Why Eat Carbs As A Type 2 Diabetic?

[lucylocket61]

Now perhaps you could explain your comment that 48-50 yr olds get diabetes. Is this agae group universal or only people whos parents or relatives had diabetes.

This is what I posted,: Interestingly i too come from a family with a strong type 2 occurrence. And those who get it, are around 48-50 years old when it happens. Every time. Even the thin ones.
Note the words 'I come from' and that, in the context of my reply, it is clear that I am talking about my family, our experience, and that, of the members of my family who become type 2, every time it happens they have reached between 48-50 years old.

 

[lucylocket61]

But you have been carb free as I stated before, and you have been succesful if I read your posts right.

you did not read my posts correctly. I have never, nor have I said that I have been carb free. In fact, given my mentions of huge bowls of salads, which include carbs, I am at a loss as to understand why you think I am or have ever been carb free?

As my signature shows, I eat around 80g of carbs a day.

 

[rab5]

This is what I posted,: Interestingly i too come from a family with a strong type 2 occurrence. And those who get it, are around 48-50 years old when it happens. Every time. Even the thin ones.
Note the words 'I come from' and that, in the context of my reply, it is clear that I am talking about my family, our experience, and that, of the members of my family who become type 2, every time it happens they have reached between 48-50 years old.

With respect that’s anecdotal.

 

[lucylocket61]

Of course its anecdotal. Everything is anecdotal. The post my reply was in response to was anecdotal. Thats why the jury is out on what causes type 2.

 

[rab5]

I would add that since IR is becoming a huge problem more family members will have t2d.

 

[Lamont D]

I'm coming in here to answer @rab5 question literally.

The reason why carbs are advised to be eaten by T2s is because, usually unless you're in ketosis and you get your energy from ketones, you need carbs to give you the glucose sufficient to provide the energy for your brain to work as a normal healthy person would need. The belief that carbs are necessary for your nutritional needs in vitamins and minerals. Also fibre. So a healthy balanced diet of carbs, (preferably low GI or complex), protein and healthy fats! In other words the eat well plate!
This does work for those who can tolerate that amount of carbs.
The problem starts when tolerance levels to certain foods exacerbate your blood glucose levels. A steady diet of too many carbs will of course, be unhealthy for you.
It is this tolerance of food that you are trying to discover to lower your carbs intake sufficiently to improve your hba1c levels.
For T2s, the level of tolerance, for example potatoes is important because some can and some have to avoid them completely.
That depends on your first insulin response, your insulin resistance, your circulating insulin levels.
This is why the medical profession promotes carbs. Because of the glucose levels derived from carbs.

This forum advocates a reduction in carbs, higher levels of natural fats and proteins to find the right balance for you.
This can only be done by monitoring blood glucose levels.

My last point is sustainability of being in ketosis for a long time.
As I did when I lost a lot of weight and my health dramatically improved, my endocrinologist tried to encourage me to raise my blood glucose levels above normal levels. So I would get the health benefits of not being in ketosis. But I'm weird, and would not work.
Being in ketosis now for four years, and my body likes where it is, I am intolerant to carbs, so I avoid them. I have that option.

I also do intermittent fasting, eat small meals and have not eaten a potato for about seven years, because they are so bad for me. But my wife will still eat one jacket potato and it doesn't spike her!

I know my body because of my experience with testing and my food diary, I eat to my meter, my wife can and does eat carbs, because she can. I cannot and would not advise anyone to go into ketosis unless it is apparent that they need to because of the condition they have been diagnosed or the symptoms they are showing.

Best wishes.

 

[rab5]

Of course its anecdotal. Everything is anecdotal. The post my reply was to was anecdotal. Thats why the jury is out on what causes type 2.

How is everything anecdotal? What about scientific discoveries??

Science in general is the complete opposite

 

[lucylocket61]

How is everything anecdotal? What about scientific discoveries??

Science in general is the complete opposite

I am not going to pursue this discussion. Everything to do with the cause of type 2 diabetes is at the anecdotal stage as nothing has yet been proved as to the cause, in some people, of their not being able to process a certain threshold of carbs.

 

[Mr_Pot]

As i have stated before in various posts I am willing to be wrong.

Well here is an example of where you are wrong...

I think the cause of diabetes is known.

The cause is not known. A while ago I was a volunteer on large program to collect data about type 2 diabetes in order to help universities and other research organisations in their quest to find the causes of diabetes. It would seem that they are all wasting their time when all they had to do was ask you.

 

[rab5]

Well here is an example of where you are wrong...

The cause is not known. A while ago I was a volunteer on large program to collect data about type 2 diabetes in order to help universities and other research organisations in their quest to find the causes of diabetes. It would seem that they are all wasting their time when all they had to do was ask you.

Give them my details I would be happy to inform them

 

[FantomPoet]

There is an argument for both sides. Carbs certainly appear to be the cause of IR in some people. It however seems be tolerated by some (the level of Carb intake) T2 appears to be a condition of IR where the particular person has reached a tipping point. What that tipping point is is again arguable whether it is fat in the Pancreas (as is current thinking) or a polyp on a toe, it has yet to be determined.

Those over the tipping point (me) head for the LCHF route as it seems to keep things in relative check, fasting also appears to help in the short term (Haven't been doing it long).

For me excercise also seems to help. I'll keep doing these things until someone tells me not to (backed by evidence) or a cure is found. It's a lifestyle choice.

 

[rab5]

I'm coming in here to answer @rab5 question literally.

The reason why carbs are advised to be eaten by T2s is because, usually unless you're in ketosis and you get your energy from ketones, you need carbs to give you the glucose sufficient to provide the energy for your brain to work as a normal healthy person would need. The belief that carbs are necessary for your nutritional needs in vitamins and minerals. Also fibre. So a healthy balanced diet of carbs, (preferably low GI or complex), protein and healthy fats! In other words the eat well plate!
This does work for those who can tolerate that amount of carbs.
The problem starts when tolerance levels to certain foods exacerbate your blood glucose levels. A steady diet of too many carbs will of course, be unhealthy for you.
It is this tolerance of food that you are trying to discover to lower your carbs intake sufficiently to improve your hba1c levels.
For T2s, the level of tolerance, for example potatoes is important because some can and some have to avoid them completely.
That depends on your first insulin response, your insulin resistance, your circulating insulin levels.
This is why the medical profession promotes carbs. Because of the glucose levels derived from carbs.

This forum advocates a reduction in carbs, higher levels of natural fats and proteins to find the right balance for you.
This can only be done by monitoring blood glucose levels.

My last point is sustainability of being in ketosis for a long time.
As I did when I lost a lot of weight and my health dramatically improved, my endocrinologist tried to encourage me to raise my blood glucose levels above normal levels. So I would get the health benefits of not being in ketosis. But I'm weird, and would not work.
Being in ketosis now for four years, and my body likes where it is, I am intolerant to carbs, so I avoid them. I have that option.

I also do intermittent fasting, eat small meals and have not eaten a potato for about seven years, because they are so bad for me. But my wife will still eat one jacket potato and it doesn't spike her!

I know my body because of my experience with testing and my food diary, I eat to my meter, my wife can and does eat carbs, because she can. I cannot and would not advise anyone to go into ketosis unless it is apparent that they need to because of the condition they have been diagnosed or the symptoms they are showing.

Best wishes.

Thanks for that reply. Forgive me if I have read you wrong. Are you saying you need glucose for your brain to work.

 

[PenguinMum]

There is an argument for both sides. Carbs certainly appear to be the cause of IR in some people. It however seems be tolerated by some (the level of Carb intake) T2 appears to be a condition of IR where the particular person has reached a tipping point. What that tipping point is is again arguable whether it is fat in the Pancreas (as is current thinking) or a polyp on a toe, it has yet to be determined.

Those over the tipping point (me) head for the LCHF route as it seems to keep things in relative check, fasting also appears to help in the short term (Haven't been doing it long).

For me excercise also seems to help. I'll keep doing these things until someone tells me not to (backed by evidence) or a cure is found. It's a lifestyle choice.

I think I know what you mean in your last sentence. But you wouldnt believe how many people have told me that Diabetes is a lifestyle choice. Its not one I chose.

 

[Lamont D]

Oops!
One of the main causes of T2 is too much circulating insulin.
There is a circle of high background insulin, high circulating insulin, insulin resistance and high blood glucose levels.
This hyperinsulinaemia is because of the refined carbs and overeating, too much sugar, too much fruit, too much food in general. In your words the western diets.
It is not obesity that causes T2, because having the imbalance of too much insulin can happen many years before prediabetes and then diabetes. And more importantly before obesity.
There are many different ways of getting types of T2 and endocrine conditions that are related by diversity of conditions such as environment and availability, poverty or gluttony. Genetic, medications, from another condition and so on.

These endocrine conditions are so individual, a one size fits all is not gonna work.

 

[rab5]

I think I know what you mean in your last sentence. But you wouldnt believe how many people have told me that Diabetes is a lifestyle choice. Its not one I chose.

I don’t think it’s a choice I think we have been literally poisoned by Ancel Keys and Co

 

[lucylocket61]

Carbs certainly appear to be the cause of IR in some people.

We do not know why carbs trigger insulin resistance in some people, but not in others. Carbs are not the cause, they are a substance/food which triggers a faulty response in someone. Just as lactose intolerance is triggered by milk products in someone with a faulty response, but is harmless to others without that response.

We all have our carb threshold, which we find by testing. The threshold is personal. Those without type 2 do not have this safe threshold limit put on them.

 

[Lamont D]

Thanks for that reply. Forgive me if I have read you wrong. Are you saying you need glucose for your brain to work.

Yes!
For your brain to function, your body needs to provide a level of glucose to perform.
But as always, how much is enough?

When in ketosis, the glucose necessary comes from your body rather than carbs.

 

[FantomPoet]

I think I know what you mean in your last sentence. But you wouldnt believe how many people have told me that Diabetes is a lifestyle choice. Its not one I chose.

I think I know what you mean in your last sentence. But you wouldnt believe how many people have told me that Diabetes is a lifestyle choice. Its not one I chose.

I will keep doing these things.

1. LCHF
2. Fasting.
3. Excercise

As a lifestyle choice....You're right Diabetes is not a choice.

I am not asking you to follow down the same route

Now please pick something out of context from the above to argue with.

 

[rab5]

I have NOT been zero carbing, I have been trying out different time periods of fasting. One of those days involved me not having my usual slice of bread. i have not commented on my carb intake on any of my fasting experiments this past week,

If you have been fasting you have been zero carbing?

 

[Bluetit1802]

Oops!
One of the main causes of T2 is too much circulating insulin.
There is a circle of high background insulin, high circulating insulin, insulin resistance and high blood glucose levels.
This hyperinsulinaemia is because of the refined carbs and overeating, too much sugar, too much fruit, too much food in general. In your words the western diets.
It is not obesity that causes T2, because having the imbalance of too much insulin can happen many years before prediabetes and then diabetes. And more importantly before obesity.
There are many different ways of getting types of T2 and endocrine conditions that are related by diversity of conditions such as environment and availability, poverty or gluttony. Genetic, medications, from another condition and so on.

These endocrine conditions are so individual, a one size fits all is not gonna work.

Well said.

I would also point out that hyperinsulinaemia can also be a condition in its own right.

With T2 it seems to be a chicken and egg situation. Researchers have not yet come up with a definitive cause, and in a lot of cases, medications are to blame, plus wonky hormones that aren't able to do their jobs properly. Stress plays a huge part because of the hormonal response to it. The list goes on.