Two weeks of low carb and ketons are still at 0.2

[Rabdos]

Two weeks of low carb and ketons are still at 0.2mmol/L. Am I doing something wrong or do I need to give it time to adjust?

I try to eat fat, but I am not obsessive with it. I probably don't eat 85% of calories from fat though. I eat meat and salad mainly.

Also, I eat some carbs, for example my favorite is squirty cream with hazelnut chops and sugar free chocolate drops. And I may eat some strawberries (about 100g) during the day.

Any idea?

 

[GrantGam]

Two weeks of low carb and ketons are still at 0.2mmol/L. Am I doing something wrong or do I need to give it time to adjust?

I try to eat fat, but I am not obsessive with it. I probably don't eat 85% of calories from fat though. I eat meat and salad mainly.

Also, I eat some carbs, for example my favorite is squirty cream with hazelnut chops and sugar free chocolate drops. And I may eat some strawberries (about 100g) during the day.

Any idea?

What's your carb intake like?

I know very little about dietary ketosis, nor do I want to be there - but I do a bit of 18/6 intermittent fasting (don't eat after 6pm and lunch at noon). I tested my ketones just before lunch yesterday and was 0.3. I'm eating around 150g per day just now, so not actually low carb.

Sorry I can't be of help but just sharing my experience I'll tag @robert72 who although T1, is in a regular state of ketosis and is extremely clued up on the subject.

 

[badcat]

Id check the squirty cream - ive only had it once but it tasted to me like it had a fair bit of sugar or some other sweetener in it

 

[Rabdos]

Id check the squirty cream - ive only had it once but it tasted to me like it had a fair bit of sugar or some other sweetener in it

It's 28% fat and 8% carbs and I eat about 100g per day.

I will now switch to another that is 44% fat and 2.6% carbs.

 

[DCUKMod]

I'd agree with @badcat that most squirty cream is sweetened. A while ago, another member found that the Anchor Extra Thick variant isn't sweetened.

http://www.sainsburys.co.uk/webapp/...anchor-squirty-cream-swirls--extra-thick-250g

@carbolysis - I haven't ever been too fussed about being in ketosis as long as my blood sugars are in a good place. Eating as you do, what sort results are you getting from your finger prick tests?

 

[CherryAA]

Two weeks of low carb and ketons are still at 0.2mmol/L. Am I doing something wrong or do I need to give it time to adjust?

I try to eat fat, but I am not obsessive with it. I probably don't eat 85% of calories from fat though. I eat meat and salad mainly.

Also, I eat some carbs, for example my favorite is squirty cream with hazelnut chops and sugar free chocolate drops. And I may eat some strawberries (about 100g) during the day.

Any idea?

I would not worry too much about this . If you really are low carb- ie under 30g ? I find it hard to get above 0.5 ketones no matter what. I've now been fasting for 2 days and its still only 0.3 .
This article is long but interesting and goes through a lot of data about ketones taken from a big sample of people . It also states that its hard to get close to the 1.5 mmol " ideal " for many many people .

https://optimisingnutrition.com/2015/07/20/the-glucose-ketone-relationship/

have a read

 

[diamondnostril]

Two weeks of low carb and ketons are still at 0.2mmol/L. Am I doing something wrong or do I need to give it time to adjust?

I try to eat fat, but I am not obsessive with it. I probably don't eat 85% of calories from fat though. I eat meat and salad mainly.

Also, I eat some carbs, for example my favorite is squirty cream with hazelnut chops and sugar free chocolate drops. And I may eat some strawberries (about 100g) during the day.

Any idea?

Hi @carbolysis . . .

I've not seen other Posts from you, so apologies in advance if my suggestion doesn't fit to your situation.

Ketosis relies on BOTH a low-carb intake and a no-more-than-moderate-protein intake. I was low-carb for years, and even no-carb for a while (eating meat only). But I just could not get my blood-sugar under control. Very frustrating.

It was only later that I appreciated the large role that protein plays. My high blood-sugar on a Tuesday was the result of the excess protein that I had eaten on the Monday. Aha!

So now I am able to keep myself in Ketosis by restricting both Carbs and Protein intake (less than 25g, and less than 45g respectively).

I mention this just because you said that you eat "meat and salad mainly". Perhaps protein intake (and the associated gluconeogenesis) prevents Ketosis.

Regards
Antony

(by the way, I still eat meat . . . but I no longer eat chicken or turkey or beef. I eat duck and pork-belly and fatty bacon; all have much higher fat/protein ratios.)

 

[bulkbiker]

I would ask the same question as @GrantGam if you are having 8g of carbs from squirty cream then you're pretty unlikely to be below the 20g of carbs per day that can "guarantee" ketosis (i.e. below the level which about 99% of people should go into ketosis). Are you counting the carbs in your salad for example. Maybe try a bit of fasting if you aren't feeling hungry.

 

[ringi]

One of the leading low carb experts claim that there is no more benefit from having a higher level of ketones provided you can detect them all the time. Having ketones proves the carbs/proteins are low enough to enable your body to burn fat and hence that your insulin resistance should reduce.

 

[Rabdos]

One of the leading low carb experts claim that there is no more benefit from having a higher level of ketones provided you can detect them all the time. Having ketones proves the carbs/proteins are low enough to enable your body to burn fat and hence that your insulin resistance should reduce.

Who is that, because I see graphs of optimal ketones being 1.5-3.5

 

[Rabdos]

Hi @carbolysis . . .

I've not seen other Posts from you, so apologies in advance if my suggestion doesn't fit to your situation.

Ketosis relies on BOTH a low-carb intake and a no-more-than-moderate-protein intake. I was low-carb for years, and even no-carb for a while (eating meat only). But I just could not get my blood-sugar under control. Very frustrating.

It was only later that I appreciated the large role that protein plays. My high blood-sugar on a Tuesday was the result of the excess protein that I had eaten on the Monday. Aha!

So now I am able to keep myself in Ketosis by restricting both Carbs and Protein intake (less than 25g, and less than 45g respectively).

I mention this just because you said that you eat "meat and salad mainly". Perhaps protein intake (and the associated gluconeogenesis) prevents Ketosis.

Regards
Antony

(by the way, I still eat meat . . . but I no longer eat chicken or turkey or beef. I eat duck and pork-belly and fatty bacon; all have much higher fat/protein ratios.)

If that's true, then LCHF diet is even more restricting.

I am not sure how to cope with this, it is really hard, infeasible, untasty, to eat more fat and less protein. I cannot eat half jar of mayo with a tiny piece of meat, it's not sustainable.

If I should do that for a limited period of time, it could work. But I cannot eat like that forever.

 

[Bluetit1802]

I've never been fussed about ketones. I have never once checked them and wouldn't know where to start. As long as my finger prick tests remain within the non-diabetic range I am happy.

What sort of levels do you see from your finger pricking?

 

[Rabdos]

I haven't tested glucose, I am interested in ketones. My goal is to achieve the appetite reduction from LCHF, as I struggle with food addiction (carbs mainly).

When should I expect that magical appetite reduction? And are ketone levels related?

 

[chalup]

I am in ketosis all the time and I have never eaten half a jar of mayo with a tiny piece of meat or anything remotely like that. Dietary ketosis starts at .5 measured with a blood ketone stick. A porkchop or chicken breast with steamed veggies tossed in melted butter and dill would be an example of a main meal for me. Bacon or sausage with a couple eggs is a good one as well. If you like it, avocado is tailor made for getting into ketosis. In the end I am more interested in keeping my glucose levels in the magic 4-7 range.

 

[ringi]

Who is that, because I see graphs of optimal ketones being 1.5-3.5

Sephen D Phinney who wrote the book "The Art and Science of Low Carbohydrate Living" and has set up a company (https://www.virtahealth.com/) that does doctor supported low carb, funded by the savings the USA health insurance companies make on drugs. This company is funded by a lot of the same venture capitalist as start-up like uber as there is so much money to be made if the drug costs can be reduced. They use a app to track all the data with real life support from doctors telling the clients when to reduce insulin etc.

There basic system is that a person has gone “low carb enough” when ketones can be just about detected. Remember this is about controlling BG not losing weight and a diet that people can keep to for the rest of their life, not getting the optimal short term weight lose. (Sorry I did not keep the link to the video where Sephen D Phinney explains his system.)

 

[diamondnostril]

If that's true, then LCHF diet is even more restricting.

I am not sure how to cope with this, it is really hard, infeasible, untasty, to eat more fat and less protein. I cannot eat half jar of mayo with a tiny piece of meat, it's not sustainable.

If I should do that for a limited period of time, it could work. But I cannot eat like that forever.

Hi . . .

If you simply find eating more fat "untasty" then I guess LCHF will always be tricky. But if you think that more fat and less protein is difficult in practical terms, then maybe a previous post gives you some ideas?

http://www.diabetes.co.uk/forum/threads/is-eating-once-a-day-sustainable-on-lchf.75723/#post-833985

Hope it helps
Antony

 

[Rabdos]

My goal is appetite suppression and weight loss, it seems most LCHF target to blood glucose levels, is there any info on weight loss?

What are the optimum ketones and when should I expect appetite suppression? So far I have huge appetite, after 2.5 weeks.

 

[ringi]

My goal is appetite suppression and weight loss, it seems most LCHF target to blood glucose levels, is there any info on weight loss?

101 books on amazon search for something like "low carb".

 

[Rabdos]

101 books on amazon search for something like "low carb".

You suggest to buy and read 101 books and try to find the info I want, that maybe none of these books have it?

 

[Bluetit1802]

If I were you I would put ketones right out of your mind.

Just exactly how low carb are you? How many grams do you eat a day on average? Do you count them? Can you tell us, for example, what you ate yesterday and today? Maybe we can spot something to help.