Type 2 Carbs And The Doctor/dn

[ickihun]

As a retired NHS nurse I feel I have to respond to your post. I have extreme respect for anyone working in the NHS in these difficult times but I was astonished when I was diagnosed with type 2 that the NHS guidelines appear to be so wrong! i.e. eatwell plate and no need to test at home. I have never been rude about or towards my GP who is my main point of contact for my Diabetes care. At my first review I was too unsure of my personal success yet to ‘admit’ to low carbing but did mention I was self testing to see what foods suited me, he just said that I didn’t need to test. I think it was at my third review when my HbA1c was at a non diabetic level for the second time, that I ‘confessed’ to low carbing. Not only was my GP in agreement that low carbing worked but he also looked interestedly at my graphs etc on my blood glucose recording apps. acknowledging that self testing has been a useful tool for me. At my reviews since I always ‘remind’ him how I’m controlling my Diabetes and at my last appt. I left him with a copy of Dr Unwin’s paper about the success in his practice of advising low carbing to his type 2s. I’m considering joining the PPG of my surgery to see if I can persue helping the staff and patients with this ‘different’ and in my view very successful approach. I can’t stand by and ignore my memories of nursing diabetic patients with unhealing ulcers, gangrenous feet, failing kidneys and eyesight, because of uncontrolled blood sugar levels.
So in answer to your question “Who the hell do you think you are?” I’m a patient yes, but a patient working in partnership with my GP, he arranges my blood tests and reviews the results with me. He prescribes my medication but we are both involved in discussing any alterations. Ultimately I’m responsible for my health but he is there to assist me so I will have my time in the surgery even though I don’t follow the NHS guidelines, I’m as entitled as anyone to that time.

I thought you might. Great news!

 

[ickihun]

I have spent quite a bit of time with my aged mother and the NHS recently... I am afraid the experience was not particularly rewarding for her or me. We have now reduced her daily pills from 6 to 2. Her early onset dementia has miraculously cured itself ( strangely since we stopped the statins). When she was admitted to hospital after a fall she was found to have dangerously low blood pressure even though she had been on blood pressure lowering meds for years. They have now been stopped as well.
Whilst it may be underfunded it is unfortunately also the epitome of inefficiency and waste. How many times does a blood test need to be done when transferring between hospitals? Don't they believe each other?

Er nope! Why would they? They wouldn't take on another's mistake. Mistakes do happen. Not sure of statistics but they're definitely there.
Sad but true.
I don't trust any geriatric care, from anyone. I've seen too much neglect. They see an old person and like for me, they see the fat person... and make assumptions. All care givers not just nhs.

 

[Rachox]

I thought you might. Great news!

Thanks for your kind comment, but which bit of my rather lengthy response are you referring to?!

 

[ickihun]

Seeing that we are all adults then.... we make our own choices.
This forum is passionate about encouraging prevention. Prevention of unnecessary blindness, amputations and circular disorders from too high a hba1c.
Yes many support low carb because it works.

 

[ickihun]

Thanks for your kind comment, but which bit of my rather lengthy response are you referring to?!

You getting or hoping to get involved more in diabetes at GP practice level.

 

[bulkbiker]

Sorry to hear your family's experience hasn't been good but there are 100 times more good experiences than bad across the service

I'm sorry but anecdotally from people I have met recently I do not think is the case at all.
Yes for acute problems the NHS is great. I would not want to be anywhere else with a broken leg. But (and I'm afraid it is a big but) for the most part treatment of chronic conditions is going downhill. Far too much prescription before looking at nutrition and lifestyle and I think a lot of it is down to ignorance and a lack of curiosity from the majority of HCP's. There will always be notable exceptions but I fear that they are becoming exactly that "exceptions" rather than the norm.

 

[KK123]

KK123 - Things may be different for you, but as T2s, many see their way of eating (ideally alongside blood sugar testing) as their treatment, so it is, in my view, fair that the medics enquire how the treatment is going. Very, very few T2s are seen in specialist clinics.

DCUK, Yes of course, I do understand and I was only referring to those who have 'good results' being harassed by Doctors. I am asked every single time what I have been eating and I really feel like saying mind your own business when they can see my levels are fine.

 

[KK123]

Reading your comments in this thread and some others I get really angry. The number of disparaging remarks about your doctors and nurses is astonishing. Talking about educating them?!?!? Who the hell do you think you are? If you are so sure of your ways, why are you going to your doctor, nurse, etc. Go and treat yourselves and don't waste the professionals time which could be spent on other patients.
This forum has turned to a forum for low carbing. And in my experience if you dare to express different opinion, they jump on you and make you feel tiny. Well No. I'm a nurse and I completely support the nurses, dieticians and doctors who are helping me. They try their best and their advice helps me live as normally as possible. So I control the diabetes, not it me! They help me live with minimal restrictions and feel good. And they are succeeding. My sugars are normalising, I feel better and feel human again.
So go on, make your choices. Either you treat yourselves or let professionals do it.

Sani, I have to say that your comment 'Who the hell do you think you are' says it all about the attitude of SOME medical staff. Are you saying how dare a patient have opinions on how to treat their own condition? We have to go to them for medication and yes, in the main we have a great NHS. One thing that I get really angry at is this 'We are the medical experts and we will spout from the NICE guidelines no matter what' attitude and get cross if you dare to question it'. Take statins as one example.

 

[Mr_Pot]

Since stopping the Atorvastatin I have had to relearn all my songs, and I have not played my guitar at all,

Are you saying that statins help with musical ability, that is a little known benefit.

 

[becca59]

There are good, bad and mediocre professionals in all walks of life. I have seen all types in my NHS dealings over my nearly 59 years. I never accept anything I’m not happy about without questioning. I do bags of research on all aspects concerning myself. However, I am always polite and respectful and get that back.
The last shock I had was the GP I saw for my Libre reaction rash. He had never heard of the Libre. Worrying, but he was exceedingly interested.

 

[Guzzler]

DCUK, Yes of course, I do understand and I was only referring to those who have 'good results' being harassed by Doctors. I am asked every single time what I have been eating and I really feel like saying mind your own business when they can see my levels are fine.

The thing is, if a patient follows the NHS pathway and fails then they are harangued at times and we hear of many, many examples from members saying that their HCPs doubt the effort that they (the patient) put into following the advice with little or no improvement. If a patient chooses to take a different path and gets improved numbers they are sometimes harangued because in the opinion of a particular medic the changes made are 'dangerous' and anything other than the accepted chronic pathway must therefore be wrong. Sometimes patients must feel that whatever they do they just can't win.
Before I was diagnosed the last time a nurse expected me to 'do as I was told' was after the birth of my third child. I left her in no doubt as to who was ultimately responsible for my personal health.

 

[Petaluk]

I have a question, a bit off subject,
Would ‘anyone’ eventually get diabetes if they consumed a large amount of carbohydrates daily throughout their life?

 

[DCUKMod]

DCUK, Yes of course, I do understand and I was only referring to those who have 'good results' being harassed by Doctors. I am asked every single time what I have been eating and I really feel like saying mind your own business when they can see my levels are fine.

But surely, asking those who are "getting it right" is at least as important as those who are having issues? Isn't that how they pick up ad-hoc, on the job learning?

Of course, I'm not T1, so any challenges I have faces are likely to e quite different to your own, but I have found that if I take a relaxed view of things my GP will often ask interested questions and have an adult dialogue about the challenges face from both sides of the desk.

My working life started in a professional, clinical environment, but I realised at around the 10 year point that if I stayed there it would be harmful to my well-being, so left. I wouldn't car to be a GP in these days. Their clinical workload is significant, then there's the paperwork and CPD to keep on track with.

Does my GP have the time to research my condition in the depth I have? Certainly not, so why would I not be willing to share some of what I have learned along the way, in order to be in danger of helping others and maybe broadening her understanding.

I feel I have the respect of my GP and I respect her for the candid conversation we have, when required. She wants to do her best for her patients, but frankly, sometimes she's right up against it.

Please don't think I think she's perfect, she isn't but for now, it works OK for me.

 

[bulkbiker]

I have a question, a bit off subject,
Would ‘anyone’ eventually get diabetes if they consumed a large amount of carbohydrates daily throughout their life?

I would have to say (as with everything) it depends...
Although I would imagine the likelihood must increase over time.
Some people seem to be able to cope with a high carb diet (maybe their pancreas is up to producing all that extra insulin and mine got a bit knackered). Maybe people's tolerances are higher. A fasting insulin test might show the chances of developing it but that seems an unlikely thing to happen.

 

[britishpub]

I have a question, a bit off subject,
Would ‘anyone’ eventually get diabetes if they consumed a large amount of carbohydrates daily throughout their life?

I would think the answer to that is no.

T2D is a highly complex disease, and caused by a huge number of things, one of which may be due to having high levels of circulating insulin for a long period.

However there are a lot of people who consume a large amount of Carbohydrate daily who do not get T2D or any other similar disease, and remain perfectly healthy.

 

[ickihun]

I have a question, a bit off subject,
Would ‘anyone’ eventually get diabetes if they consumed a large amount of carbohydrates daily throughout their life?

Its hearsay.
Do you know someone who has eaten large amount of carbs daily throughout their life..... Without burning it off? For example moving, walking, dancing or housework?
Most people I know who have mobility problems watch their diet too.

Calories not burned off adds fat and muscle.
Fat not burned off can in a high carby diet add weight.
Excess body weight causes type 2. Excess body weight for your frame and genes.
Always be ideal body weight with no internal fat then diabetes SHOULD stay away. Fat around organs, especially pancreas or fatty liver causes type2.

 

[britishpub]

Who the hell do you think you are?

Whilst I can agree with your sentiments that HCP's shouldn't be ridiculed or disparaged, and also that anyone who thinks that they have superior knowledge is probably kidding themselves, this is an open forum for debate, exchange of knowledge and information and support. As long as the debate is conducted sensibly and fairly people must be allowed to express their own opinions, and shouldn't have to justify those opinions to anyone.

 

[Wendy18480]

Loving this thread, I'm off for my first visit to the DN after being diagnosed at the end of January. I'm terrified, she is the nurse from hell.

I've done a lot of research, thanks mainly to this forum, I've tried different diets and I've decided low carb is the way for me.

I shall go tomorrow, smile sweetly, agree with everything she says then go my own way.

Thank you for giving me that confidence.

 

[zand]

My response to the 'you need carbs' comment has always been - 'Really? What for?'

I'll remember that for my review in November

 

[Merrylizard1314]

@zand They will probably say that the brain " needs" 138 g carbs every day for optimal function. This has been the catchcry at almost every T2D information session I have ever attended. And if you ask about the evidence for this, they haven't any.