Can insulin be formed again in type 1 diabetes

brehmen

Member
Messages
14
Type of diabetes
Type 1
Treatment type
Insulin
Hello
I am a type1 diabetes ;a 17 years old I just wanted to know that could insulin be produced again .actually in my body there is no production of insulin from my pancreas .I am told to use insulin ;I am taking 15 units twice of mixed insulin
 
  • Like
Reactions: Freema

haanstra76

Member
Messages
10
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Treatment type
Insulin
Hello
I am a type1 diabetes ;a 17 years old I just wanted to know that could insulin be produced again .actually in my body there is no production of insulin from my pancreas .I am told to use insulin ;I am taking 15 units twice of mixed insulin
No thans not posible once its damage it stays That way,they are experimenting with transplantatiom but right now not posible
 
  • Like
Reactions: Freema

brehmen

Member
Messages
14
Type of diabetes
Type 1
Treatment type
Insulin
Ok but then like can the units be decreased as I am taking 30 units of mixed insulin a day
 

brehmen

Member
Messages
14
Type of diabetes
Type 1
Treatment type
Insulin
And according how much amount of insulin likely required if the sugar levels are normally
 

haanstra76

Member
Messages
10
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Treatment type
Insulin
Hard to tellen its different for each person but if you keep to your diet and keep active maby you need lessen insuline
But it depent on so many things
 
  • Like
Reactions: B583

GrantGam

Well-Known Member
Messages
2,603
Type of diabetes
Type 1
Treatment type
Insulin
Hello
I am a type1 diabetes ;a 17 years old I just wanted to know that could insulin be produced again .actually in my body there is no production of insulin from my pancreas .I am told to use insulin ;I am taking 15 units twice of mixed insulin
No. Type 1 diabetes is a chronic lifelong condition; and as of yet; there is no known cure.
Ok but then like can the units be decreased as I am taking 30 units of mixed insulin a day
Why would you want to decrease your dose? The only thing that matters is whether the dose is correct for you, keeps your BG steady and within range.
And according how much amount of insulin likely required if the sugar levels are normally
I'm struggling to make sense of this one, but if you're asking 'how much insulin is required for optimal BG control?' then again, that amount is entirely individual depending on so many factors that it's not even worth listing them.
 

Hoping4Cure

BANNED
Messages
204
Type of diabetes
Type 1
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: kokhongw and Freema

Daibell

Master
Messages
12,642
Type of diabetes
LADA
Treatment type
Insulin
This thread makes my head hurt.

The answer is Yes.

"In summary, results revealed that 1) the ultrasensitive assay, which dramatically improved detection at low C-peptide ranges, found that 10% of patients with disease duration of three to four decades still produced C-peptide"

Source:

http://www.faustmanlab.org/docs/academic/Diabetes Care_March 2012_CPeptide_Faustman et al.pdf
Hi. Yes, it's a mis-understanding that T1s have NO insulin production. Many, I gather, may have some but not enough without added insulin but c-peptide shows it.
 

Daibell

Master
Messages
12,642
Type of diabetes
LADA
Treatment type
Insulin
Hello
I am a type1 diabetes ;a 17 years old I just wanted to know that could insulin be produced again .actually in my body there is no production of insulin from my pancreas .I am told to use insulin ;I am taking 15 units twice of mixed insulin
Hi. Do you find you have quite good blood sugar control from the two injections? If you feel you need better control then do consider the Basal/Bolus insulin regime which most T1s have. It does involve 4 to 5 injections a day which is the penalty but better control at each meal is the plus. Discuss with the nurse if necessary.
 

GrantGam

Well-Known Member
Messages
2,603
Type of diabetes
Type 1
Treatment type
Insulin
This thread makes my head hurt.

The answer is Yes.

"In summary, results revealed that 1) the ultrasensitive assay, which dramatically improved detection at low C-peptide ranges, found that 10% of patients with disease duration of three to four decades still produced C-peptide"

Source:

http://www.faustmanlab.org/docs/academic/Diabetes Care_March 2012_CPeptide_Faustman et al.pdf
The OP has said that he/she has "no insulin production" - see the initial post. To then ask whether "insulin could be produced again" would imply that the pancreas can REGAIN functionality, which we both know is virtually impossible.

So in short, the answer to the OP's question about "producing insulin again" is no. Providing that there has been proper testing to confirm that he/she actually has no insulin production. Your study is with relation to remaining pancreatic functionality post diagnosis, not beta cell regeneration which is how I interpret the OP's question.
 
  • Like
Reactions: emmay and JamesC1

GrantGam

Well-Known Member
Messages
2,603
Type of diabetes
Type 1
Treatment type
Insulin
Hi. Yes, it's a mis-understanding that T1s have NO insulin production. Many, I gather, may have some but not enough without added insulin but c-peptide shows it.
@Daibell, the OP has asked whether he/she can produce insulin 'again' and has also stated that he/she has 'no production of insulin'.

Some T1's may produce very small quantities of insulin, but it's not possible (as far as we scientifically know) for the pancreas to produce insulin 'again' when it's host has T1D and has previously been confirmed as having no insulin production.
 

Hoping4Cure

BANNED
Messages
204
Type of diabetes
Type 1
To then ask whether "insulin could be produced again" would imply that the pancreas can REGAIN functionality, which we both know is virtually impossible.

Incorrect. You're asserting things which are simply untrue. You have no evidence on which to base this assertion, and there is plenty of evidence that the opposite is true.

Do you know what neogenesis is? Hint: it happens in every human being's body, continuously. Otherwise we could not live. Beta cells included. They continuously grow and replicate, then are killed off for the most part, but if you reduce or halt auto-immunity beta cells will grow back on their own.

My own c-peptide levels have risen in the past two years, so yes, you're absolutely wrong.

Please, don't make confident assertions that regenerating beta cells or reversing type 1 diabetes is "virtually impossible", because that's not what the current research shows. You're going by ideas from the 90s that once beta cells are destroyed there are none coming back to take their place, whereas this would preclude c-peptide levels rising.

I had undetectable levels of c-peptide back in 2011 and now have 0.107 nmol / L (last I checked). That's 0.33 ng/ml if I remember the converted value correctly. Nearly a third of what a non-diabetic's fasting c-peptides are, on average. That's not nothing, and a big improvement over my previous undetectable levels.

Please, don't spread unsubstantiated opinion as fact, or blatant falsehoods.

There are several type 1 diabetics besides myself who have managed to increase their c-peptide levels significantly, at least temporarily. Yes, many of us saw rises and then lowering, but the fact that we've seen rises in lab-verified c-peptide tests, is incontrovertible proof that what you're asserting is false.

https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/curetype1/-Q8CeZbDqpk[1-25]

Unless you think several people falsified lab test results from different labs and hospitals in order to trick you?

If you boost c-peptide levels, however that may occur, you've boosted functional beta cells which produce insulin in response to elevated blood sugar. That means mature beta cells can not only survive but replicate and regenerate.

Read this to educate yourself about the lifespan of cells:

https://www.medicalsciencenavigator.com/physiology-of-self-renewal/

"Only a few body parts last most of your lifetime. They are the neurons of the cerebral cortex, the inner lens cells of the eye, and muscle cells of the heart."

Ask yourself this simple question: if functional beta cells are often found in the pancreases of deceased type 1 diabetics who've lived many decades, and nearly all body cell types die off to be recycled and then renewed, what does that imply?

It implies that the beta cells which are found during autopsy weren't created prior to type 1 diagnosis, but rather are recently replicated and/or regenerated. This is just common sense.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: CHIET1

GrantGam

Well-Known Member
Messages
2,603
Type of diabetes
Type 1
Treatment type
Insulin
Incorrect. You're asserting things which are simply untrue. You have no evidence on which to base this assertion, and there is plenty of evidence that the opposite is true.

Do you know what neogenesis is? Hint: it happens in every human being's body, continuously. Otherwise we could not live. Beta cells included. They continuously grow and replicate, then are killed off for the most part, but if you reduce or halt auto-immunity beta cells will grow back on their own.

My own c-peptide levels have risen in the past two years, so yes, you're absolutely wrong.

Please, don't make confident assertions that regenerating beta cells or reversing type 1 diabetes is "virtually impossible", because that's not what the current research shows. You're going by ideas from the 90s that once beta cells are destroyed there are none coming back to take their place, whereas this would preclude c-peptide levels rising.

I had undetectable levels of c-peptide back in 2011 and now have 0.107 nmol / L (last I checked). That's 0.33 ng/ml if I remember the converted value correctly. Nearly a third of what a non-diabetic's fasting c-peptides are, on average. That's not nothing, and a big improvement over my previous undetectable levels.

Please, don't spread unsubstantiated opinion as fact, or blatant falsehoods.

There are several type 1 diabetics besides myself who have managed to increase their c-peptide levels significantly, at least temporarily. Yes, many of us saw rises and then lowering, but the fact that we've seen rises in lab-verified c-peptide tests, is incontrovertible proof that what you're asserting is false.

https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/curetype1/-Q8CeZbDqpk[1-25]

Unless you think several people falsified lab test results from different labs and hospitals in order to trick you?

If you boost c-peptide levels, however that may occur, you've boosted functional beta cells which produce insulin in response to elevated blood sugar. That means mature beta cells can not only survive but replicate and regenerate.

Read this to educate yourself about the lifespan of cells:

https://www.medicalsciencenavigator.com/physiology-of-self-renewal/

"Only a few body parts last most of your lifetime. They are the neurons of the cerebral cortex, the inner lens cells of the eye, and muscle cells of the heart."

Ask yourself this simple question: if functional beta cells are often found in the pancreases of deceased type 1 diabetics who've lived many decades, and nearly all body cell types die off to be recycled and then renewed, what does that imply?

It implies that the beta cells which are found during autopsy weren't created prior to type 1 diagnosis, but rather are recently replicated and/or regenerated. This is just common sense.
Many thanks for the lengthy and belittling reply @Hoping4Cure; it's much appreciated...

Just so you know, I was taking the OP's query regarding the 'production of insulin again' as a permanent and substantial change; not a negligible and fluctuating variance. I'd imagine that there can be considerable accuracy issues with C-peptide testing as well.

You appear to have largely misinterpreted my post however; as I still believe that the pancreas cannot regain functionality (and we're talking non-negligable amounts here) when a T1D. You mentioned "halting auto-immunity" and if that were to occur, the beta cells would stop being wiped out. I fully agree. But as T1's, that auto-immune response can't be halted (because we don't know how) and that's where the problem lies; cells are made and then killed off. So because of that, there's not going to be any pancreatic functionality (regarding insulin production) that's really worth mentioning.

I never once said that reversing type 1 diabetes is virtually impossible; you're misquoting me entirely there. I'm sure T1 can be reversed - but as of yet, no-one knows how. The auto-immune response needs to be addressed and it's yet to be entirely understood.

What is virtually impossible though, is someone with T1D to suddenly produce sufficient amounts of insulin again. I've only heard of one British man to date (fairly recently actually), but as far as I know - there have been no conclusive answers as to why this happened.

Please don't attempt to belittle me again in the future @Hoping4Cure.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: JamesC1

raun01

Active Member
Messages
31
At the moment its not possible, but in future this might be there are lot of studies and research going on. There is no need to change in dosage, its already working well in maintaining blood glucose well.
 

Hoping4Cure

BANNED
Messages
204
Type of diabetes
Type 1
To date, no one has achieved 100% restored beta cell functionality, at least not without corroborating evidence. We're all awaiting the results of Dan Darkes, for instance, to see whether his 100% restoration is a hoax.

But 100% perfect restoration is not necessary for clinical significance. Even minor increases in c-peptide have drastic effects on health, increased alpha beta cell signalling resulting in reduced hypos, etc, nor what he wrote.

He said it's "virtually impossible" for the "pancreas to regain functionality", which, when one knows how to properly read and parse sentences in the English language, is simply untrue.

"regain functionality" != "regain full functionality"

Without the qualifier "full", his statements are false, period.

I have no sympathy for people making stuff up, passing it off as gospel truth (confident statements made without evidence, or ignoring contrary evidence, or appealing to ignorance or making faulty generalizations), then whining about the record being set straight and mis-attributing what they themselves wrote in order to make themselves look better. Even a single case of a type 1 diabetic's c-peptide levels rising at any point, and for any duration, and for any magnitude is sufficient to discredit this.

Don't make stuff up.

Quoting his responses verbatim:

"To then ask whether "insulin could be produced again" would imply that the pancreas can REGAIN functionality, which we both know is virtually impossible."

INCORRECT.

I have achieved this, two years ago. I have regained partial functionality, briefly, which qualifies as "regaining functionality". 100% restoration is not necessary. Permanent restoration either.

Because...Logic.

If one can restore even partial insulin production, even for only a brief period of time, that is sufficient to invalidate his claim of "impossibility". Do I need to break out a dictionary here? Seriously. Clearly, something that has happened, in several cases is therefore NOT impossible.

"I just wanted to know that could insulin be produced again"

To which he answered:

"No."

INCORRECT.

Don't make broad, sweeping, inaccurate statements and then complain when people call you out on it. We're all adults here. If I say something incorrect and there's contrary evidence out there (there are LITERALLY dozens of scientific studies showing c-peptide levels rising, in humans, for various reasons).
 
Last edited:

tim2000s

Expert
Retired Moderator
Messages
8,934
Type of diabetes
Type 1
Treatment type
Other
@GrantGam @Hoping4Cure - please calm it down and act cordially towards each other, with the intention of answering the OP''s question in a clear and intelligible manner. Thanks.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Type1Bri

GrantGam

Well-Known Member
Messages
2,603
Type of diabetes
Type 1
Treatment type
Insulin
To date, no one has achieved 100% restored beta cell functionality, at least not without corroborating evidence.

But that's not necessary for clinical significance (even minor increases in c-peptides have drastic effects on health, increased alpha beta cell signalling resulting in reduced hypos, etc), nor what he wrote.

He said it's "virtually impossible" for the "pancreas to regain functionality", which, when one knows how to properly read and parse sentences in the English language, is patently untrue.

"regain functionality" != "regain full functionality"

Without the qualifier "full", his statements are false, period.

I have no sympathy for people making stuff up, passing it off as gospel truth (confident statements made without evidence), then whining about the record being set straight and mis-attributing what they themselves wrote in order to make themselves look better.

Don't make stuff up.

Quoting his responses verbatim:

"To then ask whether "insulin could be produced again" would imply that the pancreas can REGAIN functionality, which we both know is virtually impossible."

INCORRECT.

I have achieved this, two years ago. I have regained partial functionality, which qualifies as "regaining functionality". 100% restoration is not necessary. Permanent restoration either. Because...Logic. If you could even restore even partial insulin production, even for only a brief period of time, that is sufficient to invalidate his claim of impossibility. Do I need to break out a dictionary here? Seriously.

"I just wanted to know that could insulin be produced again"

To which he answered:

"No."

INCORRECT.
@Hoping4Cure, just because I missed out the adjective "full" does not give you the right to speak to me the way you are. Your tone is bordering on aggressive and I will not tolerate that.

Enjoy the rest of your day.
 

Hoping4Cure

BANNED
Messages
204
Type of diabetes
Type 1
I don't enjoy reading people saying my gains are impossible, without even bothering to check out the proof. That's lazy and totally on you, guy.

Besides, you don't even have to believe any of the c-peptide test results shared on my blog, there are numerous scientific studies showing temporary if minute increases in c-peptide levels, including Faustman's BCG trials. You know, the one done at Harvard.

I'll take Harvard's word for whether c-peptides can be induced to rise, over what someone on a forum says.
 

Hoping4Cure

BANNED
Messages
204
Type of diabetes
Type 1
Before this goes any further:

https://openi.nlm.nih.gov/detailedresult.php?img=PMC3414482_pone.0041756.g008&req=4

pone-0041756-g008: Fasting C-peptide levels show transient increase in BCG-treated and EBV-infected clinical trial subjects.Fasting C-peptide for (A) BCG-treated, (B) Placebo-treated, and (C) EBV-infected clinical trial subjects by week vs. (D) Reference diabetics, by visit. C-peptide levels are measured by ultrasensitive C-peptide assay in duplicate. Arrows are BCG or placebo injection times.

Any small, even transient increase in c-peptides rising, due to a drug, is enough to prove that indeed, it's not only possible to restore (partial) pancreatic functionality but has been done. The gas tank doesn't have to be full for it to not be empty, or possible to fill partially. Again, logic!

If we're going to allow false claims on this website with the expectation to not have them challenged, I'm not sure what value this forum is. Is this an "alternative facts" zone?

To be clear, even a tiny bit of increased c-peptide levels has drastic significance for type 1 diabetics, as functional beta cells signal to alpha cells, in the presence of low blood sugar, to release glucagon into the blood stream. Hypoglycemia is life-threatening, scary, and a constant nuisance. Being even slightly protected from them is a HUGE benefit. My hypo frequency has dropped significantly. I used to get them practically every day, and they were very bad.
 
Last edited:

tim2000s

Expert
Retired Moderator
Messages
8,934
Type of diabetes
Type 1
Treatment type
Other
@Hoping4Cure You'll note that no-one is stopping challenge. What we are concerned about in discussions relating to differing opinions is that evidence is presented and that the tone of the discussion is not aggressive nor demeaning, hence the request that you both act cordially.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Type1Bri