the nice guys and gals and reject repeating the mistakes of the past.
 
FCA Financial Conduct Authority
BoE Bank of England
ECB European Central Bank

Hi Tim thanks for giving us all an insight into your world, but correct me if I am wrong, but if we remain in surly the ECB will want to put more regulations in place, I know a lot of people who blame the bankers and basically everyone in the square mile for their woes, but it has to be a good thing if it is not stifled to death with more regulation, what happen back in 2008 most people could see coming, so I do sometimes think that everyone is to blame for the crash after all we all want the best so we all borrowed money to get it, but I suppose we all like to blame someone even if it was our own fault of being greedy.
 
VOTE REMAIN

Apart from being the right thing to do for any number of reasons the ONLY way Brexit can win is if enough normally nice and sensible people side with the racists and fascists much as the average German person-in-the-street was persuaded to by Hitler prior to WW2. So be one of the nice guys and gals and reject repeating the mistakes of the past.
An uncomfortable point that was made to Boris Johnson on LBC this morning. A caller asked Boris if he was comfortable having the UKIP and far right votes in his back pocket. Boris was extremely uncomfortable about this aspect of the vote and tried extremely hard to distance himself from it, refusing to talk about UKIP as they were unofficial. Then he banged on about taking control of immigration.
 
what happen back in 2008 most people could see coming
It's amazing what people could see coming with hindsight.

but correct me if I am wrong, but if we remain in surly the ECB will want to put more regulations in place,
There's not a huge amount wrong with regulation if it is done for the right reasons. It's only when it is done for poor reasons that there are issues. This bit has already been covered by upcoming investment regulation, so there is unlikely to be more.
 
Boris was extremely uncomfortable about this aspect of the vote and tried extremely hard to distance himself from it.

I bet he was!

To be honest I loathe most politicians but especially ones who purposefully spread (or allow the spread of) racism etc.

I can see there are arguments both ways on the economy although I worry that a BREXIT economy will be like us turning into an offshore Singapore or Dubai of Europe with all the social downsides that could bring for the NHS and welfare etc.

So when push comes to shove I ask myself "Do I really want to go down in history as a person who supported extremists?" and the answer has to be NO!

In many ways its the same as the majority of Muslims not supporting ISIS except of course 40%+ of Muslims aren't preparing to vote for ISIS on Thursday whereas 40%+ of mostly sensible people are apparently considering supporting similar extremists in the up and coming vote.

Madness.
 
VOTE REMAIN

Apart from being the right thing to do for any number of reasons the ONLY way Brexit can win is if enough normally nice and sensible people side with the racists and fascists much as the average German person-in-the-street was persuaded to by Hitler prior to WW2. So be one of the nice guys and gals and reject repeating the mistakes of the past.
That is outrageous - once again a remain supporter accusing everyone on the LEAVE side (ie half the country) of being racist, facist, not being nice guys and girls, etc - change the record and use a decent argument!
 
@tim2000s , if we remain in the EU, which is my hope, what is the next step for the NHS in your opinion......?
I wish I had a crystal ball! ;) If I'm honest, with either option, what we access and how services will be provided will change, predominantly down to funding. Any party that gets elected needs to accept the unpopular mandate that the change in age of the population and the change in the available treatments requires a different approach to be taken. As a country we spend not too far different amounts as a percentage of GDP to many other European countries, but nearly all of ours is paid for by the government. It would be nice to have an adult debate about this, but I fear it is a sacred cow that the electorate does not want to discuss.
 
VOTE REMAIN

Apart from being the right thing to do for any number of reasons the ONLY way Brexit can win is if enough normally nice and sensible people side with the racists and fascists much as the average German person-in-the-street was persuaded to by Hitler prior to WW2. So be one of the nice guys and gals and reject repeating the mistakes of the past.

I would normally agree with you on this, but they have lied to us so many times and I hope by now most of you will have realised my politics are left of center, but like it or not both sides are ramping up rhetoric so much and they are both grabbing the coat tails of any little thing which happens to make there side look better,

Of course I don't want to give up all the good things which have happen while we have been members of the EU and I am sure they are not going to disappear over night either.

But like I have said before past PMs have let us down, but this one wants us out but can't be seen as such and in my view that is not being honest for us or for the rest of the EU, it is like he is playing the kid in the play ground who stops everyone else playing the game and what to spoil it for everyone.
 
That is outrageous - once again a remain supporter accusing everyone on the LEAVE side (ie half the country) of being racist, facist, not being nice guys and girls, etc - change the subject and use a decent argument!

Please re-read my post again I did not accuse half the population of being racist. I stated a simple truth. To get a majority on Thursday BREXIT needs the extremist vote whereas REMAIN doesn't. If you want to associate with those kind of people that's your choice but don't deny it.
 
That is outrageous - once again a remain supporter accusing everyone on the LEAVE side (ie half the country) of being racist, facist, not being nice guys and girls, etc - change the record and use a decent argument!
Let me put it in a different way. Based on the polling so far, it would appear that without the extreme and unpleasant views of a proportion of the population, who are not voting leave for independence or democratic reasons, the vote would not be so close.

As a result, however you look at it, voting leave also supports the views of those with the extreme and unpleasant views, even if they aren't yours. I suspect that, for those people it also reinforces their thinking.
 
@tim2000s , if we remain in the EU, which is my hope, what is the next step for the NHS in your opinion......?

Sadly if that is the case, I think that some form of TIPP will be agreed with America and the NHS will be finished as I see it and we shall all be paying for our drugs like they do in America via a life insurance policy, But like I have said earlier the NHS has to change for the British people first and for most but do we all want to go down having to have a life insurance policy route?

It is my opinion that how we do this and come up with a reasonable solution is to open up another debate else where?
 
I would normally agree with you on this, but they have lied to us so many times

Yes I agree both sides have lied outrageously which is why in the end with no real evidence it has to be a moral judgement and the logical moral position is to accept that voting in collaboration with far right extremists is not right. Ever consider the third option of abstaining on Thursday?
 
Sadly if that is the case, I think that some form of TIPP will be agreed with America and the NHS will be finished as I see it and we shall all be paying for our drugs like they do in America via a life insurance policy, But like I have said earlier the NHS has to change for the British people first and for most but do we all want to go down having to have a life insurance policy route?

It is my opinion that how we do this and come up with a reasonable solution is to open up another debate else where?
To be honest, TTIP is very little different to the route the current Government wants to go down (and previous governments had already started). The only real difference is the companies that are doing the privatisation.
 
Please re-read my post again I did not accuse half the population of being racist. I stated a simple truth. To get a majority on Thursday BREXIT needs the extremist vote whereas REMAIN doesn't. If you want to associate with those kind of people that's your choice but don't deny it.
You accused half the population of either being a racist or being associated with racists. I am not denying there are racists in the UK that will vote LEAVE you cannot possibly say there are not some who will vote remain. There is not much I can do about that - and it certainly is my choice - I will not let the fact that there are unsavory people voting change the way I want to vote. Otherwise one would never vote at all for anything!
Abstaining is not the brave (or sensible) thing to do, whichever way you vote.
 
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Yes I agree both sides have lied outrageously which is why in the end with no real evidence it has to be a moral judgement and the logical moral position is to accept that voting in collaboration with far right extremists is not right. Ever consider the third option of abstaining on Thursday?

You know I am getting to the stage where I might just do so, on a Heritage Railway forum I am a member of most of the running has been done by the Brexit side of things, the last time I looked it was in favour of leaving the EU.

I have seen this quoted on the TV that the moderate left of center labour supporters feel like no one is bothering to reach out to them from the stay campaign, I have to say that Jeremy Corbyn does not float my boat at present, like Cameroon he too is a Brexiter but won't come out and say so for fear of doing any long term damage to the Labour Party, he must know what the feeling of long term grass route members must be.
 
You accused half the population of either being a racist or being associated with racists.

No I didn't. You seem very touchy on the subject of immigration. Do you start each sentence "I'm not racist but..."

I am not denying there are racists in the UK that will vote LEAVE you cannot possibly say there are not some who will vote remain.

That's very weak. I'd bet for every 999 racists who are going to vote leave there will be 1 remain racist so that's no argument at all.

There is not much I can do about that - and it certainly is my choice - I will not let the fact that there are unsavory people voting change the way I want to vote. Otherwise one would never vote at all for anything!

No but maybe it should be telling you that as a "nice" person you might be making a mistake?

Abstaining is not the brave (or sensible) thing to do, whichever way you vote.

Honest opinion I think most voters should abstain as they don't know enough to make this kind of decision or to paraphrase Winston Churchill "To find a fascist just ask a member of the public a question ..." If I want a house designed I go to an architect, if I break a leg I go see a doctor. I don't go and see someone who shoots, stabs and kicks a defenceless MP and shouts "Britain First" for advice over the future of my country.
 
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