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Newbie with alarmingly high test results

H

HeyJude!

Member
Messages
16
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Treatment type
Tablets (oral)
Hello,

I'll try and summarise my background as briefly as poss:

46 year old female, very overweight. :( Had a lot of stress lately & incredibly tired all the time.

I have hypothyroidism...detected during pregnancy...and my blood tests hadn't been done for a couple of years (never called for them, i was unaware I needed to)

Blood test revealed my thyroid was hugely undermedicated so increased to 175mg - Doc said it explained my inability to lose weight (and I have really tried so many different diet) as well as my tiredness and night sweats.

6 weeks later, blood test again to see if thyroid responding (it is, but not enough so now increased to 200mg levothyroxine which, I think, is pretty high dose)

At the same time they decided to do general bloods which came back yesterday: Hba1C: 112 plus elevated liver test result. Called to see diabetic nurse straight away.

They think I have type 2 but have now done another test (Gad?) to check it's not type 1. (I don't know family history due to a complicated background)

My fingerprick test in the surgery yesterday was 17. Today, before breakfast it was 18.9. I have been asked to test pre-breakfast and pre-dinner.

I took my first Gliclazide (80mg) this morning and was told it had to be with breakfast (which I usually skip!).

It's all incredibly overwhelming and unexpected and I was given so much info yesterday I couldn't take it all in - including about hypos, testing before driving etc

So, I'm glad to have found this forum although that is also overwhelming me a little.

My plan for the next couple of weeks is to lower carbs (though not cut out completely) and 'eat clean'. To be fair, we do already and I cook a lot from scratch but know portion size needs addressing and there's to be zero processed foods etc. I've recently been tracking food and eating 1800 cals a day....but with no weight loss! Most days I get my 10,000 steps but don't do any other physical activity...I know that needs to change also.

I hardly eat sugary food/drinks. I'm a savoury gal...and a carb lover. I know, I know....

I'll then take stock and consider other diet approaches once my head isn't too full - there seem to be a lot of various opinions and I've no idea which will be best for me.

Does this sound like a reasonable plan for now? Is there anything else anyone thinks I should be doing in the short term whilst trying to get my head round this?

I'd hugely appreciate advice, and some hope. The more I read, the more my current figures terrify me.
 
Very reasonable as a starting plan. The reason you gained weight and couldn't lose, is almost certainly Insulin resistance. With your body unable to use all the glucose your meals produced, it's first plan of attack is peeing it out, hence thirst to replace what's gone, and storing it away as fat. By reducing carbs, you are reducing the Glucose level, meaning less to store away, but with elevated Insulin levels, your body cannot access the stored fat to use as fuel. As your levels drop, so should the Insulin levels, and with this some improvement in resistance. This means even more Glucose actually being used, instead of stored. Eventually you should reach the point where fat burning can occur, this is when weight loss can really start.
 
Hi @HeyJude! and welcome to the forum

What are your primary goals? I get the impression that you are more focussed on weight loss ( portion size, calories and exercise) than dealing with your diabetes ( testing Blood Glucose before each meal and then 2hrs later to see how well your body coped with it - no more than a 2mmol rise and it was OK, more than 3 and the amount of carbohydrates was too large).

I know you have only been asked to test before Breakfast and before Dinner, I presume that is to ensure the Gliclazide doesn't give you a hypo. But that testing tells you nothing about eating food that your body can thrive on.

Here is a link to a great explanation by one of our members: https://josekalsbeek.blogspot.com/2019/11/the-nutritional-thingy.html
 
Hi @HeyJude!
I'm not going to give you diabetic advice. I've only known I was diabetic for 5 or 6 weeks and you'll get great responses from people who know lots more than me.
I want to give you a big virtual hug I well remember that absolutely overwhelming feeling when you first find out.
My hba1c wasn't as high as yours (although I've seen posts on here with similar numbers) but I've certainly had finger pricks in the 18s.(but nothing over 8.5 in the last four weeks)
For me I've gone very low carb and my numbers are coming down and I'm beginning to lose weight.
I too am overweight and I can tell you roughly how many calories are in something just by looking at it after 30 odd years of every diet known to man.
This time (for me) its not about dieting, its about lifestyle. I know all the diets say that but this time I really feel it. I had bacon and eggs this morning and I'm off to Nandos for dinner later.I'll finish the day on about 8 carbs and 1200 cals (thats very low carb even for me, I'm happy up to 20) and I'll feel satied and not deprived
I don't worry too much about exercise. I had a knee replacement 3 months ago so I celebrate the days I get 5000 steps. Things still seem to be going in the right direction.
After that big waffle what I'm trying to say is. You know about it now. You're taking action. When you settle in to it the direction is up.
Very best of luck
 
ianf0ster said:
Hi @HeyJude! and welcome to the forum

What are your primary goals? I get the impression that you are more focussed on weight loss ( portion size, calories and exercise) than dealing with your diabetes ( testing Blood Glucose before each meal and then 2hrs later to see how well your body coped with it - no more than a 2mmol rise and it was OK, more than 3 and the amount of carbohydrates was too large).

I know you have only been asked to test before Breakfast and before Dinner, I presume that is to ensure the Gliclazide doesn't give you a hypo. But that testing tells you nothing about eating food that your body can thrive on.

Here is a link to a great explanation by one of our members:

Thanks, have read that post. Very helpful - but also says not to do low carb with Gluclazide?

I guess my primary goal is what I am confused about. I would have thought that losing weight will then help manage the diabetes?

I don’t really know what route to go down at the moment, and I’m terrified of this medication causing a hypo if I go too low on carbs.

Until yesterday, I didn’t even know I was being tested for diabetes, so I have a vast amount to get my head around. I want to be the model patient but don’t really know what that looks like for me.

I didn’t even know about testing to see levels post eating!
Click to expand...
 
Margarettt said:
Hi @HeyJude!
I'm not going to give you diabetic advice. I've only known I was diabetic for 5 or 6 weeks and you'll get great responses from people who know lots more than me.
I want to give you a big virtual hug I well remember that absolutely overwhelming feeling when you first find out.
My hba1c wasn't as high as yours (although I've seen posts on here with similar numbers) but I've certainly had finger pricks in the 18s.(but nothing over 8.5 in the last four weeks)
For me I've gone very low carb and my numbers are coming down and I'm beginning to lose weight.
I too am overweight and I can tell you roughly how many calories are in something just by looking at it after 30 odd years of every diet known to man.
This time (for me) its not about dieting, its about lifestyle. I know all the diets say that but this time I really feel it. I had bacon and eggs this morning and I'm off to Nandos for dinner later.I'll finish the day on about 8 carbs and 1200 cals (thats very low carb even for me, I'm happy up to 20) and I'll feel satied and not deprived
I don't worry too much about exercise. I had a knee replacement 3 months ago so I celebrate the days I get 5000 steps. Things still seem to be going in the right direction.
After that big waffle what I'm trying to say is. You know about it now. You're taking action. When you settle in to it the direction is up.
Very best of luck
Click to expand...

Thank you so much. The hug is what I need!! (And ALL the advice, obviously!)
 
@HeyJude! welcome to the group.
You might find that lowering your intake of carbs will be so effective that you will soon not need to worry about weight, and might have your medication reviewed and reduced.
You do have to be careful with the gliclazide as it actively removes glucose so you can have hypos. If you start to see low numbers you need to get in touch with your nurse or GP - and you need to be careful about driving as you sort out what you can and can't eat.
I do still need Thyroxine, but my thyroid has recovered after some years eating low carb. I was taking 200 micrograms for decades, now reduced to 125 as it woke up a bit and the dose was dropped month on month a couple of years ago.
My weight dropped significantly and I am still changing shape now.
There might be no great need to reduce calories - that might even slow weightloss in your circumstances, and there is no need to avoid processed foods as long as they are not stuffed with carbs. I used to work for Allied Lyons and making things cheaper by using more low cost carbs was always a good thing for the development team to keep in mind.
My excess weight began to vanish away without any effort or even thought on my part. My 'healthy' diet was just totally wrong and yet I was being pushed to eat carbs every time I saw GP or nurse. Now I get congratulated for something I am doing effortlessly.
There are so many misconceptions about diet and weight and I wonder how on earth we got here.
 
Resurgam said:
@HeyJude! welcome to the group.
You might find that lowering your intake of carbs will be so effective that you will soon not need to worry about weight, and might have your medication reviewed and reduced.
You do have to be careful with the gliclazide as it actively removes glucose so you can have hypos. If you start to see low numbers you need to get in touch with your nurse or GP - and you need to be careful about driving as you sort out what you can and can't eat.
I do still need Thyroxine, but my thyroid has recovered after some years eating low carb. I was taking 200 micrograms for decades, now reduced to 125 as it woke up a bit and the dose was dropped month on month a couple of years ago.
My weight dropped significantly and I am still changing shape now.
There might be no great need to reduce calories - that might even slow weightloss in your circumstances, and there is no need to avoid processed foods as long as they are not stuffed with carbs. I used to work for Allied Lyons and making things cheaper by using more low cost carbs was always a good thing for the development team to keep in mind.
My excess weight began to vanish away without any effort or even thought on my part. My 'healthy' diet was just totally wrong and yet I was being pushed to eat carbs every time I saw GP or nurse. Now I get congratulated for something I am doing effortlessly.
There are so many misconceptions about diet and weight and I wonder how on earth we got here.
Click to expand...
Super helpful, thanks - and great news about your thyroid. Maybe mine will eventually respond too? Fingers crossed.

The diabetes nurse I saw was absolutely lovely but she told me not to cut carbs entirely and to aim for a 90% plant-based diet which is low fat. I'm a keen meat-eater and would love to go more towards very low carb/keto but now very confused! (And terrified of a hypo caused by the Glic and low carbing)

I totally get that we're all different and it's trial and error but I just want to get off to a flying start and the more I read, the more that seems to be low carb and high (good) fat. Which is the opposite of the advice!
 
Yes, it's often the advice we got from the Government, the NHS, our GPs etc that pushed us over the edge into Type 2 diabetes in the first place.
There is absolutely no need to go plant based (vegetarian or vegan) unless you want to.
Low fat foods tend to have added carbohydrates to make up for the lack of flavoursome fat. They are also less satiating than their full fat equivalents, so you are hungry again sooner and thus tend to eat more.

Vegetarians find it difficult to succeed at Type 2 remission using Low Car (but quite a few manage it(, however it gets really difficult for vegans. Where carnivores (hardly eating any plants or fruit at all) find it easy, because the best sources of protein and fat are mainly animal based:
Meat (especially fatty cuts), fish (especially fatty fish), eggs (an almost perfect combination or Protein and fat), hard cheese and full fat dairy. Then add above ground veg (especially cruciferous and leafy veg), berries (most other fruit is higher carb) and nuts and that's it.
But test how your own body reacts to them using your personal expert - your BG meter!
 
ianf0ster said:
Yes, it's often the advice we got from the Government, the NHS, our GPs etc that pushed us over the edge into Type 2 diabetes in the first place.
There is absolutely no need to go plant based (vegetarian or vegan) unless you want to.
Low fat foods tend to have added carbohydrates to make up for the lack of flavoursome fat. They are also less satiating than their full fat equivalents, so you are hungry again sooner and thus tend to eat more.

Vegetarians find it difficult to succeed at Type 2 remission using Low Car (but quite a few manage it(, however it gets really difficult for vegans. Where carnivores (hardly eating any plants or fruit at all) find it easy, because the best sources of protein and fat are mainly animal based:
Meat (especially fatty cuts), fish (especially fatty fish), eggs (an almost perfect combination or Protein and fat), hard cheese and full fat dairy. Then add above ground veg (especially cruciferous and leafy veg), berries (most other fruit is higher carb) and nuts and that's it.
But test how your own body reacts to them using your personal expert - your BG meter!
Click to expand...

Thank you for making that so straightforward. I now feel like I have a plan - against the nurse advice, but overwhelmingly sensible. Low carb, normal fat it is then.

I’ll get to know my BG meter and endure the pricking more often…quite sure that will get easier. I’m only one Day 1!
 
If you like meat, then Keto is ideal for you. In my mind Plant based is a fad, designed to push people towards Veganism. Without animal based foods, mankind would not still be here, we would have died out thousands of years ago.
If you do go low carb, you will almost certainly lose weight without actually trying, although some less lucky people find that a bit more effort is needed.
As long as you monitor your blood sugars, directly before, and 2 hours after starting to eat, you will rapidly build up a selection of meals that suit YOUR body. With the knowledge from this, your health care professionals, should be in a position to advise when and how much to reduce medication.
The encouragement from seeing your blood levels drop, and the scales dropping to, and your clothes getting baggy, is intoxicating.
You have definitely come to right place, best of luck going forward, and we are all here to help, with suggestions and encouragement when life throws a curve ball, as it inevitably will.
 
Sensible finger pricking:
1. Warm the hand first - use hot water or hold a mug of your favourite hot beverage (no/little sugar)
2. Use lowest setting that yields a decent drop of blood without squeezing.
3. Change fingers every time (most of us change fingers rather than lancettes)
4. Use the side areas around the pads of the fingers rather than finger pads. Less painful, thinner skin so yield blood more easily, area not used much in daily life - unlike finger pads.
 
While emphasising that we are all different, I had an underactive thyroid (slight in the private test, not indicated in the NHS test which was not as comprehensive) and after 2 years of keto diet (my choice - low carb would probably give similar results) my thyroid appears to have coughed into life and my eyebrows have grown back! So while it wasn't as serious a problem as it was for Resurgam, it still existed. I don't think the hair on my head will grow back but a halfway good result is much better than none at all. So if you decide to go that way, there can be some very heartening side-effects to a low carb diet.

Oh, and I've lost several stone that needed losing, and my BG is in the non-diabetic range as long as I stick to low-carb. Easiest change I ever made after years of misery on low-calorie. And I eat loads of meat and fish.
 
HeyJude! said:
Super helpful, thanks - and great news about your thyroid. Maybe mine will eventually respond too? Fingers crossed.

The diabetes nurse I saw was absolutely lovely but she told me not to cut carbs entirely and to aim for a 90% plant-based diet which is low fat. I'm a keen meat-eater and would love to go more towards very low carb/keto but now very confused! (And terrified of a hypo caused by the Glic and low carbing)

I totally get that we're all different and it's trial and error but I just want to get off to a flying start and the more I read, the more that seems to be low carb and high (good) fat. Which is the opposite of the advice!
Click to expand...
I wonder how many of the patients are either totally ignoring that advice, or really, really struggling to keep their glucose under control.

Eating low carb high fat is like being able to catch the bus up the mountain, reaching the café at the top and getting a free lunch served, so you can sit and admire the scenery until you notice the poor souls struggling up the slope under a heavy pack as you are boarding the bus as the café closes and the rain starts so you are back at the hotel in time for dinner with free wine and dancing later.
 
ianf0ster said:
Sensible finger pricking:
1. Warm the hand first - use hot water or hold a mug of your favourite hot beverage (no/little sugar)
2. Use lowest setting that yields a decent drop of blood without squeezing.
3. Change fingers every time (most of us change fingers rather than lancettes)
4. Use the side areas around the pads of the fingers rather than finger pads. Less painful, thinner skin so yield blood more easily, area not used much in daily life - unlike finger pads.
Click to expand...

This is so helpful, thank you!
 
Outlier said:
While emphasising that we are all different, I had an underactive thyroid (slight in the private test, not indicated in the NHS test which was not as comprehensive) and after 2 years of keto diet (my choice - low carb would probably give similar results) my thyroid appears to have coughed into life and my eyebrows have grown back! So while it wasn't as serious a problem as it was for Resurgam, it still existed. I don't think the hair on my head will grow back but a halfway good result is much better than none at all. So if you decide to go that way, there can be some very heartening side-effects to a low carb diet.

Oh, and I've lost several stone that needed losing, and my BG is in the non-diabetic range as long as I stick to low-carb. Easiest change I ever made after years of misery on low-calorie. And I eat loads of meat and fish.
Click to expand...

What a great result! Deffo gives me hope. And, again, further weight (pardon the pun) for the low carb diet. I’ve spent so long miserably following all the traditional advice only to fail every time.

Just done an online supermarket shop and have stocked up on meat, fish, eggs, good fats (olive oil, butter, yoghurt, cheese) and above ground veg.

The advice on this forum is wonderful. I’ve spent the entire day reading it and ignoring the NHS pack I was given that talks about the need for carbs…!
 
HeyJude! said:
What a great result! Deffo gives me hope.
Click to expand...
You might like this section of the forum. ;) https://www.diabetes.co.uk/forum/category/success-stories-and-testimonials.43/
Possibly this thread in the low carb section where we share our meals as well: https://www.diabetes.co.uk/forum/threads/what-have-you-eaten-today-low-carb-forum.75781/page-2890

And I like to add another tip to @ianf0ster 's fingerpricking tips: If blood doesn't come spontaneously and you do need a bit of a squeeze, don't squeeze the fingertip but start at the palm of your hand and move up, pushing more blood into the finger. Think milking goats, not trying to push out a splinter.
 
Hi @HeyJude!

Nothing much to add to the great advice from everyone other than a word of caution about the Gliclizide, I was on maximum dose Gliclizide at the start of my diabetes journey and it does cause hypos, be careful cutting your carbs right out whilst still taking it, I started on 25g carb a meal and as I lost weight and reduced my carbs even more I begun to have regular hypos after eating, with the help of my GP I began to reduce the Glic and my carbs until eventually I was off the Glic and on a keto lifestyle.

It’s important to test 2 hours after your meal or if you feel strange such as light headed, sweaty wobbly, shaky, blurred vision then test your BG. If it’s 4 or under than you need to eat some carbs - BUT don’t over eat, have a couple of jelly babies or 2 or 3 grapes or a dextrose tablet or maybe a small plain biscuit. Then test again 15 minutes later to make sure your on the rise.

If you see hypos regularly then discuss with your GP about reducing your meds
 
lovinglife said:
Hi @HeyJude!

Nothing much to add to the great advice from everyone other than a word of caution about the Gliclizide, I was on maximum dose Gliclizide at the start of my diabetes journey and it does cause hypos, be careful cutting your carbs right out whilst still taking it, I started on 25g carb a meal and as I lost weight and reduced my carbs even more I begun to have regular hypos after eating, with the help of my GP I began to reduce the Glic and my carbs until eventually I was off the Glic and on a keto lifestyle.

It’s important to test 2 hours after your meal or if you feel strange such as light headed, sweaty wobbly, shaky, blurred vision then test your BG. If it’s 4 or under than you need to eat some carbs - BUT don’t over eat, have a couple of jelly babies or 2 or 3 grapes or a dextrose tablet or maybe a small plain biscuit. Then test again 15 minutes later to make sure your on the rise.

If you see hypos regularly then discuss with your GP about reducing your meds
Click to expand...

Thank you for explaining so clearly - it’s what I’ve been worried about having read about Glic.

I’ll taper carbs down slowly and deffo keep checking levels. Ideally, I’d like to come off them (when healthcare team agree) and manage through diet instead.

To be honest, I have several social occasions in the coming fortnight that will make it v tricky to be totally carb free (including a long weekend wedding) so minimal carbs instead will work for me and also allow my body to adjust.

I can then review again in early Oct…I’ll also hopefully know for sure by then that this is type 2.

Thanks again for the sensible advice. I’ve also bought some dextrose tablets…just in case.
 
Looking at your numbers I was diagnosed with 106 and my finger prick tests in hospital were in the high 20s - I remember one being 28! So if you are diagnosed T2 rather than T1 then with hard work there is every chance you can reduce or even come off your meds.

I’ve also lost 11st in weight over the years - going up and down a little, went down 7 dress sizes I’m still a bit of a hefty lass, never managed remission numbers but I’m now on the cusp of pre diabetes and by far, much healthier than I was 13 years ago
 
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