Can a morbidly obese T2 effectively become T1 due to 50% body fat??

[lucylocket61]

Thanks Jim. I am somewhat disheartened to hear 100 - 120 carbs is too much for some T2's.

I fought with low carbing for a while but at 28 - 38 gms per day measured religiously, I never lost any weight and never lost my craving for sweets. Hunger definitely wasnt an issue but boredom was. I craved an apple or a serving of root veges and hence why I went onto the higher carbs. It was also frustrating that with vlc, I was still getting morning readings of 8 or more. Also over about 7 years of this time, I was struggling with misdiagnosed PTSD which led to me being a couch potato and semi agoraphobic. So you can see how I gradually dropped out of low carbing and how the lack of exercise and isolation lead to other problems.

I dont want lo carbing to be the answer but I guess I will just have to bite the bullet and see how much I can get it down. Certainly I can get it to 150 without too much problem, the real challenge will be getting it down below 100. And as to the hunger issue, I have been substituting my sandwich lunch with meat and salad and I am having no problem going 4 hours plus without hunger. If I can just find some magic lo carb breakfast recipes then that will be half the battle. I find it almost imposssible to eat bacon and eggs after my 18 month vlc stint. Even 13 years later, I feel a bit nauseous having it (as I did today).

I am planning to get those 2 meals sorted whilst eating a normal dinner apart from banishing potatoes. Lastly, I will tackle the fruit after dinner and the hardest of all, milk in coffee and overall, less coffee.

Then it is just a case of trying to match up lo carbing with a calorie reducing diet and I may even crack losing some weight. 15kgs would make a lot of difference to my BG and knees, I suspect as well as get some weight off so I can more readily recover from my first knee op in 9 months time.

You may find, like I have, that you don't need breakfast. I eat twice a day and am fine. I have been low carbing (around 100g a day) for a decade now.

Edited as I didn't realize you are on insulin: maybe split your lunch into two small meals? Low carbing on insulin can need gradual tweaking and medical input.

 

[Binky21]

Hi, here is an explanation on what basal testing is.. https://www.mysugr.com/en/blog/basal-rate-testing/

Insulin to carb ratio is pretty much how many grams of carbs 1 unit of bolus insulin could deal with.
However not all carbs digest at the same rate to alow the insulin working profile to compliment it? Timing of the dose is key, too..

Hope this helps..

So Jaylee, am I reading this right? I use my Lantus and then make sure I fast for ten hours to cover a 1/4 of the day? So its min 4 or max 8 days of fasting? Ten hours being Time of Meal + 4 hours, then six hour fasting for the basal measurement period? During that period should I take hourly readings?

 

[lucylocket61]

So Jaylee, am I reading this right? I use my Lantus and then make sure I fast for ten hours to cover a 1/4 of the day? So its min 4 or max 8 days of fasting? Ten hours being Time of Meal + 4 hours, then six hour fasting for the basal measurement period? During that period should I take hourly readings?

1/4 if a day is 6 hours

 

[Rokaab]

1/4 if a day is 6 hours

However when on insulin you have to wait for 4 hours since the last fast-acting insulin dose before even starting the test - which for anyone on basal/bolus means no carbs for that time either (zero carbs food may be fine though for that 4 hours of waiting)

 

[Binky21]

@Binky21 - strikes me you have a lot going on.

The recurrent candida can be a mechanism of high blood sugars in some. High sugars don't cause thrush, but it does provide and environment for it to thrive, so it is likely that could improve if you manage to get your sugars into a better place.

Many find the Flozin meds helpful, but I appreciate how starting them with recurrent thrush already could be a bit of a stumbling block for anyone. As I understand it the gangrene is very rare, and if any of us look at the potential side effects of any medication we might take it can be scary. I mean, even aspirin can look ultra unpalatable, and Ibuprofen an eye opener: https://bnf.nice.org.uk/drug/ibuprofen.html#cautions

I'm certainly not telling you I think you should take the meds, but just trying to say it's worth looking at the likelihood of some of these things.

If your doctor has you on carbimazole it seems likely your thyroid has been over active at some point.

The thing about thyroid disease it our thyroid is a cornerstone of our metabolic health and it governs, controls and influences so many of our systems. If it is out of kilter, that may not be helping you with weight gain and the metabolic chaos you seem to be describing

When did you last have your thyroid checked out? When you have that checked, do you have full bloods done, looking at all your thyroid hormones, general health indicators and vitamins. It really is a balancing act.

To be honest, in your shoes, right now, I'd be asking for a BIG MOT, going through everything from diabetes, blood pressure, lipids, thyroid and any other conditions you have. If there has been a single condition focus each time adjustments have been made, it may not have done you any favours.

AndBreathe, that sounds like good advice. I had kind of not thought of it in that way before. It is a bit like over 25 years, something came up so they gave me something for it, then something else popped up and they did that too. It didnt really occur to me that they should be looking at a bigger picture. I will read up more on the Flozins and see if I can look at side effect rates etc. I get given regular tests but never in much depth, 1 - 2 Thyroid tests, every few years (T3 and ??). But nothing fancy. I am just about to see the Dr for a new prescription so I think that as I have private medical, I might float the idea of going to see a endicrinologist? or diabetes specialist. Until the last 2 years, I was putting up with everything but still doing ok. Now I'm declining so I think its a good idea.

Can I just say I cant believe how low your HbA1C is? How do you manage that? Are you some kind of racing snake?) When I did VLC, I never got an HbAic less than 6.3. What do you eat?

 

[Binky21]

However when on insulin you have to wait for 4 hours since the last fast-acting insulin dose before even starting the test - which for anyone on basal/bolus means no carbs for that time either (zero carbs food may be fine though for that 4 hours of waiting)

Good thinking Batman, not having to starve 10 hours on the regular would be a bonus! I guess you'd have to do the 10 hours fasting on the first one and then repeat it the next day with some 0 carb food and see if there is a difference in response

 

[AndBreathe]

AndBreathe, that sounds like good advice. I had kind of not thought of it in that way before. It is a bit like over 25 years, something came up so they gave me something for it, then something else popped up and they did that too. It didnt really occur to me that they should be looking at a bigger picture. I will read up more on the Flozins and see if I can look at side effect rates etc. I get given regular tests but never in much depth, 1 - 2 Thyroid tests, every few years (T3 and ??). But nothing fancy. I am just about to see the Dr for a new prescription so I think that as I have private medical, I might float the idea of going to see a endicrinologist? or diabetes specialist. Until the last 2 years, I was putting up with everything but still doing ok. Now I'm declining so I think its a good idea.

Can I just say I cant believe how low your HbA1C is? How do you manage that? Are you some kind of racing snake?) When I did VLC, I never got an HbAic less than 6.3. What do you eat?

The harsh reality is most endocrinologists are diabetes specialists, so if you do decide to see one, then ensure they have a good knowledge of thyroid matters too. They'll all say they do, but the reality can differ.

If you want to get more of a handle on your thyroid challenges, then I would recommend the Thyroid UK forum on Health Unlocked. There are some very knowledgeable people over there:

https://healthunlocked.com/thyroiduk/posts

Edited to add, I am a small, slight woman - 160cm tall and under 50kg. I do live a low carb lifestyle, but not very, very low these days.

I eat lots of nutritious food - meat, veg and dairy, with small amounts of fruit. I'm fortunate never to have had a sweet tooth.

 

[Daibell]

Sorry but this objectively false. Insulin, in excess, absolutely can and will make people gain weight. Hyperinsulinemia is the primary driver of obesity and metabolic syndrome. Just because using insulin doesn’t make everyone fat doesn’t mean it plays no role. Making fat from glucose is one of its primary objectives, and the more you have sloshing about at any given moment trying to mop up excess glucose, the more fat will be made. Right up to the point where there is nowhere left to store the energy and the person becomes diabetic.

The point I was trying to make is that it isn't the insulin itself but the glucose that it then metabolises into fat. I've seen posts where people have not really modified their diet to reduce carbs but blame the insulin they are taking for their weight gain.