Freestyle Libre 2 - constant false signal loss alarms

[EllieM]

I was using the Dexcom G6, but that is now only supported in my area (Shropshire) for insulin pump users, so I was put onto L2 because it has alarms.
It also has a lot of quality of life issues compared with Dexcom, too.

I'm not saying the Dexcom was perfect, but it kept a good connection between sensor & phone. Unless I wandered away from my phone...

Any chance your area would fund a dexcom ONE for you? Seems to have most of the G6 features....

 

[Alastair Gordon]

It is a fairly basic interface certainly, but highly configurable - just what you’d expect from a techy with no ‘user’ validation of the useability.

However, alarms are configureable for BG level, sound, length of alarm ring, and finally at what time to nudge you again if still out of range.

In the most polite way, can I suggest you spend a bit of time digging in the app, reading the ‘help’ and online docs although I would agree they are not wholy user friendly.

Happy exploring - it will be worth it!

Sorry barrym, I thought you were talking about the Libre 2 app. Okay, I will reinstall Juggluco and dig further as you suggest, and see if Juggluco can maintain Bluetooth connectivity and issue high and low alarms, unlike the worthless Libre 2 from Abbott. Thanks again, and back at ya soon!

 

[MrsA2]

I'm no techie, but I thought libre uses nfc, not Bluetooth. I keep Bluetooth turned off on my samsung

 

[Alastair Gordon]

NFC (Near Field Communication) is the channel when you scan your phone very close to the sensor (within 4 cm) and get your latest blood glucose reading. Bluetooth is used to connect your Libre 2 sensor to your smartphone (within several meters) so that the LibreLink app in your smartphone can provide alerts whenever your blood glucose goes too high or too low.

Hi/Lo alarm monitoring occurs with no intervention on your part, and can, for example, wake you from sleep if your blood glucose plunges, or alert an arborist when he is 20 ft up a tree with a chainsaw that his blood glucose is plummeting. Unfortunately, Libre 2 is a very poorly designed product, and the Bluetooth communication fails constantly ("Signal Loss Alarm"), a potentially lethal product deficiency under many circumstances. Abbott seem quite disinterested in correcting this lethal design flaw, despite postings from thousands of users on diabetes forums around the world.

If you are using a Libre 2 sensor, and have turned off Bluetooth on your smartphone, then you are missing the only unique benefit offered by Libre 2, namely continuous hi/lo monitoring. But since this essential feature does not work most of the time, its utility is zero or worse, as a user may not manually check regularly, confident that he will be alerted if his blood glucose is dropping.

 

[MrsA2]

Ah. I'm a t2 so turned the alarms off as it won't let me set them low enough. Sorry your having all this trouble

 

[miahara]

I have a Libre2 and only use the reader which works perfectly well and alerts me of highs and lows and the bluetooth works at quite a considerable distance.

 

[Deadeye_Pete]

Any chance your area would fund a dexcom ONE for you? Seems to have most of the G6 features....

Unfortunately not. The CCG is quite, er, targeted in its approach to who is commissioned for what service. Add to this their glacial approach to change and I don't see much changing in the near future. Wont stop me trying though.

 

[PJ37]

I had these problems with alarms not working & signal loss errors when I first started FL a year ago - using a Samsung A32. I spent ages on the phone with Abbotts software people - even placing my phone in developer mode to try some changes. Then, after a few months, a Samsung update came along it was OK. 2 days ago a new Samsung update - and I am back to square one. Abbotts say that they are aware of the problem and are looking for a solution (probably not to hard from previous experience!). Their solution for now is to send one of their readers - so I will the have the inconvenience of carrying a phone and a reader. Plus, it will arrive in their usual "5-7 days after dispatch" - which given Christmas and ParcelForce's service, probably means 10+ days - which is absolute rubbish for a key medical device. A 24 hour courier service with someone like Evri would be virtually the same cost.

I am really not impressed by FL2 - through various issues, I seem to get 50% free replacement sensors compared to the number I get on prescription. The NHS must be wasting lots of money with these cowboys.

 

[BadaBing]

I had these problems with alarms not working & signal loss errors when I first started FL a year ago - using a Samsung A32. I spent ages on the phone with Abbotts software people - even placing my phone in developer mode to try some changes. Then, after a few months, a Samsung update came along it was OK. 2 days ago a new Samsung update - and I am back to square one. Abbotts say that they are aware of the problem and are looking for a solution (probably not to hard from previous experience!). Their solution for now is to send one of their readers - so I will the have the inconvenience of carrying a phone and a reader. Plus, it will arrive in their usual "5-7 days after dispatch" - which given Christmas and ParcelForce's service, probably means 10+ days - which is absolute rubbish for a key medical device. A 24 hour courier service with someone like Evri would be virtually the same cost.

I am really not impressed by FL2 - through various issues, I seem to get 50% free replacement sensors compared to the number I get on prescription. The NHS must be wasting lots of money with these cowboys.

The issues appear to have been caused by a combination of Abbott updating its Librelink app - twice - in November and December 2022, some smartphone manufacturers updating the Android operating system from 12 to 13 and Apple updating its iPhone operating system, also in October/November/December 2022.

The issues don't appear to be affecting all brands and models of Android or Apple smartphones. Nevertheless, it is affecting many people if the various forums are to be believed.

I spoke to someone in Abbott Customer Services a few days ago and they didn't know when the issues might be fixed.

Abbott, the smartphone manufacturers and Google and Apple need to communicate and work with each other far more cooperatively when medical device apps and operating systems are being updated on their platforms.

What I find particularly concerning is that I haven't seen or read anything, anywhere to suggest the NHS is doing anything to encourage Abbott to fix these issues as soon as possible.

I have just read elsewhere someone recount that their Librelink alarms weren't working on their mobile phone, and the next thing they knew paramedics were visiting them to treat severe hypoglycaemia!

Does anyone know if the NHS - Abbott's largest UK customer - is doing anything?

 

[Alastair Gordon]

The issues appear to have been caused by a combination of Abbott updating its Librelink app - twice - in November and December 2022, some smartphone manufacturers updating the Android operating system from 12 to 13 and Apple updating its iPhone operating system, also in October/November/December 2022.

The issues don't appear to be affecting all brands and models of Android or Apple smartphones. Nevertheless, it is affecting many people if the various forums are to be believed.

I spoke to someone in Abbott Customer Services a few days ago and they didn't know when the issues might be fixed.

Abbott, the smartphone manufacturers and Google and Apple need to communicate and work with each other far more cooperatively when medical device apps and operating systems are being updated on their platforms.

What I find particularly concerning is that I haven't seen or read anything, anywhere to suggest the NHS is doing anything to encourage Abbott to fix these issues as soon as possible.

I have just read elsewhere someone recount that their alarms weren't working, and the next thing they knew paramedics were visiting them to treat severe hypoglycaemia!

Does anyone know if the NHS - Abbott's largest UK customer - is doing anything?

Thank you, Badabing, that was very informative. My interaction with Abbott technical support for ALL my failing Libre 2 sensors (on a Samsung S21 Android phone) has been nothing but a repetitive series of lies followed by squirming and claiming the lie really didn't happen. "No, no, what I really meant was...". I am in contact with a regulatory authority that approved the Libre 2, and have passed on the URLs of various forums showing clearly the widespread life-threatening failures of this medical device. Fortunately my phone also recorded the conversations. I now believe the failure is in the LibreLink app, not the sensors, as all sensors are failing. Also the failures happen on all phone brands. It appears that the failures started around the time of the latest update to the LibreLink app, but I cannot vouch whether or not there were other concurrent events that may also be to blame. The real issue is that Abbott has given us every reason not to trust them. This is a very dangerous medical device, unworthy of regulatory approval.

 

[BadaBing]

Thank you, Badabing, that was very informative. My interaction with Abbott technical support for ALL my failing Libre 2 sensors (on a Samsung S21 Android phone) has been nothing but a repetitive series of lies followed by squirming and claiming the lie really didn't happen. "No, no, what I really meant was...". I am in contact with a regulatory authority that approved the Libre 2, and have passed on the URLs of various forums showing clearly the widespread life-threatening failures of this medical device. Fortunately my phone also recorded the conversations. I now believe the failure is in the LibreLink app, not the sensors, as all sensors are failing. Also the failures happen on all phone brands. It appears that the failures started around the time of the latest update to the LibreLink app, but I cannot vouch whether or not there were other concurrent events that may also be to blame. The real issue is that Abbott has given us every reason not to trust them. This is a very dangerous medical device, unworthy of regulatory approval.

Don't be too hard on the customer services/technical support staff you have spoken to Alastair. Anyone who has worked in the corporate world knows that these staff will have been given a script - probably after consultation with the legal department- which they are required to stick to very closely until the issues are resolved.

I have had a high number of Libre 2 sensors fail since I've been using them compared to Libre 1. However, the latest issues with the Librelink app on some phones not giving high or low alarms, having frequent scan errors and/or frequent false scan error notifications do appear to coincide with updates to both Android OS and iPhone OS, as well as updates to Librelink.

I am frustrated by what has happened, but I do still believe in the Freestyle Libre system. Abbott just need to work with Google, Apple and the phone manufacturers and sort the issues out. As soon as possible. Preferably with encouragement from the NHS in the UK.

And make sure what has happened doesn't happen again.

My understanding is that is why software is usually alpha and beta tested by willing volunteers before it is rolled out to the public at large.

I understand you are based outside the UK. Canada? Are many other people in your country experiencing similar issues to the ones some of us are having in the UK?

I know next-to-nothing about the healthcare system in Canada, although I think Canada has a universal healthcare system which is insurance-based, so there isn't a national health service like there is in the UK (though even the UK healthcare system is now fragmented following devolution).

 

[Alastair Gordon]

Don't be too hard on the customer services/technical support staff you have spoken to Alastair. Anyone who has worked in the corporate world knows that these staff will have been given a script - probably after consultation with the legal department- which they are required to stick to very closely until the issues are resolved.

I have had a high number of Libre 2 sensors fail since I've been using them compared to Libre 1. However, the latest issues with the Librelink app on some phones not giving high or low alarms, having frequent scan errors and/or frequent false scan error notifications do appear to coincide with updates to both Android OS and iPhone OS, as well as updates to Librelink.

I am frustrated by what has happened, but I do still believe in the Freestyle Libre system. Abbott just need to work with Google, Apple and the phone manufacturers and sort the issues out. As soon as possible. Preferably with encouragement from the NHS in the UK.

And make sure what has happened doesn't happen again.

My understanding is that is why software is usually alpha and beta tested by willing volunteers before it is rolled out to the public at large.

I understand you are based outside the UK. Canada? Are many other people in your country experiencing similar issues to the ones some of us are having in the UK?

I know next-to-nothing about the healthcare system in Canada, although I think Canada has a universal healthcare system which is insurance-based, so there isn't a national health service like there is in the UK (though even the UK healthcare system is now fragmented following devolution).

Thanks again for your thoughtful response, BadaBing. I am in Canada, by the way. Most Canadians pay out of pocket for these defective and dangerous medical products.

I have no desire to blame the front line tech support people, but they are the face of Abbott and they have been programmed to lie, to make promises that are never fulfilled, and to transfer you to higher support levels where the same lies and broken promises continue.

I'm sure you are right that the problem MAY be how the LibreLink app interacts with the Android or iOS operating system. But is still means that Abbott is selling a defective medical device and appear unwilling to be honest with their customers or with the regulatory authority who claim to have no notices from Abbott. I have decades of experience in the software field, including mobile apps and real time monitoring within the IoT. I would be happy to help with the process, and act as a beta tester of patched versions of LibreLink. But their lies have backed them into a corner where the problem may not be fixed for a long time.

Again, I appreciate hearing from you and understanding your take on this disgraceful situation.

Merry Christmas if we don't talk again!

 

[MIKEno13]

I have been having frequent issues with loss of contact between my Samsung S21 phone and the Libre 2 sensors this year. Abbott have generally replaced the sensor this being their solution to the problem.
Today, with the same issue again over the recent holiday, I spoke to another service agent - Yusef - (apologies for the likely mis-spelling) who was clearly far more experienced in the field of software. The crux of the problem - according to him - is that Bluetooth is only able to communicate between the phone and one single Bluetooth enabled device at any one time. This means that when I get into my car the hands free system locates my phone and switches it away from the sensor. This disconnection can only be definitively re-made by switching off the phone Bluetooth and then the phone. Away from the car or any other Bluetooth enabled device re-start the phone and Bluetooth. The connection will be completed and alarms will function. This is a Bluetooth limitation. It is clearly known to Abbott and I am sure to the NHS.
I expressed my displeasure with the functioning of the system and said that my confidence in the system was diminishing. I was told that the issue was known and that in the initial training in use of the L2 sensor I should have been informed of it.
For me this is unacceptable. Having working alarms available when driving is a health and safety issue.
I shall take it up with my healthcare professionals after the holiday.

 

[BadaBing]

I have been having frequent issues with loss of contact between my Samsung S21 phone and the Libre 2 sensors this year. Abbott have generally replaced the sensor this being their solution to the problem.
Today, with the same issue again over the recent holiday, I spoke to another service agent - Yusef - (apologies for the likely mis-spelling) who was clearly far more experienced in the field of software. The crux of the problem - according to him - is that Bluetooth is only able to communicate between the phone and one single Bluetooth enabled device at any one time. This means that when I get into my car the hands free system locates my phone and switches it away from the sensor. This disconnection can only be definitively re-made by switching off the phone Bluetooth and then the phone. Away from the car or any other Bluetooth enabled device re-start the phone and Bluetooth. The connection will be completed and alarms will function. This is a Bluetooth limitation. It is clearly known to Abbott and I am sure to the NHS.
I expressed my displeasure with the functioning of the system and said that my confidence in the system was diminishing. I was told that the issue was known and that in the initial training in use of the L2 sensor I should have been informed of it.
For me this is unacceptable. Having working alarms available when driving is a health and safety issue.
I shall take it up with my healthcare professionals after the holiday.

@MikeEno 13. Yes, I have had similar explanations given to me by Abbott Customer Service staff since their Freestyle Librelink app was updated twice in Google Play store.

An internet search will tell you that "bluetooth low energy" (which is the technology that cgms use to communicate with Librelink on a mobile) ought to be able to handle up to eight (8) separate devices transmitting and receiving at a time.

Following my discussions with Abbott customer services I have unpaired every other bluetooth enabled device from my mobile phone.

And I still cannot get Librelink to receive and give me low or high glucose alarms on my phone permanently without having to do lots of additional weird and wacky things (switching bluetooth off and on every so often; switching my phone on and off every so often; deleting the cache from Freestyle Librelink; force stopping Freestyle Librelink; uninstalling and reinstalling Librelink).

Nothing resolves the problem permanently.

I know some Android phones recently received an operating system upgrade from Android 12 to Android 13. It has been reported as long ago as August 2022 that Freestyle Librelink was not fully compatible with Android 13. So you may want to check if your phone is now using the Android 13 operating system.

Unfortunately once the operating system has been upgraded on a Samsung mobile phone I understand that it cannot officially be downgraded to the previous Android OS.

My understanding is that it is up to the software developer (Abbott in this case) to ensure that its software (Librelink) is fully compatible with whatever mobile operating system is being used on a compatible mobile phone.

I have now reported a Yellow Card incident with the UK Medicines and Healthcare Products Regulatory Agency which regulates these medical products because Librelink is now useless for low and high glucose alarms on my phone and has been for the better part of 2 months and it is delaying me self-diagnosing and treating hypoglycaemia and hyperglycaemia. If you are resident in the United Kingdom, you may want to consider doing the same.

 

[MIKEno13]

BadaBing, thanks for your response to my first submission to the forum.
It seems we are on the same page and share the same problems.
My phone is using OS 13 though I do not know when it may have been upgraded to that OS.
As I said, I'll speak to my Healthcare pros next week and get their comments on the problem. A Yellow Card incident report is something that I had considered and I may well go down that route. I'll let you and the forum know what results.
Let's hope the new year brings us new solutions and less hassle from what had always promised to be a Diabetes game changer.

 

[BadaBing]

BadaBing, thanks for your response to my first submission to the forum.
It seems we are on the same page and share the same problems.
My phone is using OS 13 though I do not know when it may have been upgraded to that OS.
As I said, I'll speak to my Healthcare pros next week and get their comments on the problem. A Yellow Card incident report is something that I had considered and I may well go down that route. I'll let you and the forum know what results.
Let's hope the new year brings us new solutions and less hassle from what had always promised to be a Diabetes game changer.

I hope Abbott can sort this out quickly too. It shouldn't have taken two months (and counting).

Microsoft have in the past occasionally made a hash of doing a major update to Windows, or a security patch for Windows, which has made some third party peripheral devices and apps not work or work poorly on a Windows PC. But I have never known Microsoft take so long to sort the problem out.

Happy New Year!

 

[Alastair Gordon]

I have been having frequent issues with loss of contact between my Samsung S21 phone and the Libre 2 sensors this year. Abbott have generally replaced the sensor this being their solution to the problem.
Today, with the same issue again over the recent holiday, I spoke to another service agent - Yusef - (apologies for the likely mis-spelling) who was clearly far more experienced in the field of software. The crux of the problem - according to him - is that Bluetooth is only able to communicate between the phone and one single Bluetooth enabled device at any one time. This means that when I get into my car the hands free system locates my phone and switches it away from the sensor. This disconnection can only be definitively re-made by switching off the phone Bluetooth and then the phone. Away from the car or any other Bluetooth enabled device re-start the phone and Bluetooth. The connection will be completed and alarms will function. This is a Bluetooth limitation. It is clearly known to Abbott and I am sure to the NHS.
I expressed my displeasure with the functioning of the system and said that my confidence in the system was diminishing. I was told that the issue was known and that in the initial training in use of the L2 sensor I should have been informed of it.
For me this is unacceptable. Having working alarms available when driving is a health and safety issue.
I shall take it up with my healthcare professionals after the holiday.

I am not sure this explanation is true. I have disabled Bluetooth in every device I have, other than the Samsung S21 Android phone hosting the LibreLink app, and still the Signal Loss occurs, rendering the system both useless and dangerous. And how absurd is it that Abbott admits that their product does not work as advertised, and their only responsibility is to inform the user of that fact at initial training. My experience with Abbott tech support agents and supervisors has been nothing but robotic scripts, endless lies, and broken promises.

But, I have experienced a few (very few) nights in which no signal loss occurred, possibly pointing to wireless radiation noise from other sources as the issue. However, other cheap and non-critical Bluetooth devices do NOT fail, and reliable operation in the presence of normal background radiation levels is the responsibility of Abbott. The problem is clearly Abbott's, as signal loss errors are occurring on all phone types.

 

[h884]

I had to contact Abbot today as my phone was alarming signal loss. This went on between 09.00 till 12.15. After all the usual questions Abbot are replacing the sensor. They do not want the faulty sensor returned and if the same happens with the sensor I am now now using they will replace it as well.

My comment to that was would they not be better sorting the issue rather than keep replacing sensors

 

[BadaBing]

I had to contact Abbot today as my phone was alarming signal loss. This went on between 09.00 till 12.15. After all the usual questions Abbot are replacing the sensor. They do not want the faulty sensor returned and if the same happens with the sensor I am now now using they will replace it as well.

My comment to that was would they not be better sorting the issue rather than keep replacing sensors

That is why I believe the time has now come for anyone who lives in the UK who believes faulty sensors, or faulty Freestyle Librelink phone app software, may be delaying you self-diagnosing and treating hypoglycaemia or hyperglycaemia should consider making a formal Yellow Card report to the UK medical devices regulator, the Medicines and Healthcare Products Regulatory Agency.

 

[Guy_Hemmings]

Been dealing with inane Libre II sensor issues for a few years now. Latest has been, "Signal Loss Alarm", and prompt to scan the sensor non-sense. Scanning the sensor stops the alarms for about five to ten minutes, and then the pest returns. It had been occurring intermittently for about three months. Nothing seemed to mitigate the recurrence. Then a week back Android pushed out a security update, followed by a new OS release. The Libre II phone app had a melt down. Last night the &#*! phone was alerting me every 15 minutes with a signal loss alarm.

After reading this thread, I tried shutting the phone down and restarting. No joy. The "Signal Loss Alarms" kept coming. Reread the messages here and noted it was necessary to close out the app before restarting. So closed the app and restarted. Again, no joy. The alarms resumed and the Red Bang (red colored exclamation point nest to the three horizontal bars in the upper left of the app screen display) remained. Then suddenly, the Red Bang vanished and thus far (two hours later) I have not been plagued with the recurring "Signal Loss Alarm". Yippee, Ki Yay!

I am not sure if anything I did made the Bang go away. Interestingly, it did vanish about five minutes after the last app shut down and rebooting the phone.

Phone is Pixel 6 - Android version 13

Thanks for the advice, I’ve just done exactly that closed the app, restarted the android Samsung phone and vuala !!
No annoying loud bleeps. XX