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Couple of questions

UserABC2021

UserABC2021

Well-Known Member
Messages
1,990
Type of diabetes
Prefer not to say
Treatment type
Tablets (oral)
Hi,

Questions, I have some. I accept no-one can give me medical advice, so I'm not asking for it unless you're no-one in which case, crack on. ;)

#1 Blood sugar levels. I perused the forum and noted that the ranges for T2 are either 4-6 or 5-7, yet I also read that, for some, 6 is too high. The window of T2 normality seems awfully small.

I don't really want to be too close to the hypo range as I drive for a living, but I do want to be below the 'pre-diabetic' mark. I was thinking to settle for 5-7 but I'm so new to this I could just be missing something.

What are your targets or thoughts?

#2 I mentioned elsewhere that I have been very naughty and not taken my Glic' for a few days. I hadn't taken it more than a few days anyway, but after reading everything here and hitting the LCHF diet, I felt I'd rather do without something that will affect my career if I can solve the problem another way.

I have to see my team next week so any ideas on how I can explain my irrational behaviour, and was I wrong (I know)?

I'd considered just saying "Hey, I'm an aspie too and we do strange stuff sometimes" :angelic:

#3 Not noticing any weight loss, in fact the scales say I'm 2kg heavier. I have to admit that being diagnosed was like "OMG NO!!!":bigtears:, but then it was "and you'll lose a ton of weight":woot:.

This bit I probably got wrong. Insulin resistance, can this be the cause and how do I break it?

That's it for now, thanks.

(sorry about the smilies, I'm ok answering but anxious asking)

Oh, I created a spreadsheet to help me keep track of everything, I add it here to give an idea of my averages per day/week

chart.JPG
 
As you drive for a living, being able to do without medication and rely on diet seems like a really good idea to me - just from the point of view of not even risking hypos and all that could come along with them.
I just eat low carb foods and I regularly see under 6mmol/l after eating - but I am not risking hypos as my liver happily supplies any glucose it thinks I require and so I do not drop low.
If your team can argue with the numbers you've been getting - I'd love to be able to hear how.
 
Hi Harrison,
Your numbers have improved hugely and I think you probably have a good case for not bothering with the Gliclazide, here’s the levels this website recommends
https://www.diabetes.co.uk/diabetes_care/blood-sugar-level-ranges.html
As for what your medics say, I wouldn’t worry, it’s your body, they can’t force you to take anything and your levels have improved without the Gliclazide. You have worries about going hypo and although I’m not on it I believe Gliclazide has that risk, whereas Metformin generally doesn’t.
Personally my favourite numbers are 5s, I do get the occasional 6 but I’m ten months down the line, you’re very early on in your journey.
I’m at a loss as to why you haven’t lost weight, except that you might be over doing the fat bit? I’m not sure!

EDIT I love your signature box BTW!
 
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Are those your fasting BG's? If so, you have done remarkably well to get them down in such a short time. :)

Are you testing before and after meals? These are the more important levels, which you would be advised to concentrate on as a priority over the fasting BG. Are those targets you mention just for fasting levels, or for across the board levels (fasting, bedtime, before and after meals). It is not a good idea to compare yourself with others. We are all at different stages, some T1s and some T2s, with different pancreatic function, different medications, different ages, and different lifestyles. You need to set your own targets, and when you reach them regularly, narrow the band width! Personally I aim for 4 to 7 at all times, but being human, I don't always manage it.

If you continue not to take the Gliclazide, you are unlikely to hypo. Not impossible, but unlikely. With Gliclazide, then yes, you could hypo very easily. As you drive for a living, if you can gain and maintain good control without Glic, then that is what I personally would do, but you do need to confess this to your nurse.
 
HarrisonK said:
Hi,

Questions, I have some. I accept no-one can give me medical advice, so I'm not asking for it unless you're no-one in which case, crack on. ;)

#1 Blood sugar levels. I perused the forum and noted that the ranges for T2 are either 4-6 or 5-7, yet I also read that, for some, 6 is too high. The window of T2 normality seems awfully small.

I don't really want to be too close to the hypo range as I drive for a living, but I do want to be below the 'pre-diabetic' mark. I was thinking to settle for 5-7 but I'm so new to this I could just be missing something.

What are your targets or thoughts?

#2 I mentioned elsewhere that I have been very naughty and not taken my Glic' for a few days. I hadn't taken it more than a few days anyway, but after reading everything here and hitting the LCHF diet, I felt I'd rather do without something that will affect my career if I can solve the problem another way.

I have to see my team next week so any ideas on how I can explain my irrational behaviour, and was I wrong (I know)?

I'd considered just saying "Hey, I'm an aspie too and we do strange stuff sometimes" :angelic:

#3 Not noticing any weight loss, in fact the scales say I'm 2kg heavier. I have to admit that being diagnosed was like "OMG NO!!!":bigtears:, but then it was "and you'll lose a ton of weight":woot:.

This bit I probably got wrong. Insulin resistance, can this be the cause and how do I break it?

That's it for now, thanks.

(sorry about the smilies, I'm ok answering but anxious asking)

Oh, I created a spreadsheet to help me keep track of everything, I add it here to give an idea of my averages per day/week

View attachment 25776
Click to expand...
Hi not sure if I have any answers to your questions, I’m diet controlled so no experience of meds, therefore not sure if not taking them is right or wrong, sorry. Not sure about the blood glucose levels, I think it’s mostly down to what you personally want to see within the ranges, I average 5.5 which puts my levels in the normal range, however my last blood test put my 3mth average in the pre diabetic range, however I’m happy with averages of 5.5 and will be happy if they stay there or drop a bit lower.
With regards to the weight loss it may take a couple of weeks for your body to adjust to lower carbs, sometimes when we reduce the amount of carbs our body naturally stores them, something to do our body going into survival mode, it basically doesn’t want us to starve, this means we don’t loose weight. Also do you know how many grams of carbs you are eating each day? You may be eating too many. Occasionally after eating low carb for a while some people need to increase the amount for a very short period of time then reduce back again, this kick starts the fat burning. I don’t think this is necessarily where you are as your spreadsheet is only showing 2 weeks so it may just be that you need to wait a little while longer. Hope some of this has been helpful, as I say I’m not an expert, just speaking from my own experience.
Don’t give up, you will get the results you want and need. Best wishes Jayne
 
Bluetit1802 said:
Are those your fasting BG's? If so, you have done remarkably well to get them down in such a short time. :).
Click to expand...

I took it that each number is an average of Harrison’s daily readings but he omits to say how many a day he tests.
 
Wow, a lot to process, thank you all for your input.

Bluetit1802 said:
I took it to mean FBG only.
@HarrisonK please can you tell us?
Click to expand...

The spreadsheet figures are the average for the day. I take my bloods as follows - On wakeup, then before each meal (3 times), then 2 hours later (3 times) and finally before bed. Total of 8 samples per day.

jayney27 said:
I average 5.5 which puts my levels in the normal range, however my last blood test put my 3mth average in the pre diabetic range, however I’m happy with averages of 5.5 and will be happy if they stay there or drop a bit lower.
With regards to the weight loss it may take a couple of weeks for your body to adjust to lower carbs, sometimes when we reduce the amount of carbs our body naturally stores them, something to do our body going into survival mode, it basically doesn’t want us to starve, this means we don’t loose weight.
Click to expand...

Thank you for that, hadn't considered my body going into starvation mode so I shall relax a bit.

jayney27 said:
Also do you know how many grams of carbs you are eating each day?
Click to expand...

Trying to stay below 20g per meal as I read somewhere that <20g was a good target.

Bluetit1802 said:
You need to set your own targets, and when you reach them regularly, narrow the band width! Personally I aim for 4 to 7 at all times, but being human, I don't always manage it.

If you continue not to take the Gliclazide, you are unlikely to hypo. Not impossible, but unlikely. With Gliclazide, then yes, you could hypo very easily. As you drive for a living, if you can gain and maintain good control without Glic, then that is what I personally would do, but you do need to confess this to your nurse.
Click to expand...

Thank you, the Aspie part of me needs a target so I will take everything into account. I shall definitly tell the nurse as I don't want them to notify the DVLA that I am on Glic'. Non hypo is important.

Rachox said:
Your numbers have improved hugely and I think you probably have a good case for not bothering with the Gliclazide, here’s the levels this website recommends
https://www.diabetes.co.uk/diabetes_care/blood-sugar-level-ranges.html
As for what your medics say, I wouldn’t worry, it’s your body, they can’t force you to take anything and your levels have improved without the Gliclazide. You have worries about going hypo and although I’m not on it I believe Gliclazide has that risk, whereas Metformin generally doesn’t.
Personally my favourite numbers are 5s, I do get the occasional 6 but I’m ten months down the line, you’re very early on in your journey.
I’m at a loss as to why you haven’t lost weight, except that you might be over doing the fat bit? I’m not sure!
Click to expand...

Thanks for the link, appreciated. 5-6 is getting my attention but I will have to work harder to keep in that band. I think I might need a carb spreadsheet :)

It's been two whole weeks... still can't see my feet :(

Resurgam said:
I just eat low carb foods and I regularly see under 6mmol/l after eating - but I am not risking hypos as my liver happily supplies any glucose it thinks I require and so I do not drop low.
If your team can argue with the numbers you've been getting - I'd love to be able to hear how.
Click to expand...

I'm finding the LCHF easy as it appeals to me, I've had a couple in the 5 range before eating, but not after. I'll let you know if they kick off.

Thanks again to everyone, if I missed something you have my apologies, I will re-read everything a few times anyway :)
 
Hi there @HarrisonK - I like targets and goals. They motivate me, so I get that bit very well. One thing I will say though is that targets and goals can change, and often do change over time.

Your 20gr carb per meal is absolutely fine, if those numbers are your averages, although you might want to have a look at your after meal number. I'm not suggesting they're too high for an instant, as I have no idea or way of knowing, just suggesting averages are just that.

You seem to be doing really well in a short time.
 
rab5 said:
I am using the LCHF diet and I read it as 20g carbs per day NOT per meal.

I could be wrong
Click to expand...
20g carbs per meal might be ok. It’s an individual thing. I have a total of up to 60g per day. I just distribute them differently as I know I can tolerate more in the evening than earlier in the day, so I go something like 10g for breakfast, 15 for lunch, 20 for dinner leaving 10ish for snacks if needed.
 
@HarrisonK
With a BMI of 36 and weight of 105kg you must be packing away over 13,000 kj of food every day.

This bit I probably got wrong. Insulin resistance, can this be the cause and how do I break it?
Click to expand...

I wouldn't think so unless something strange is going on. It turns out rather simple really. Your body needs a certain amount of fuel each day to function. If you put more in than you use it will be stored in your tissues as fat. Each kg of fat contains around 36000 kj of energy. There are numerous resources on the web that will allow you to calculate your daily energy requirements. If you shave 2000 kj from that, you will lose approximately 1kg every 18 days. Basically, if you eat just less than your daily requirements the remainder will be taken from your stored fat reserves.

You desperately need to trim down but I guess you already know that. Losing 15 to 20 kg will take about a year of vigilance and discipline. When diagnosed, I was 106 kg with a BMI of 30. I've lost 16kg now and believe me, it makes a savage difference. Controlling BG now is so much easier.

Good luck and I hope you can manage to shed some kilo's.
Glenn
 
HarrisonK said:
Hi,

Questions, I have some. I accept no-one can give me medical advice, so I'm not asking for it unless you're no-one in which case, crack on. ;)

#1 Blood sugar levels. I perused the forum and noted that the ranges for T2 are either 4-6 or 5-7

I don't really want to be too close to the hypo range as I drive for a living, but I do want to be below the 'pre-diabetic' mark.

#2 I mentioned elsewhere that I have been very naughty and not taken my Glic' for a few days.

#3 Not noticing any weight loss, in fact the scales say I'm 2kg heavier. I have to admit that being diagnosed was like "OMG NO!!!":bigtears:, but then it was "and you'll lose a ton of weight":woot:.
Click to expand...

#1 There are two margins for real non-diabetes:
1. Fasting, before meal and 2h after meal: 3.9-5.6
2. Time area of two hours after meal - spike must not go over 7.7

See http://www.phlaunt.com/diabetes/16422495.php for more info.
According to that I have my personal targets as non-diabetes. So three numbers: 3.9-5.6 fasting, before meal and 2h after meal.
Max 7.7 1h after meal.

#2 Remove Glic’. It forces your pancreas to work more to produce more insulin - you will burn it out. Just my suggestion. As mentioned - without Glic’ in T2d you cannot go hypo - but as allways - use your GlucoMeter to check frequently for some time to be sure.

#3 There is the shock for your body with removing of carbs - it takes some time for body to custom to that LCHF diet. You should add excercise to your daily tasks - quick walk preferentially - 10 000 steps a day.
 
rab5 said:
I am using the LCHF diet and I read it as 20g carbs per day NOT per meal.

I could be wrong
Click to expand...

I'm not sure either, will have to look it up again. 20g per day is pretty strict.

DCUKMod said:
Your 20gr carb per meal is absolutely fine, if those numbers are your averages, although you might want to have a look at your after meal number.
Click to expand...

Some examples pre 6.7 post 6.4 (bacon & eggs), pre 6.0 post 5.5 (salmon & leeks). Older results where I wasn't as careful - pre 10.6 post 9.8, pre 11.2 post 13.8

Rachox said:
I have a total of up to 60g per day. I just distribute them differently as I know I can tolerate more in the evening than earlier in the day, so I go something like 10g for breakfast, 15 for lunch, 20 for dinner leaving 10ish for snacks if needed.
Click to expand...

Agreed, I'm going through Diet Doctor looking for interesting food.

Crocodile said:
With a BMI of 36 and weight of 105kg you must be packing away over 13,000 kj of food every day.
Click to expand...

I probably was eating around that much. The last year I've been off the road and stuck in an office where sweets, cakes and pastries are the norm. Plus not cooking at all and relying on the local food outlets.

Crocodile said:
You desperately need to trim down but I guess you already know that. Losing 15 to 20 kg will take about a year of vigilance and discipline. When diagnosed, I was 106 kg with a BMI of 30. I've lost 16kg now and believe me, it makes a savage difference. Controlling BG now is so much easier.
Click to expand...

Agreed, my ideal weight is around 13st but I'd be happy at 14. Increasing exercise is my hurdle as I have COPD and emphysema, swimming may be my best option.

rom35 said:
#1 There are two margins for real non-diabetes:
1. Fasting, before meal and 2h after meal: 3.9-5.6
2. Time area of two hours after meal - spike must not go over 7.7

See http://www.phlaunt.com/diabetes/16422495.php for more info.
According to that I have my personal targets as non-diabetes. So three numbers: 3.9-5.6 fasting, before meal and 2h after meal.
Max 7.7 1h after meal.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the link, my after meal spikes are below 7.7 but I'm still new so I need more data and more effort.

rom35 said:
#2 Remove Glic’. It forces your pancreas to work more to produce more insulin - you will burn it out. Just my suggestion. As mentioned - without Glic’ in T2d you cannot go hypo - but as allways - use your GlucoMeter to check frequently for some time to be sure
Click to expand...

That's what I'm hoping for although I'm aware I need to find a way to burn calories without exacerbating other stuff.

rom35 said:
#3 There is the shock for your body with removing of carbs - it takes some time for body to custom to that LCHF diet. You should add excercise to your daily tasks - quick walk preferentially - 10 000 steps a day.
Click to expand...

Yes, patience isn't one of my virtues, but there is sufficient information the 'phase 2' myself.

Thank you all :)
 
Try as long as possible to stay under 5.7 - the body starts to work as expected - healing all the diabetes problems (legs, eyes, kidney, cholesterol, blood pressure). Thus my target is only three meals a day - I don't want to be over 5,6 for a long time.
Excellent informative books are:
You have to combine it with your experience - see the glucometer. He is our best friend, even he drinks our blood for whole day!

Good luck!
 
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rom35 said:
Try as long as possible to stay under 5.7 - the body starts to work as expected - healing all the diabetes problems (legs, eyes, kidney, cholesterol, blood pressure). Thus my target is only three meals a day - I don't want to be over 5,6 for a long time.
Excellent informative books are:

Good luck!
Click to expand...

I made the mistaken assumption that hovering in the 6's was fine. I see that it's not and is still 'pre-diabetes'. The other day at work I felt woozy and tested my blood, came out at 5.1 and I panicked and took some glucose. I can see that I just need to get re-adjusted to a normal level.
 
@HarrisonK The weight loss should help with COPD too. You probably know that. Losing 16kg stopped the pain in my right knee as well. BP came down to normal as well.
Glenn
 
I have been following the Diet Doctor site which states the following:

Our definition
Here’s the way we define different levels of low carb at Diet Doctor:

  • Ketogenic low carb <20 gram carbs per day. This is a ketogenic diet (if protein intake is moderate). This level is defined as below 4 energy percent carbs in our recipes, where we also keep the protein level low or moderate (excess protein is converted to carbohydrates in the body).
    The limit of four energy percent means that you’ll stay below a maximum 20 grams of carbs on a 2,000-calorie diet, even if you only choose our very most carb-rich keto recipes.

    In most cases you’ll end up with far fewer carbs than that, as some of the keto recipes you use are likely to have significantly less than the maximum amount of carbs.

    Our keto recipes are also limited in protein. Our rule is that for keto recipes with 4 energy percent carbs we accept a maximum of 25 energy percent protein. For lower carb levels we accept slightly more protein:
    • 3 percent carbs = max 27 protein
    • 2 percent carbs = max 29 protein
    • 1 percent carbs = max 31 protein
    • 0 percent carbs = max 33 protein

    If there’s too much protein in a recipe to classify it as keto low carb, we instead classify it as moderate low carb.

    " style="box-sizing: border-box; font-size: 1rem; line-height: 1rem; position: relative; top: 0px; display: inline; font-weight: bold;">1 Previously we often called this “strict low carb”, but as the word “keto” or “ketogenic” became commonly used we switched to only use this term, for simplicity.
  • Moderate low carb 20-50 grams per day. This level is defined as between 4-10 E% carbs in our recipes
  • Liberal low carb 50-100 grams per day. This means 10-20 E% carbs in our recipes

Have a look here I have found this site very helpful, also there are great videos to watch . https://www.dietdoctor.com/
 
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