• Guest - w'd love to know what you think about the forum! Take the 2025 Survey »

Type 2 Fats and blood glucose, any help ?

finsit

finsit

Well-Known Member
Messages
331
Location
UK
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Treatment type
Diet only
Hi there, need some references or someone who did research on how saturated fats may affect one's blood glucose. I realised, with high saturated fat food particularly full cream (that has less protein component to it) will make my BG unstable for long and will affect my fasting BG as well. It will not send it to sky high, but it will have more affect than if i had eaten a little carb without fat. I have read somewhere that G6PD deficient person may have some issue in metabolising saturated fats, and particularly that i seem to be a lean mass hyper responder (LMHR). So in my first 3 month experiments, my all markers were fine except extremely elevated LDL (9.5 mmol). I have G6PD enzyme deficiency as well. Any insights?

My big issue is that i am at my ideal weight, have no insulin resistance (did HOMA-IR). That means i can eat fat without increasing my fats/weight but i am unable to eat them because of very high LDL as well as their affect on my BG. Any insights, or references or personal experience to help me out on this please?
 
finsit said:
I realised, with high saturated fat food particularly full cream (that has less protein component to it) will make my BG unstable for long and will affect my fasting BG as well.
Click to expand...
where did you get this information? Fats like butter, olive oil etc are a mainstay of my regime to keep my blood sugar levels low.
 
lucylocket61 said:
where did you get this information? Fats like butter, olive oil etc are a mainstay of my regime to keep my blood sugar levels low.
Click to expand...
Its my personal experience and it may be partly due to G6PD deficiency which i am looking answers for ...
Olive oils, other fats like nuts, butter etc seems fine. Its the clotted cream, double cream and cheese cream. Even the Cheddar is all right. I speculated that it may have to do with their macros fats/protein imbalance?
 
finsit said:
Its my personal experience and it may be partly due to G6PD deficiency which i am looking answers for ...
Olive oils, other fats like nuts, butter etc seems fine. Its the clotted cream, double cream and cheese cream. Even the Cheddar is all right. I speculated that it may have to do with their macros fats/protein imbalance?
Click to expand...

How much cream are you ingesting when you get this problem and on its own or with something else?
Can't see anything written about G6PD deficiency and dietary fats... just fava beans...
 
finsit said:
Its my personal experience and it may be partly due to G6PD deficiency which i am looking answers for ...
Olive oils, other fats like nuts, butter etc seems fine. Its the clotted cream, double cream and cheese cream. Even the Cheddar is all right. I speculated that it may have to do with their macros fats/protein imbalance?
Click to expand...
do you have G6PD deficiency - an inherited condition? If not, what is the problem for you and all the others who do not have this condition?
 
finsit said:
Its my personal experience and it may be partly due to G6PD deficiency which i am looking answers for ...
Olive oils, other fats like nuts, butter etc seems fine. Its the clotted cream, double cream and cheese cream. Even the Cheddar is all right. I speculated that it may have to do with their macros fats/protein imbalance?
Click to expand...
If G6PD matches here - how do you think it is linked to metabolism of double cream? ... the main treatment looks to be trying to avoid oxidative stressors
 
I have only a BSc but I can't see why saturated fat would have the slightest influence on an ordinary diabetic's blood glucose levels.
When eating fat again after abandoning a low fat diet, my LDL went down, so if you have other issues it really is a subject for someone knowledgeable about them, not diabetics.
 
Thanks everyone, i am trying to figure this out and i think it has more to do with calorie connection than the carb, but i need to see some papers to see how excess calories affect metabolism.
 
finsit said:
This is an interesting read on the topic, I am trying to digest it

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4951141/
Click to expand...
Epidemiological studies do not prove anything, they are designed to find relationships between variables. In human studies, they generally use food questionnaires for establishing what the macros were, and these are notoriously inaccurate and unreliable. If you read the paper carefully you will see words like estimate and observed effects, which means it is not measured in any scientific way. For that reason, I suspect most of the studies they looked at were done in the lab with genetically modified rats and severe overfeeding with food they would not normally even consider eating, so are being force-fed like the geese in Fois Gras pate. Note also that the authors did not perform any science themselves., they just applied statistics to other people's work that used disparate methods to get data, so are not necessarily examining the same things.
 
Hi @finsit. I began trying to get my head around Type 2 without insulin resistance, you being a TOFI? I take it?

I read about G6pd deficiency in the link above, grossed out discovering fava beans are what I grew up with and hated - broad beans, but felt you not being able to eat those is no great loss!

I kept wondering where the connection with dietary fat was, then trying to figure out what kind of type two you might be - I relooked at your signature and see you resolved your blood glucose regulation issues with lowering the carbs pronto smart! And have a very healthy HBA1c of 33, that would be the envy of many an individual, let alone a (former?) type 2 diabetic. It only took you three months to go from an HBA1c of 78 to 34 - which is awesome.

So my guess is the IR test was not done when you had the HBA1c of 78, but when you had lowered the carbs? Or?

And, your issue is with your high cholesterol, and isn't actually about fats affect on your BG levels? (Which would make more sense to me - because fats are usually, hugely, a diabetic's friend in that they usually, hugely don't affect your BG levels when you eat them...) I hope I have understood you correctly - and forgive me if you really are eating dietary fats and getting high BG readings. If the latter is so - food journaling and sharing with us would go a really long way to understanding it, as someone with such potential to have blood glucose dysregulation, as you do, to prevent it happening again now that you have it so beautifully under control. (And looking like you are well on the way to 'type two - resolved! given enough time.)

As for the cholesterol issue - I strongly suggest you read up on everything about cholesterol and cardio vascular disease - there's plenty on this site to begin with.

And as for dietary fats (and protein) relationship with getting type two - my understanding of the biology of it is it is in relation to how much carbohydrate you are consuming - the Krebs cycle if you want to look it up online. And you know the story by now? - we can't live let alone well without fats and protein, but too many carbs and the new factory-made vegetable fats in abundance as they are can upset the whole BG/Krebs apple cart. My understanding once you know you are excess-carb intolerant (my simple way of looking at type two) - eating healthy dietary fats is your friend, for maintaining the best health you can have. Not your foe.
 
AloeSvea said:
Hi @finsit. I began trying to get my head around Type 2 without insulin resistance, you being a TOFI? I take it?

I read about G6pd deficiency in the link above, grossed out discovering fava beans are what I grew up with and hated - broad beans, but felt you not being able to eat those is no great loss!

I kept wondering where the connection with dietary fat was, then trying to figure out what kind of type two you might be - I relooked at your signature and see you resolved your blood glucose regulation issues with lowering the carbs pronto smart! And have a very healthy HBA1c of 33, that would be the envy of many an individual, let alone a (former?) type 2 diabetic. It only took you three months to go from an HBA1c of 78 to 34 - which is awesome.

So my guess is the IR test was not done when you had the HBA1c of 78, but when you had lowered the carbs? Or?

And, your issue is with your high cholesterol, and isn't actually about fats affect on your BG levels? (Which would make more sense to me - because fats are usually, hugely, a diabetic's friend in that they usually, hugely don't affect your BG levels when you eat them...) I hope I have understood you correctly - and forgive me if you really are eating dietary fats and getting high BG readings. If the latter is so - food journaling and sharing with us would go a really long way to understanding it, as someone with such potential to have blood glucose dysregulation, as you do, to prevent it happening again now that you have it so beautifully under control. (And looking like you are well on the way to 'type two - resolved! given enough time.)

As for the cholesterol issue - I strongly suggest you read up on everything about cholesterol and cardio vascular disease - there's plenty on this site to begin with.

And as for dietary fats (and protein) relationship with getting type two - my understanding of the biology of it is it is in relation to how much carbohydrate you are consuming - the Krebs cycle if you want to look it up online. And you know the story by now? - we can't live let alone well without fats and protein, but too many carbs and the new factory-made vegetable fats in abundance as they are can upset the whole BG/Krebs apple cart. My understanding once you know you are excess-carb intolerant (my simple way of looking at type two) - eating healthy dietary fats is your friend, for maintaining the best health you can have. Not your foe.
Click to expand...

Hi @AloeSvea that was very kind of you to spend some time on writing this note. To answer your question, yes i had high visceral fats (though not TOFO) and i can see that in my old pictures and realise it now better than ever. And yes, my fasting insulin came at 3 after i regulated my a1c and BG and shed off my waist fats. I am 100% positive i am not insulin resistant now. Agreed that fats are my best friends and i was so happy on my high fat diet until the LDL went up to 9.5 which is alarming high even though with Dave Feldman and LMHR types it may be okay while keeping my HDL/TG ratio healthy. I am part of LMHR Facebook group as well and studied extensively what could cause high LDL on low-carb in some people but no one is 100% certain at this time. Dave is just starting a new scientific research finally on his theory but it must take few years before the results are in i suppose.

Now regarding fats and BG connection, yes fats are not a big concern for a spike, just a little concern to keep my BGs a bit elevated for long which i owe to calories and not the fats itself. Secondly, I realised that cream cheese, and cream fat which has very low protein maybe causing as that is the only fat change i had after going low carb. I was a regular meat and egg eater before that change. Reading extensively, as a G6PD deficient, it seems i have something that would not hinder my cholesterol absorption resulting in high LDL. A G6PD are also known to have issues with carbohydrate regulation too. I am not sure my high a1c was partly due to G6PD (because of the fact that it came low very fast and been stable on low-carb). Unfortunately, i don't have any data to understand what was my fasting BGs before diagnosis.

Now, for example if i eat high protein dinner my fasting BGs are in mid 5's. If i eat fish or salad or low protein meal they are much lower. I am still trying to understand what's going on inside me. Had my LDL not gone high, i was happy with my clotted cream and berries and other full fat dairy liquid creams. Now i have substituted it with low fat and soy/almond milk for my drinks. I still use full fat yogurt/cheese because of the protein components in it. I still believe that saturated fats are not unhealthy if they come with the protein.

Even small amount of carbs in the veggies can affect my BGs and the days i eat less vegetables (1 portion instead of 2), my BGs are really great. So i am trying to balance my diet coping with my sweet tooth :)
 
Hi again @finsit. Your issue added to my knowledge base - so no worries there :).

And any and every reason to re-acquaint myself with the fatty acid cycle (aka Krebs) is all good. (The main takeaway I offer from that is - even a cursory look makes one aware of how very complex a blood glucose regulation system IS. And no wonder when it all goes awry, there are all sorts of interesting mechanisms going on inside of us.)

I myself do not use the word "calories" when thinking through the effect of food on anyone, but especially on an excess-carb intolerant/insulin resistant person especially (or in your case - IR-prone in an excess-carb environment) but with all living creatures who need to eat to live - I use the words "energy from food", which helps keep it in perspective, imho. I believe calorie consciousness has done a huge disservice to lots of folk, although I wasn't personally caught up with the diet culture - many folks are/were/have been. And I am of the "a calorie is not just a calorie" contingent (but rather - different macros are utilised by the body in different ways, so energy from food is dealt with differently and is not "just" a calorie).

I am hoping you are, if you haven't already, really getting into the subject of cholesterol, and the evidence, for and against, and non-existent, of its relationship with cardio vascular disease. Because it is this subject, from what I can see, is at the base of your present health worries - not directly blood glucose dysregulation. And I absolutely understand that - as high BG is most dangerous to us regarding its effect on our heart function, and for someone like me as a SIRD - kidney function.

Anyway. I hope you get to the most recent CVD important information, as far as I can see, that it is currently thought to be about LDL size, and not the level ie whether you have small hard particles, or large "fluffy" LDL particles. And from memory - getting tested for this and an imaging of how your arteries are looking at the moment being far more helpful for you in terms of reckoning on your future CV health. As opposed to reading your total cholesterol level.

Oh yes - and the triglyciride/HDL ratio - one that I personally track closely to try and guage my CV health. There is lots on this site about these issues. I hope you have fun/interest in following up on it? Which I hope you are doing...
 
lucylocket61 said:
where did you get this information? Fats like butter, olive oil etc are a mainstay of my regime to keep my blood sugar levels low.
Click to expand...

Yes, that was my first thought, but it seems that Finsit has some particular issues that changes the significance of fats on his BG?
 
I can confirm lowering saturated fats definitely lowered my fasting BG significantly....
 
finsit said:
I can confirm lowering saturated fats definitely lowered my fasting BG significantly....
Click to expand...
So what did your cut out of your diet?

Are you aware that our bodies actually store lipids in the liver as saturated fat, and we create what SFA we need by cut and strap of medium-chain fats into saturated? SFA is the most energy dense form to store fat in the adipose tissue. Even vegans create SFA from mono-unsat fats and also from self generated lipids made from carbohydrates by neo lipogenesis,
 
Oldvatr said:
So what did your cut out of your diet?

Are you aware that our bodies actually store lipids in the liver as saturated fat, and we create what SFA we need by cut and strap of medium-chain fats into saturated? SFA is the most energy dense form to store fat in the adipose tissue. Even vegans create SFA from mono-unsat fats and also from self generated lipids made from carbohydrates by neo lipogenesis,
Click to expand...
Hi thank, mainly liquid dairy (double cream). Also clotted cream, cream cheese etc. I didn't cut back on mature yellow cheeses or any other cheese that has high protein content in it. I definitely reduced portion size and reduced vegetable intake as well. I feel much lighter and fasting are consistently below 5 mmol.
 
Back
Top