Brown Pasta

I would avoid bread, rice, pasta and potatoes

rubyanne22 said:

Hello everybody.

I am a 29 year old diabetic. I have been diabetic for 28 years. My partner and I have decided to try for a baby, but my last hba1c was 8.3 so obviously I need to sort my diabetes out first.

I usually eat potatoes or white pasta for lunch.

I have found that my blood sugar before eating is between 5 and 8.
Two hours after eating it is between 8 and 10
Then 4 hours afterwards it is back to being between 5 and 9.

Today I ate a normal-sized plate of spaghetti, but it was brown spaghetti instead of my usual white pasta. I heard that this was better for diabetics. Three hours later I was 19!!

Why did I go so high? And is it normal for your bloodsugars to continue rising even 3 hours after eating, if you eat brown wholefoods? Why are they reputedly better for diabetics?

I am terrified of becoming pregnant because of freak bloodsugars like this.

Edit - Two days ago when I woke I was 6.5. I did 6 units of insulin for two slices of toast. 2 hours later I was 8.3
This morning my bloodsugar was again 6 when I woke up. I ate the exact same two slices of toast. 2 hours later I'm 15.
???

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You're eating a lot of carbs... I'm a T2, so I'm pretty much low-carb obsessed, but if you want to get a bit more control of your blood sugars, having less or no bread, pasta, rice potatoes etc would probably help you gain some more control, and maybe lower your basal and/or bolus insulin requirements. For a T2 like myself, colour of a carb doesn't really matter, a carb is a carb is a carb. And yeah, sometimes bloods will keep going up, even three or even four hours after a meal (Pizza's especially). Usually when it's a combo of a lot of carbs with a lot of fats.

I don't usually meddle in the affairs of T1's, but low carb for your particular situation might be beneficial to get enough control to be able to let go of pregnancy fears. Just don't hypo eh.

Good luck!
Jo

rubyanne22 said:

Hello everybody.

I am a 29 year old diabetic. I have been diabetic for 28 years. My partner and I have decided to try for a baby, but my last hba1c was 8.3 so obviously I need to sort my diabetes out first.

I usually eat potatoes or white pasta for lunch.

I have found that my blood sugar before eating is between 5 and 8.
Two hours after eating it is between 8 and 10
Then 4 hours afterwards it is back to being between 5 and 9.

Today I ate a normal-sized plate of spaghetti, but it was brown spaghetti instead of my usual white pasta. I heard that this was better for diabetics. Three hours later I was 19!!

Why did I go so high? And is it normal for your bloodsugars to continue rising even 3 hours after eating, if you eat brown wholefoods? Why are they reputedly better for diabetics?

I am terrified of becoming pregnant because of freak bloodsugars like this.

Edit - Two days ago when I woke I was 6.5. I did 6 units of insulin for two slices of toast. 2 hours later I was 8.3
This morning my bloodsugar was again 6 when I woke up. I ate the exact same two slices of toast. 2 hours later I'm 15.
???

Click to expand...

All too many carby things - try aiming at some low carb regime, and you'll see different results...LCHF, suggested...

Edited to put in a Welcome, to you @rubyanne22 , also

rubyanne22 said:

Thank you, everybody.

These responses were quite a surprise to me - especially "avoid bread, rice, pasta and potatoes".

I have never been advised to stay off carbohydrates - just to adapt my insulin to what I eat.
It makes a lot of sense, your advice, and I will definitely look into it.

I am quite slim, and also have a very high energy job (primary school teacher). I get very hungry. Throughout my life, I have eaten carbs with every meal, so a no-carb diet would be an enormous life change for me. I am a bit nervous of this, and also don't understand how you have any energy ?!
But I will read into it. Thanks again.

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I get most of my energy from fats and protein, as well as what I've got stored about my mid-section. Don't go very, very low carb, unless you're dead certain about what your insulin requirements are if you eat less carbs. And eat regularly, say, three main meals and three snacks, to keep your weight up to par.

Be careful about suddenly stopping carbs as you may need help reducing your meds to fit.
Many T2s are low carb, but there are low carb T1s here too.

Maybe try making a type 1 and low carb thread. They are here and can help explain it from a type 1 perspective. In brief The theory is the fewer carbs you eat the lower your spikes and the more you can reduce insulin and the smaller the amounts you use the less room for overshoot there is this reducing hypos. Many find they spend a great deal more time in target as a result and also get lower hb1ac.

I'm type 1 and eat rice and pasta, brown rice and wholemeal pasta at that without massive sugar spikes but I'd inject a second time around 90 mins after food, I also wash the rice/pasta in cold water when cooked and reheat it to serve as it seems to lessen spikes, I eat wholemeal bread too and my last hba1c was around 42 or 6%

I'm unsure of the rules but a cgm during for/pregnancy was being talked about pre coronavirus https://jdrf.org.uk/news/nhs-access...with-type-1-diabetes-due-to-begin-in-england/ so worth speaking to your diabetes clinic about.

Look, we’re all diabetics. And, as most of us are aware, we are not all the same. You eat a lot of carbs, but have been told that’s fine, and to adjust your insulin.
It’s not really. I’d suggest you get hold of the book by Dr Bernstein. He’s a diabetic himself and in his eighties. He’s got to that age by following a low carb, high fat diet. He has no complications after nearly 50 years of being a diabetic, so he must be doing something right!
Whatever you decide to do, you need to be doing it in conjunction with your diabetic team.
Don’t just suddenly decide to reduce carbs, because if you do you will almost certainly hypo.

As others have said you may find it helpful to reduce your carbohydrate intake, in parallel with reducing your bolus doses so that you avoid hypos. The smaller the carbs, the smaller the margin of error, less likely to spike. We are all different and the carbs that cause issues for you would not necessarily be the same for anyone else, so there is an element of trial and error. Brown rice is fine for me, but sticky white rice? Insane spikes.

If you are planning to conceive, talk to your medical team - you need to be on a higher dose of folic acid ideally 3 months before conception. You may also qualify for a Libre which will help you to see any patterns and help to make the right adjustments.

We, as Humans don't need massive amounts of carbohydrates, but the shops make a big profit on them, they are easy to store and as everyone is advised to eat them they are a real money spinner.
It looks as though, from your numbers, that the amount of carbs you eat on the regime you are following, the insulin is being overwhelmed. Not that I'm any sort of expert, but maybe if you were to reduce your intake of high carb foods a little each week, swap the grains for lower carb veges, salads and stirfries, maybe roasted too, equivalent to maybe 10 gm of carbs reduced - gradually so you can see how your numbers change, you'd be lowering the after meal spikes, which is what to avoid. This might mean having one and a half slices of bread, but adding in an egg or two to eat with it, or have bacon sandwiches - if you see how much carb there is in two slices of your bread it should be easy to adjust, or have cauliflower instead of half the potatoes you'd have for dinner. I get frozen cauliflower so it is quick and easy to cook.
If you are avoiding fats at the moment then changing to a full fat version of - for instance, yoghurt, that will boost your energy intake, but high fat and high carb together are not the best option.
Once you adapt to fewer carbs you should find more energy as running on fats is good, and it is more nourishing to eat meat or fish, eggs and cheese, so much so I only need to eat a very small amount first thing, and have a small meal in the evenings now we are in lockdown. Steak and then strawberries might be an odd combination, but it works for me as a type two.
Hopefully there will be a type one who eats a lower than usual amount of carbs to advise, as there are some on the forum I am sure. They claim to have far more stable BG levels and lower Hba1cs due to the way they eat, which is entirely logical (raising one eyebrow here, like Mr Spock).

There are a series of (NICE approved) infographics published by Dr David Unwin and the Public Health Collaboration. A new one was released this morning comparing white and brown foods. I’m attaching it here (apologies it’s a screenshot from a video presentation so slightly wonky):

Oh yess - a winner!!!!
I think we all need to cut back the carbs - I used to work for Allied Lyons and I know how they think - the things which go off fastest, the meat fish berries fresh veges, egges and cheese have shorter shelf lives - they are the things we ought to be eating - even growing in the garden, but that would not suit the shops.

rubyanne22 said:

Thank you, everybody.

These responses were quite a surprise to me - especially "avoid bread, rice, pasta and potatoes".

I have never been advised to stay off carbohydrates - just to adapt my insulin to what I eat.
It makes a lot of sense, your advice, and I will definitely look into it.

I am quite slim, and also have a very high energy job (primary school teacher). I get very hungry. Throughout my life, I have eaten carbs with every meal, so a no-carb diet would be an enormous life change for me. I am a bit nervous of this, and also don't understand how you have any energy ?!
But I will read into it. Thanks again.

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I am a type 1 and pre lockdown had a active job too as a trainer who can't drive so cycles everywhere!
I was nervous about cutting down on my beloved carbs too but did so 1 day and 1 meal at a time rather than all at once.
Once I realised carbs are not necessary and don't provide much nutrition beyond the glucose they turn into, this has encouraged me to eat more things which are e.g. meat, fish, eggs, cheese. We are in carb centric culture so it isn't easy but you might find that it s worth it to get a smoother ride with your blood sugars! Do not expect to get any help from the NHS though!!

Im type 1 and eat things like bread, pasta and rice, it can be done while still keeping your levels under control, even non diabetics will get spikes after eating
Cutting out all or most carbs is often recommended for type 2's but for a type 1 it can actually be dangerous leading to more hypo's, have you been on the DAFNE course? it teaches you that you can still eat a normal diet, one thing i would recommend is splitting your insulin doses as @kev-w suggested
I do quite a lot of cycling and being active often means i dont need to take any insulin

edit: if the freestlye libre is available to you, id go for that, it'll give you a better understanding of how some foods affect you rather than just doing finger pricks

We do understand that type 1 is different - we were reacting to the spike of 19 after eating, more than anything. That can't really be argued with, it is not good to be going so high, and finding some way to avoid it - by avoiding the really high carb potion seems to have turned things around, but of course it is early days. It is, though a simple way to cope and must be such a relief if pregnancy is a possibility.

rubyanne22 said:

Hello everybody.

I am a 29 year old diabetic. I have been diabetic for 28 years. My partner and I have decided to try for a baby, but my last hba1c was 8.3 so obviously I need to sort my diabetes out first.

I usually eat potatoes or white pasta for lunch.

I have found that my blood sugar before eating is between 5 and 8.
Two hours after eating it is between 8 and 10
Then 4 hours afterwards it is back to being between 5 and 9.

Today I ate a normal-sized plate of spaghetti, but it was brown spaghetti instead of my usual white pasta. I heard that this was better for diabetics. Three hours later I was 19!!

Why did I go so high? And is it normal for your bloodsugars to continue rising even 3 hours after eating, if you eat brown wholefoods? Why are they reputedly better for diabetics?

I am terrified of becoming pregnant because of freak bloodsugars like this.

Edit - Two days ago when I woke I was 6.5. I did 6 units of insulin for two slices of toast. 2 hours later I was 8.3
This morning my bloodsugar was again 6 when I woke up. I ate the exact same two slices of toast. 2 hours later I'm 15.
???

Click to expand...

It looks like you are giving too much bolus insulin. A slice of bread has roughly 15g of carbs so 2 slices would make 30g. Most adults use a 1:10 ratio when giving bolus, why do you use a 1:5 ratio? Are you more insulin resistant due to an illness, stress or anything else straining the body?

I cannot judge how much insulin you should give because I don’t have the exact data of how many carbs in those two slices but I would’ve given myself 3 units of NovoRapid assuming it was 30g of carbs in total. You might be giving too much bolus causing your body to go hypo and your liver dumping glucose back into the blood.

Whole meal foods should cause a more subdued peak because the extra fibre which causes slower digestion and thus increasing your BG at a slower rate.

You should ideally reduce your carb intake because the more carbs you have the more difficult it is to control BG and also experiment with different carbs because a lot of T1 diabetics also have coeliac disease or at least some form of gluten sensitivity which may affect your blood sugars.

My advice would be:

1) Go gluten-free for 3 days and record all your BG levels to see if they are much better

2) If that doesn’t work speak to your dietitian because you may be giving incorrect amounts of bolus and/or your basal may be too low

3) Reduce your carbs. We are type 1 diabetics, we shouldn’t really be eating so many carbs. I’m surprised that you eat normal white bread and pasta. Even before I was diagnosed with diabetes my family also had wholewheat. Change the carbs you eat, opt for rye bread, replace spaghetti with courgetti, replace a pizza base with a cauliflower base. You have the potential to make very delicious meals that are diabetes-friendly

CelalDari said:

It looks like you are giving too much bolus insulin. A slice of bread has roughly 15g of carbs so 2 slices would make 30g. Most adults use a 1:10 ratio when giving bolus, why do you use a 1:5 ratio?

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Whilst most people may start on 1 unit per 10 carbs that doesn't mean most stay on that ratio. Everyone is different, heck people are different at different times of the day, a carb counting course I went on 2 years ago the ratios ranged from 1:2 all the way to 1:50, there isn't really a 'normal' ratio.

CelalDari said:

I cannot judge how much insulin you should give because I don’t have the exact data of how many carbs in those two slices but I would’ve given myself 3 units of NovoRapid assuming it was 30g of carbs in total.

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And for me that would leave me sky high

CelalDari said:

1) Go gluten-free for 3 days and record all your BG levels to see if they are much better

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Whilst some T1's do also have gluten intolerance, you shouldn't really do a gluten-free diet if you don't need to - for a start it's more expensive and its not healthier for the general person! GF stuff to replace normal gluten-y type stuff also tends to be carb heavier whilst you're at it.
If the the OP think that gluten-intolerance may be in there, or other gluten-issues it may well be worth a try but otherwise myself I wouldn't try it.

CelalDari said:

3) Reduce your carbs. We are type 1 diabetics, we shouldn’t really be eating so many carbs. I’m surprised that you eat normal white bread and pasta.

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Whilst quite a few may well find reduced carbs makes their T1 easier to use. it is not essential to many others.
I used to eat normal bread and pasts quite happily - until I found out I'm gluten-intolerant at which point I had not choice but to use GF versions (but it can be carb heavier anyway). My carb intake is lower than it used to be but thats just cos I'm getting older and having to watch the weight now (for the first time ever).