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Body Mass or Body Fat

donnellysdogs

donnellysdogs

Master
Messages
13,231
Location
Northampton
Type of diabetes
Type 1
Treatment type
Pump
Dislikes
People that can't listen to other people's opinions.
People that can't say sorry.
Now that I sm actually allowed to go to our gym (result.. Previously not allowed)... Which is more important as a measurement to improve... Body Mass Index or Body Fat??
 
I would say Body Fat because it's more personal to the individual. BMI takes no account of muscle being heavier than fat, so a fit person's BMI could be higher than someone who isn't fit. This is more relevant to men than women, but I would still say Body Fat. Not that it matters in my case lol. :) There's lots of room for improvement on both of them :)
 
PS I'm glad you can go at last. What changed their minds?
 
What are you looking to achieve at the gym? That will help inform the answer to your question.

Good news you can join in. I thought you felt you got plenty of exercise in the course of your work? How did you find yourself persona non grata?
 
As a man and a sports coach, I would say body fat, for all the reasons given above.
However, as long as you are getting fitter both should respond.
Take it easy, the first few times, as you will be using muscles you didn't know you had!;):)
 
zand said:
PS I'm glad you can go at last. What changed their minds?
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I drew up a draft contract for GPs and Gym and they both agreed to it.
The gym now has an instructor qualified in training persons with certain illnesses such as hypertension, disbetes, asthma etc...
So they can now handle us with a structured 12 week introduction and then be let loose at any gym at all!!

Peserverance to help all patients and working with the gym and the GPs....
 
donnellysdogs said:
Now that I sm actually allowed to go to our gym (result.. Previously not allowed)... Which is more important as a measurement to improve... Body Mass Index or Body Fat??
Click to expand...
Welcome back to the gym Donnelly! :p

As a scientist I have to say that the body fat percentage is the way to go!
Reason? Though many research studies have shown that an elevated BMI is associated with heart disease, stroke, diabetes type2 and some cancers, then BMI does actually not distinguish fat from muscle in any way. So just a fun example:
lebron-james-001.jpg

That guy is highly fit and lean Mr Lebron James. And according to the BMI he is borderline obese.

That being said, I do believe BMI can be helpful. If you are above 30% in body fat, then both your BMI and your body fat percentage would tell you that weight loss should be your primary goal. However, as soon as you start to get serious about your body weight and training, then the BMI will not work at all. The body fat percentage is however not easily measured accurately at home. Available for privates, the devices are typically measuring the body's impedance between two electrodes. The error rate variation for these can be as high as 6-8%. Other methods for measuring body fat percentage are highly accurate but much more complicated, like X-ray analysis or water displacement. That is why BMI has its place. It may be crude, but its quick and easy.
Whatever keeps you motivated on staying on diet, exercising and living healthy !
funny-excercise-chewing-W630.jpg
 
The difference to allow me to the gym though was:

The instructor having gained a qualification to deal with specific illnesses;
Getting a legal agreement drawn up between gym and GPs to get both parties asses covered;
To get the GPs behind the scheme;

To get "forever" membership to any gym any referred patients have to complete a 12 week course. Then I get a bit of paper to allow me to go to any gym.

It's not been easy as my original post about not being allowed to go circuit training was a long while ago.

However, I haven't done this just for me as I am a real activist for not being dfeated but more over because we have 10000 patients that could improve their health.
In fact one of the GPs has now signed up and goes down every lunch time!!

Result all round...
 
I agree with the posts that measuring body fat is the right way to go. I am surprised that you weren't allowed to join the gym in the past though. It's never been an issue I've had to deal with, except once, where I made them produce a legal waiver that stated if I died in the gym as a result of my diabetes, then they weren't liable (or something to that effect)...
 
My body fat came in as 30.7 and my bmi 20.1. With clothes on.

I was staggered as I have maintained to my healthcare team that I am losing muscle and they maintain I have lost fat.

To me if I had lost fat my body fat would be less than 30? Any thoughts please?

The gym instructor says they go by BMI and I don't understand that.. But thought it might be more achievable.

If you declare you are diabetic (with pump on arm at the time) some gyms will restrict access.

In fact it is really good now that my gym did as I get a personal trainer for 2 sessions a week for 12 weeks!! They also insist on a bg test recorded before every exercise session and after it...and that is documented too.
 
donnellysdogs said:
Now that I sm actually allowed to go to our gym (result.. Previously not allowed)... Which is more important as a measurement to improve... Body Mass Index or Body Fat??
Click to expand...

You have to remember / the scale cant tell the difference between musclel and fat , everybody,s body frame is different. :bookworm:
 
gary803 said:
You have to remember / the scale cant tell the difference between musclel and fat , everybody,s body frame is different. :bookworm:
Click to expand...

So if I'm 30% whats the other 70%? Sorry to sound thick... (I am)... Would the rest be bone and organs then? Wouldn't organs come under muscle?

I know.. I'm really dense but I can't fathom the rest of the 70% out and how they come up with percentages for good health.
 
donnellysdogs said:
So if I'm 30% whats the other 70%? Sorry to sound thick... (I am)... Would the rest be bone and organs then? Wouldn't organs come under muscle?

I know.. I'm really dense but I can't fathom the rest of the 70% out and how they come up with percentages for good health.
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The considered healthy ranges are here, DD.

http://www.rcn.org.uk/__data/assets...DIY_Information_Sheet_Body_Fat_Percentage.pdf

The balance of your 70% will be the rest of you that isn't fat. Sorry if that's stating the obvious or sounds patronising. Quite a large percentage is water, then bone. Dr Google has enough information on all this to take a lifetime to read.

How did they measure your fat percentage? Was is a caliper, pinching skin at various points over your body, or just a single caliper measurement? I have some wonderful scales that seem fairly accurate against caliper methods, but they have hand held contacts as well as foot pads to measure the resistance.
 
It was just a hand held thing!! They have just got something to step on but they haven't figured out how it works yet-lol!!

What scales have you got?

Crikey though if I had 23% fat I would be a stick insect!!! And would still be counted as healthy!!

There is no one size fits all is there!! My HCP's think I have lost sucutaneous fat??? Yet I'm still adamant its muscle thats gone... Hence wanting to go to the gym!! And hey, now I can!! With a personal trainer!!! Benefits of putting up a fught sometimes!!

Thanks.. It answers some questions!!
 
donnellysdogs said:
It was just a hand held thing!! They have just got something to step on but they haven't figured out how it works yet-lol!!

What scales have you got?

Crikey though if I had 23% fat I would be a stick insect!!! And would still be counted as healthy!!

There is no one size fits all is there!! My HCP's think I have lost sucutaneous fat??? Yet I'm still adamant its muscle thats gone... Hence wanting to go to the gym!! And hey, now I can!! With a personal trainer!!! Benefits of putting up a fught sometimes!!

Thanks.. It answers some questions!!
Click to expand...


I have these: http://www.boots.com/en/Omron-BF511...ots+Shopping+-+Category+-+Health+and+Pharmacy

They can be acquired at a better price than that, but those are the ones. I like the memory functionality, and we have them set up for both of us.

Regarding the percentages, mine is down in the teens, but I'm at the lower ends of BMI, weight and all that too, so not the best example for anyone to follow! Perhaps you have a touch of the old TOFI going on?

(The next scale up in this range does even more tricks, but that felt rather OTT, even for me.)
 
I thing here in the states its a money game , insurance co set the standard . Im 6, 4" they say i should weigh 200 lbs.
Id break like a tooth pick .
 
Omg.. Had to look up TOFI!! I do moan that my belly gets fat just from eating... Its odd due to STC and the amount if time and progression food takes to come out!! Didn't know anything about TOFI!! More research to do.. Intersting what it says about lentils and pulses...

My waist is 28, my hips are 34 including obviously tummy fat!! To me that is either my hips are 6" too small or my waist is 6" too big!! I was some how under the illusion from my teenage tears that for females that bum and boobs shouldn't be more than 12" bigger than waist??!!
Don't know where I've gained that info from....??

Will add scales on to my shopping list. I think our previous scales did body fat but I wan't interested too much then.
 
donnellysdogs said:
Omg.. Had to look up TOFI!! I do moan that my belly gets fat just from eating... Its odd due to STC and the amount if time and progression food takes to come out!! Didn't know anything about TOFI!! More research to do.. Intersting what it says about lentils and pulses...

My waist is 28, my hips are 34 including obviously tummy fat!! To me that is either my hips are 6" too small or my waist is 6" too big!! I was some how under the illusion from my teenage tears that for females that bum and boobs shouldn't be more than 12" bigger than waist??!!
Don't know where I've gained that info from....??

Will add scales on to my shopping list. I think our previous scales did body fat but I wan't interested too much then.
Click to expand...

If you want scales to measure body fat/water/visceral fat, then the more accurate ones have hand held parts. Those with only foot pads clearly only measure from the feet, so not so many measurements to draw conclusions from. Again, Dr Google can help you with information.

I'm not saying you do suffer from TOFI, but the point I'm making is that we shouldn't judge a (body composition) book by its (outer appearance) cover.

Dr Google also has much to say about measuring body fat with manual calipers, which are obviously very cheap, although you may need to enlist the help of your OH to do some of the measurements.
 
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