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Britain's Fat Fight

When I was having some gynae surgery (so totally not diabetes related) a few years ago, there was a lady in the next bed having the same procedure - I’m type one and she was type two. I wonder if either or both of us would have come under that “diabetics occupying hospital beds” statistic?
When I got sterilised it was for safety reasons, for me and any foetus..... being a diabetic on insulin. So I guess I saved the nhs money by not getting pregnant any more.
However a day bed due to being diabetic. Mind u if I wasn't diabetic I still needed to stop having children after finding 2 children and a just attacked hubby a big handful.
 
When I was having some gynae surgery (so totally not diabetes related) a few years ago, there was a lady in the next bed having the same procedure - I’m type one and she was type two. I wonder if either or both of us would have come under that “diabetics occupying hospital beds” statistic?

Both of you would have been. Curriously enough, this was a topic that came up a couple of weeks ago at a research meeting, only the number being talked about there wasn't as low as 1 in 6.

I'm not defending or attacking anything or anyone, but of course any number quoted will also include those with the transient gestational diabetes, during childbirth, as well as those with broken legs and so on.

The stats are shocking, but so much depends on the definitions in play at any given time.
 
The numbers of days people with diabetes spend in hopital on each visit is also higher regardless of way someone is in.
 
The word 'Scapegoat' comes to mind. The elderly 'bed blocking', and the T2s are now being blamed just as once it used to be the smokers. Statistics can be made to say anything you fancy.
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The diabetes consultant who said this did clarify that those 1in 6 were not in for just diabetic reasons but then went onto to say that the condition is implicated in many other illnesses so not scapegoating but sounds like the truth. Smokers do get more illnesses and the elderly do require more medical care at the end of their life.
The same consultant I think then went on to blame the diabetes on obesity and trotted out the 'we just need to eat less and move more' unhelpful advice.
I like HFW (the tache looks like the Pringles man!) and Jamie Oliver but agree with Robert Lustig that the focus should not be on obesity but on diaobesity (no idea how to spell that one) since not all of the obese get ill but its the diabetes and the other symptoms of insulin resistance also affecting slim people, which causes the health issues (knee replacements being the exception).
Whilst the consensus remains that its all about calories in and out then the likes of Pepsi/Coca Cola can easily say that their calories are no worse than anyone else's calories and its down to us to limit them or burn them off.
 
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The diabetes consultant who said this did clarify that those 1in 6 were not in for just diabetic reasons but then went onto to say that the condition is implicated in many other illnesses so not scapegoating but sounds like the truth. Smokers do get more illnesses and the elderly do require more medical care at the end of their life.
The same consultant I think then went on to blame the diabetes on obesity and trotted out the 'we just need to eat less and move more' unhelpful advice.
I like HFW (the tache looks like the Pringles man!) and Jamie Oliver but agree with Robert Lustig that the focus should not be on obesity but on diaobesity (no idea how to spell that one) since not all of the obese get ill but its the diabetes and the other symptoms of insulin resistance also affecting slim people, which causes the health issues (knee replacements being the exception).
Whilst the consensus remains that its all about calories in and out then the likes of Pepsi/Coca Cola can easily say that their calories are no worse than anyone else's calories and its down to us to limit them or burn them off.

You don't think people are being scapegoated when we know that if we take the elderly and T2s out of the equation the NHS would still be on its uppers through lack of funding due solely to governments favouring the American model. Privatisation by the back door, more and more services being outsourced so that companies can get what is in effect a profit and it has been my own experience of one of these companies that has sadly led me to the conclusion that by the time my grandchildren are my age the NHS will have ceased to exist.
 
You don't think people are being scapegoated when we know that if we take the elderly and T2s out of the equation the NHS would still be on its uppers through lack of funding due solely to governments favouring the American model. Privatisation by the back door, more and more services being outsourced so that companies can get what is in effect a profit and it has been my own experience of one of these companies that has sadly led me to the conclusion that by the time my grandchildren are my age the NHS will have ceased to exist.
I hate the American model too (most expensive system in the world but in the 10th position for health apparently). I am merely frustrated that what never gets talked about much is prevention and I am fairly worried that without serious changes to our Public Health programmes (like tackling the awful food environment) that we simply won't be able to afford to treat everyone and will end up with a 2 tier (private/public) system. After all its a pyramid scheme which only works if there are enough healthy people paying in. But if people get sicker younger and live longer unhealthy lives how can it be afforded? I voted for Blair in 97 because I thought more money into the NHS and education would solve problems but it didn't...Its a political 3rd rail but I'd definitely vote for a party that was honest about these realities.
 
You don't think people are being scapegoated when we know that if we take the elderly and T2s out of the equation the NHS would still be on its uppers through lack of funding due solely to governments favouring the American model. Privatisation by the back door, more and more services being outsourced so that companies can get what is in effect a profit and it has been my own experience of one of these companies that has sadly led me to the conclusion that by the time my grandchildren are my age the NHS will have ceased to exist.
I don't think services being outsourced will bring about the demise of the NHS my views are opposite. I worked for the NHS as a clinical nurse specialist up to the end of last year. We tried and tried through the improvement framework to transform the service we provide so that patients with stable disease (tier 2) were seen in nurse led clinics rather than by consultants with the obvious premise that should their condition warrant a consultant review they would move to a tier 3 level. We fought and we fought but no one would listen to sense. So the CCG, following an excellent pilot and evaluation of our service put this out to tender. In short I now work for a private health company, we are in the process of introducing our service county wide, supported by a company with excellent business credentials who are tightly and efficiently managed. Other trusts and NHS England are watching our progress with interest and our model is likely to be adopted countrywide. The best bit about all of is is that patients are very happy, GPs are happy because we work closely with them helping to achieve targets and just in our small patch of England we have SAVED the NHS millions of pounds. Changing ways of working do not equal bad news, in the case of the NHS there is so much practice and ways of working that needs to be 're analysed by people who know what they are doing. To keep all the services under NHS services is tantamount to criminal waste of public money. Yes private companies make profit but they are businesses and also need to develop and the NHS saves millions. Free care at the point of delivery for patients will never ever change. But to keep going the NHS has to change. No one should be scared of the involvement of private companies if it ensures the future of the NHS for everyone. And private companies do not and never will charge NHS patients.
 
what is reported in the news is usually a sweeping generalization and inaccurate, to make their stories look good. We challenge news stories frequently on here.
So here is a large US study showing that diabetics do spend an extra day in hospital typically because their diabetes comes with associated health complications. Its only 1 extra day though! Its a dull day at work so I am over googling. Sorry.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4310177/
Results
Prevalence of diabetes was 9.0% (n = 23,779). Age adjusted admission rates for all-cause hospitalisation were 631.3 and 454.8 per 1,000 participant years and the mean length of stay was 8.2 and 7.1 days respectively for participants with and without diabetes. In people with and without diabetes, the risk of hospitalisation was associated with age, gender, household income, smoking, BMI, physical activity, and health and wellbeing. However, the increased risk of hospitalisation was attenuated for participants with diabetes who were older, obese, or had hypertension or hyperlipidaemia and enhanced for those participants with diabetes who were male, on low income, current smokers or who had anxiety or depression.
 
Let's remember that whenever we see a GP we are using a service provided by a private company...
And whenever we have an x-ray or a scan we are using machines purchased from a private company.....the list is endless the NHS/private business relationship is completely intertwined. But none of the services the NHS purchases externally could be deemed as privatisation by stealth or the back door or whatever people choose to call it, it isn't privatisation nor the American model because we don't have to cough up to use it (Other than through taxes). It's simply the MGS doing what it should be doing, getting the best services for patients at the best price it can!
 
And whenever we have an x-ray or a scan we are using machines purchased from a private company.....the list is endless the NHS/private business relationship is completely intertwined. But none of the services the NHS purchases externally could be deemed as privatisation by stealth or the back door or whatever people choose to call it, it isn't privatisation nor the American model because we don't have to cough up to use it (Other than through taxes). It's simply the MGS doing what it should be doing, getting the best services for patients at the best price it can!
That should say NHS my phone makes things up!
 
As long as those private providers that deliver services are targeted on health outcomes rather than mere activity then we can avoid the profit motive that pervades the US system and incentivises over treatment and makes providers susceptible to manipulation by the drug companies. To some extent that happens here too. If you watched Hospital a lot of the behind the scenes managers were concerned that the recent cancellation of non essential ops was putting a bigger hole than ever in their finances because they are paid for activity i.e performing operations; some of those operations were doubtless much needed but there is always a risk that a consultant would feel under pressure to recommend a procedure that was unnecessary of of only marginal benefit. Letting the market in has also led to the iniquity of having junk food shops in our hospitals. Doubtless this means that the hospital then has more cash to spend on medical equipment but it is also creating more work for the NHS down the line.
 
Like I said, I have had personal experience of one of these companies and as regards quality of service, speed of delivery and venue I ain't happy. If my GP suggests that I get treatment from them in the future I shall refuse.
 
a) private companies do not have to fulfill all the requirements the NHS has to and get tax breaks and other money saving opportunities not available to the NHS

https://www.independent.co.uk/life-...-tax-relief-to-undercut-the-nhs-10251549.html
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...le-status-discounts-jeremy-hunt-a7903926.html
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...al-with-emergencies-study-finds-10078928.html

b) why would a company do this if they didnt make a profit? they are getting the profit from somewhere....................
 
Funny you should mention Spar, my local Spar started stocking the low carb Adonis bars, they were by the till. Unfortunately the last time I went they were still by the till, but marked “reduced to clear”! :(
I bought some after (I think) you mentioned them. Really quite nice.
 
I stocked up while I was there! You can get them from Adonis direct or Amazon, 2g carbs per bar. I smuggle them into coffee shops where there is literally nothing I can eat, (looking at you Costa!)
Yes my feeling when I visit Costa (other coffee shops are available) - everything in here is poison.
 
I hate the American model too (most expensive system in the world but in the 10th position for health apparently). I am merely frustrated that what never gets talked about much is prevention and I am fairly worried that without serious changes to our Public Health programmes (like tackling the awful food environment) that we simply won't be able to afford to treat everyone and will end up with a 2 tier (private/public) system. After all its a pyramid scheme which only works if there are enough healthy people paying in. But if people get sicker younger and live longer unhealthy lives how can it be afforded? I voted for Blair in 97 because I thought more money into the NHS and education would solve problems but it didn't...Its a political 3rd rail but I'd definitely vote for a party that was honest about these realities.

I believe they did briefly get Health spending as a share of GDP up to the European average. They also stole some money from the Lottery for the NHS IIRC. Prevention must be a key part of health care.
 
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