You can eat your normal diet

[JohnEGreen]

Having said that I believe everyone has to select his path based on objectives and it should have some short of balance between intakes as well as burning out the excess. Rather than relying on only single channel method.

I agree, unfortunately some like myself do not have the option of burning it off by exercise.

 

[kokhongw]

If you are a type 2 diabetic, you can eat your normal daily diet, which you are accustomed. It is not necessary to eat LCHF diet. However, you should control the portion size of your diet to less than 120 carbs per day, and take insulin/medicines of required dosage. This is my personal opinion only. I am 80 years old. I am having type 2 diabetes from 30 years. I eat cooked rice-vegetable diet every day limiting it to 120 carbs per day. I take 30/70 premixed insulin 40 units before breakfast, and 20 units before dinner. My bg levels are under control, except for occasional hypers, and hypos. I do not have any diabetic complications till now. I would like to invite the opinion/comments of the other members on this.

It is great that you have managed to remain complications free after 30yrs of T2D diagnosis. Unfortuanately few have been as successful or fortunate. Many have to deal with multiple complications in spite of their best efforts and struggled to find the balance.

Your suggested level of carbs restriction is right along the upper limit and a sensible starting point of what is generally considered to be low carb. Because if you have 3 meals of 40g carbs per day. That is just about what a T2D is able to manage without too much glucose spikes. So individuals should reduce and "personalize" their carbs intake to match their excessive insulin/glucose response.

Dietary carbohydrate restriction as the first approach in diabetes management: Critical review and evidence base
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0899900714003323

 

[JohnyT2]

I agree, unfortunately some like myself do not have the option of burning it off by exercise.

I understand there could be limitation to exercise for many, still try to keep yourself active in what ever way one can without aggravating existing limitations and give reasons for body to consume what ever possible excess glucose.

 

[Listlad]

Objectives to achieve defines the paths to be selected.
On this forum we have seen that to manage DT2 there have been various paths that people have selected and many have been successful in meeting there objectives.

In your case you are satisfied with medication with normal diet so if that keeps you happy thats fine, but not for many who want to go back to medication free, self controlled life.

As we know two important component to control the excess of Glucose in body is, either to two cut down the intakes or if your body is capable of burning out the Glucose then workout to burn it out.
Later being slightly high hill task with not practical for many, in such cases Low Carb atleast opens up the path on intakes channel to meet the objectives. Hence there are plenty of success stories of meeting objectives on LCHF diets and thus people recommending here.

Having said that I believe everyone has to select his path based on objectives and it should have some short of balance between intakes as well as burning out the excess. Rather than relying on only single channel method.

Agreed. Some sort of balance in this case roughly translates to the word optimum.

 

[Listlad]

I agree, unfortunately some like myself do not have the option of burning it off by exercise.

Some of us have narrower “windows” to work within than others.

 

[achyut1939]

It is great that you have managed to remain complications free after 30yrs of T2D diagnosis. Unfortuanately few have been as successful or fortunate. Many have to deal with multiple complications in spite of their best efforts and struggled to find the balance.

Your suggested level of carbs restriction is right along the upper limit and a sensible starting point of what is generally considered to be low carb. Because if you have 3 meals of 40g carbs per day. That is just about what a T2D is able to manage without too much glucose spikes. So individuals should reduce and "personalize" their carbs intake to match their excessive insulin/glucose response.

Dietary carbohydrate restriction as the first approach in diabetes management: Critical review and evidence base
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0899900714003323
View attachment 35267

How is it that many are getting complications inspite of control of diet, and taking insulin/medicines. Their bg values must have been very high for long periods of time due to not controlling their diabetes properly.

 

[Guzzler]

broccolli,califlower,spinach etc...

So... a vegetarian/vegan diet?

 

[JohnEGreen]

How is it that many are getting complications inspite of control of diet, and taking insulin/ medicines. Their bg values must have been very high for long periods of time due to not controlling their diabetes properly.

Or as in many cases were diabetic for long periods before diagnosis for instance I already had neuropathy, retinopathy and some kidney dysfunction when diagnosed Gaining control of blood sugars got rid of the retinopathy Metformin plus strict restrictions in carbs and calories was the path I chose but that was my personal choice and others are free to do what they feel is best for them myasthenia gravis severely limits exercise and does not give way to will power or determination, medication keeps me mobile to a degree most of the time. Sometimes it is necessary to accept ones limitations and try to work within them.

 

[Mr_Pot]

My diet is already amazing and I feel like a super hero. If it aint broke...

You would have to modify your diet if you were in an Indian state where there was no beef.

 

[bulkbiker]

You would have to modify your diet if you were in an Indian state where there was no beef.

Would that be the same India that has the highest incidence of T2 globally?

Association of course...

 

[kokhongw]

How is it that many are getting complications inspite of control of diet, and taking insulin/medicines. Their bg values must have been very high for long periods of time due to not controlling their diabetes properly.

I don't know about others, but I have watched how my father struggled over the last 10-15 years of his life to managed his glucose levels on a low fat, whole grains type diet. Steam fish, lean meat, brown rice, brown rice noodles, lots of veg and "healthy" fruits, milo without sugar...regular hour-long walks in the morning and evening...still ended up with failed kidney, 2nd heart bypass, multiple stents (6 in total), multiple vascular surgeries (3) to save his gangrenous toes. Toe amputations one by one...kidney failure... edema, memory loss etc. Car accident due to hypoglycemia because he likely mis-dosed himself... all the while his HbA1c was around 8% which his doctors assure us is perfectly fine for his age...70+.

What I have gathered from that experience is that many will be falsely assured by the medical community that we have been doing our best. Glucose fluctuation is normal. Chronically high glucose level is acceptable. Diabetes is chronic and progressive. Diabetic complications is inevitable. It is dependent on the luck of the draw. Some have better genetics than others. So just accept it.

But the reality is surprisingly different. Our T2D journey need not be so fraught with challenges when we begin to realize that chronic excessive insulin AND glucose are both damaging. Medication free and Insulin sparing lifestyle is achievable and sustainable.

 

[Mr_Pot]

Would that be the same India that has the highest incidence of T2 globally?

Association of course...

All l am saying is that some people's circumstances are different and being smug about your own situation doesn't help them.

 

[kokhongw]

How is it that many are getting complications inspite of control of diet, and taking insulin/medicines. Their bg values must have been very high for long periods of time due to not controlling their diabetes properly.

One would have expected that insulin used would have given us better glucose control... but based on this study data of 18,000+ patients, insulin is not necessarily the answer...the mean HbA1c is 8.7% +/- 1.8%
https://www.practicaldiabetes.com/a...ntegrated-diabetes-service-vs-uk-wide-cohort/

A cross-sectional evaluation of individual patient data from six randomly-selected primary care practices in Erewash (Integrated) Diabetes Service was compared with The Health Improvement Network (THIN) UK primary care database.

Baseline age (61.5 years vs 65.8 years; p<0.0001) and duration of insulin use (4.3 vs 6.3 years; p<0.0001) use were lower in the THIN cohort. Mean HbA1c was similar between the two cohorts but weight, blood pressure, total and LDL cholesterol were significantly lower in the Erewash population compared with THIN. The combined achievement of HbA1c, total cholesterol and blood pressure was 17.5% in the Erewash cohort compared with 9.6% in the THIN cohort (p<0.0001). There was a higher proportion of insulin users on basal-bolus than on premix in the Erewash cohort (89.3% vs 10.7%) compared with THIN (59.0% vs 41.1%). The proportion of patients who received concurrent oral glucose-lowering therapies in the Erewash integrated service was lower, except for SGLT2 inhibitors (2.5% in the Erewash cohort vs 0.5% in THIN; p<0.0001).

 

[achyut1939]

Would that be the same India that has the highest incidence of T2 globally?

Association of course...

I don't know about others, but I have watched how my father struggled over the last 10-15 years of his life to managed his glucose levels on a low fat, whole grains type diet. Steam fish, lean meat, brown rice, brown rice noodles, lots of veg and "healthy" fruits, milo without sugar...regular hour-long walks in the morning and evening...still ended up with failed kidney, 2nd heart bypass, multiple stents (6 in total), multiple vascular surgeries (3) to save his gangrenous toes. Toe amputations one by one...kidney failure... edema, memory loss etc. Car accident due to hypoglycemia because he likely mis-dosed himself... all the while his HbA1c was around 8% which his doctors assure us is perfectly fine for his age...70+.

What I have gathered from that experience is that many will be falsely assured by the medical community that we have been doing our best. Glucose fluctuation is normal. Chronically high glucose level is acceptable. Diabetes is chronic and progressive. Diabetic complications is inevitable. It is dependent on the luck of the draw. Some have better genetics than others. So just accept it.

But the reality is surprisingly different. Our T2D journey need not be so fraught with challenges when we begin to realize that chronic excessive insulin AND glucose are both damaging. Medication free and Insulin sparing lifestyle is achievable and sustainable.

What were his bg levels like, when he was suffering from the complications?

 

[kokhongw]

What were his bg levels like, when he was suffering from the complications?

His BG range from typically 8 - 13 mmol/L

 

[millenium]

I don't know about others, but I have watched how my father struggled over the last 10-15 years of his life to managed his glucose levels on a low fat, whole grains type diet. Steam fish, lean meat, brown rice, brown rice noodles, lots of veg and "healthy" fruits, milo without sugar...regular hour-long walks in the morning and evening...still ended up with failed kidney, 2nd heart bypass, multiple stents (6 in total), multiple vascular surgeries (3) to save his gangrenous toes. Toe amputations one by one...kidney failure... edema, memory loss etc. Car accident due to hypoglycemia because he likely mis-dosed himself... all the while his HbA1c was around 8% which his doctors assure us is perfectly fine for his age...70+.

What I have gathered from that experience is that many will be falsely assured by the medical community that we have been doing our best. Glucose fluctuation is normal. Chronically high glucose level is acceptable. Diabetes is chronic and progressive. Diabetic complications is inevitable. It is dependent on the luck of the draw. Some have better genetics than others. So just accept it.

But the reality is surprisingly different. Our T2D journey need not be so fraught with challenges when we begin to realize that chronic excessive insulin AND glucose are both damaging. Medication free and Insulin sparing lifestyle is achievable and sustainable.

Not limiting carb is a serious handicap in diabetic management.

 

[millenium]

One would have expected that insulin used would have given us better glucose control... but based on this study data of 18,000+ patients, insulin is not necessarily the answer...the mean HbA1c is 8.7% +/- 1.8%
https://www.practicaldiabetes.com/a...ntegrated-diabetes-service-vs-uk-wide-cohort/



View attachment 35274

I would think using exogenous insulin to control will never be precised enough. Our body natural control is very precise and sensitive.

 

[millenium]

I would imagine there is another variable and that is activity levels.

Not able to be physically active after meals is another handicap because the pancreas will have to work much harder to lower the bg.

 

[Tophat1900]

How is it that many are getting complications inspite of control of diet, and taking insulin/medicines. Their bg values must have been very high for long periods of time due to not controlling their diabetes properly.

If they are following the high carb diet advice handed out to people who are basically carb intolerant and they already have a high insulin level and are injecting insulin on top of that... then the reason is most likely insulin resistance.

 

[achyut1939]

His BG range from typically 8 - 13 mmol/L

It is reported that the fbg should be 4 mmol/L to 6 mmol /L, and ppbg 8 mmol/L to 10 mmol/L, for proper diabetes control.