Advice needed on cholesterol and BP results

[Mushroom]

Hi all, just been to 3rd DSN appointment and got the results of second Hb test and gone from 7.1 to 6.0. DSN says 'looks like the Metformin is working.' 'But I am not taking it', I said!
I am happy with the BG result because have I been low carbing, and blood testing. Have lost 3 stone with 6 stone to go.

Also been given cholesterol results - ;
Total was 5.4, now 5.1
LDL was 3.6, now 3.4.
HDL - was 1.4, now 1.1
Trig now 1.2 (Ratio 4.59)

Cholesterol question:
1. Figures don't seem to have gone down very much. I have read on here that with low carbing they could go up. Not happy to take statins, so are they likely to go down further with more weight loss?

Blood pressure: Dx in May - 131/89, June 123/79, Today 127/80
Blood pressure question:
2. Nurse says when someone is stressed, the bottom pressure would vary and be high but apparently my top pressure was high on the 3 readings that she took. She didn't dare broach the subject of blood pressure pills but obviously she thinks my top pressure is too high. Is it to high???

Many thanks in advance.

 

[noblehead]

They prefer diabetics to keep bp below 130/80 compared to the average of 140/80.


The target cholesterol numbers for people with diabetes are as follows:


HDL: 1mmol/l or above for men; 1.2mmol/l or above for women

LDL: below 2mmol/l

Triglycerides: equal to or below 1.7mmol/l

Total cholesterol: below 4mmol/l

 

[Mushroom]

Thanks for the targets, noblehead - will add to my ever-growing folder.

So, nearly there with the HDL.
Too high still with the LDL at 3.4 when should be under 2mml.
OK with trigs as mine are below the 1.7 at 1.2.
So total still too high at 5.1 when should be 4 or below.

So, low carbers, how do I get the LDL down?
Should I increase my exercise and/or reduce my saturated fat??? (I like the fat bit - love my butter and cheese. Not eating much at present anyway as on diet but was hoping to increase when go onto maintaining.)
Or will continued weight loss help the overall total and LDL?

 

[librarising]

Mushroom wrote
So, low carbers, how do I get the LDL down?

CAVEAT (before you read further) I AM NOT AN HCP WITH PROFESSIONAL EXPERTISE, JUST SOMEONE WITH A PASSION FOR PRESERVING MY HEALTH TILL THE DAY I DIE. THEREFORE I SCOUR THE INTERNET AND READ BOOKS TO EDUCATE MYSELF.

Here's what I would expect under a low-carb diet - your lipid profile to improve.

This would include :
a drop in triglycerides
an increase in HDL
a change in the size of your LDL particles, from small, dense, and harmful to large, fluffy, and friendly. This may not affect your LDL level. Currently your NHS test will not reveal this
I've said before, and repeat here, as far as I'm concerned, an LDL level, and a total figure, are fairly meaningless on their own.
The devil is in the detail (your profile)

I would also recommend educating yourself about why some say medical concern about cholesterol is unnecessary, more so for women. I find it frightening how many GPs reveal themselves to be at the mercy of their medical education and statin companies with profits to keep 'healthy.'
Don't forget it's called the lipid hypothesis i.e. their best idea about what's going on. Research funded by statin companies probably helps to preserve this hypothesis.

I'm not sure how long you've been low-carbing.
What the time gap between results is.
Whether trigs are down from previously.

Your profile states you are medium fat. Is that correct ?
I would suspect a move to a higher fat content to improves things more. For some this is a hard thing to do, given how ingrained the idea of saturated fat being unhealthy, and fattening is.

A good place to start is Dr Kendrick's The Great Cholesterol Con. I first read it as a library borrow.

The above is NOT medical advice, but what I after extensive reading now believe to be true.
We all have to take responsibility for our decisions in life. You must too.

Hope that helps

Geoff (never afraid to put his head above the medical concensus parapet )

 

[hanadr]

I'm another non medical professional with rebellious beliefs
I believe that we are not designed to eat large quantities of carbohydrate. Inevitably some of us handle them less well than others. and may develop what we call "Diabetes"
I also don't believe that animal fats are harmful Our blood vessels are not connected to our mouths like pipes to the sink. Fats son't go in and settle in pipes and bung them up. We DIGEST the fats and the fatty acid components of animal fats are just like the ones in plant oils.
Personally, I avoid processed foods. they are not natural to us any more than many of the additives we find in them.
I believe in home cooked foods from scratch mainly eggies and protein with fats.
I think that a low carb/high fat NATURAL diet is best and safest and that a little cholesterol is essential for the formation of hormones [especially for women after the menopause]
It may take a few months for the blood chemistry to sort itself out, but Eat right and it will. The right diet for you may be different in detail from the right diet for me, but I guess it will still be basic foods prepared at home.
Hana

 

[borofergie]

I'm another non medical professional with rebellious beliefs
I believe that we are not designed to eat large quantities of carbohydrate. Inevitably some of us handle them less well than others. and may develop what we call "Diabetes"
I also don't believe that animal fats are harmful Our blood vessels are not connected to our mouths like pipes to the sink. Fats son't go in and settle in pipes and bung them up. We DIGEST the fats and the fatty acid components of animal fats are just like the ones in plant oils.
Personally, I avoid processed foods. they are not natural to us any more than many of the additives we find in them.
I believe in home cooked foods from scratch mainly eggies and protein with fats.
I think that a low carb/high fat NATURAL diet is best and safest and that a little cholesterol is essential for the formation of hormones [especially for women after the menopause]
It may take a few months for the blood chemistry to sort itself out, but Eat right and it will. The right diet for you may be different in detail from the right diet for me, but I guess it will still be basic foods prepared at home.
Hana

AMEN!

 

[Mushroom]

Hi Geoff, thanks for the reply.
Luckily, I have been reading - Cholesterol Hoax - Sherry Rodgers) and looked at Kendrick on Spacedoc site. So am not going to worry too much about the cholesterol as I know the argument for not lowering levels, that it is actually there to protect and that what we actually eat doesn't seem to make very much difference anyway. It's my main thinking for not taking statins (apart from irreversible side effects) as a low cholesterol seems to be a bad idea, too for brain function. It's good to hear someone else articulate similar feelings.
As far as how long been low-carbing/carb counting , think it is about 3 months now, (as went low GI then avoiding carbs from diagnosis in May). Triglycerides - just looked as asked for print out of all results today - have gone down from 1.4 on 29/03/12 to 1.2 on last test on 19/9/12. Is that a lot as don't know what proportions are? But it is down.

However, the HDL itself has gone down, not up, from 1.14 to 1.11. And the HDL ratio has gone down, from 4.74 to 4.59. Any ideas on that?

Have to admit the medium fat is only because of the extra calories for a relatively small amount of food. I recently started adding cream to coffee etc and my weight loss slowed. Am very happy to embrace LCHF message when reach target weight. Takes me back to my childhood back in the 70's when we eat whole basic foods - the foods we had before we started to buy those processed foods to go in those chest freezers (showing my age now). If you think that move to higher fat will actually lower overall cholesterol and is our intended diet, I would quite happy with that. So I suppose, it all comes down to how much importance you place on the NHS targets for cholesterol levels.

Hanadr - I am post-menopausal so need all the help I can get AND don't think there is evidence that statins will help my gender/age group. I must admit, I go into a supermarket now and see manufactured packaging not food, all out to make money for the food companies.

Anyone have any ideas on the blood pressure results? On my top result being 'high'?
I don't see much discussion on here about blood pressure and medication for it. My results came down slightly after diagnosis (and weight loss and increased exercise) but hasn't gone much further down today.

Many thanks.

 

[librarising]

Mushroom wrote
However, the HDL itself has gone down, not up, from 1.14 to 1.11. And the HDL ratio has gone down, from 4.74 to 4.59. Any ideas on that?

I've been looking for a possible answer for you. It may be just a question of time.
On other forums, one person said their HDL went down at first then back up, and another said :

However, regular weight-bearing exercise is one of the easiest ways to affect and increase your HDL. Weight lifting is fine and good...but walking and running are considered weight bearing exercise, and they work just as hard to boost HDL as weight lifting focused exercise.

Is this something you could do a little more of ?
Obviously increasing your HDL will also improve your HDL/total ratio.

Geoff

 

[Mushroom]

Hi Geoff, thanks for looking for me. Hoping it is time. The weight-bearing is me having to carry my body weight everywhere! Yes, could do definitely do more exercise. Work from home since last year so now walk to shops and use stepper at home. I hit my foot on the leg of the sofa the other day. Gosh, it hurt - so at least I know the nerves in my foot are working. Badly bruised and painful to wear/walk in shoes so eased back on exercise this week but can try to get back into the habit next week. Like walking - exercises everything and it's natural - what we should be doing.
Still keen to know anyone's ideas on blood pressure.

 

[librarising]

Mushroom wrote
Anyone have any ideas on the blood pressure results? On my top result being 'high'?
I don't see much discussion on here about blood pressure and medication for it.

I hadn't heard of your book Cholesterol Hoax by Sherry Rodgers, but I notice she's also written a book called The High Blood Pressure Hoax. Although this isn't an area I've yet explored, I've already heard it said elsewhere (not sure where) that blood pressure is also one of those things we worry too much about. I can't say either way, since I've not read round the subject. I do notice, though, how medical targets keep coming down and down. Eventually we'll all be 'at risk', there'll be statins in the water supply, we'll all be taking a polypill etc etc.

OR we could get back to a healthier way of eating.

I choose to laugh, because if I didn't I'd have to cry, and laughing is healthier for me :lol:

Geoff

 

[noblehead]

Thanks for the targets, noblehead - will add to my ever-growing folder.

No problem Mushroom...........you take care now and buy another folder if need be

 

[Mushroom]

Hi Geoff, decided to stop worrying about the blood pressure result ,too. Keep being told that all results would be fine 'but not for a diabetic'. Just re-read information leaflet from nurse and my blood pressure is more or less on target so not sure what she's going on about. Spoke to friend who said it's the top one that changes with stress not bottom one?? Friend tests her blood pressure at home and has to sit still for half an hour before she does it, so a drive down to the surgery must put mine up slightly.
I had forgotten about that other book on blood pressure. Must get that one as well. Would be very convenient for the pharmaceutical companies if we all had to go on tablets, wouldn't it?
All the best to all.

 

[librarising]

Dr Kendrick's position on high blood pressure :

http://drmalcolmkendrick.org/2012/04/02 ... -any-good/

where he says (although the whole article is worth reading)

someone recently sent me a link to study from two or three years ago which re-ignited my interest in this area.

‘A new review has found that lowering blood pressure below the “standard” target of 140/90 mm Hg is not beneficial in terms of reducing mortality or morbidity1.’ July 2009

It confirmed, or re-confirmed, what I have long believed to be true. Unless the blood pressure is very high, lowering it seems to be an exercise in ‘sweeping a symptom under the carpet,’ rather than doing anything remotely useful.

Geoff

 

[Mushroom]

Interesting. Thank you.