Cheerio spikes on FreeStyle Libre, but not on BG monitor

[kitedoc]

So a mismatch of BSL rise and insulin BSL-lowering efficacy.

 

[Jaylee]

Roughly that kind of time line sometimes 5 hours.

Why?

Isn't cereal swimming in...

milk? I can treat a hypo with milk. & stay steady in the zone. However, around "that kind of time...."
Lactose & fat?

 

[becca59]

So a mismatch of BSL rise and insulin BSL-lowering efficacy.

Yep me too. Even with low carb. Wouldn’t have seen this without Libre. Only way to deal with it is split injections.
As regards difference in readings, my suggestion is that the rise is happening very quickly and putting the Libre into a bit of a flap. It doesn’t cope well with readings above 12. In this instance it is showing the immediate affect of the sugar making it swoop and then it gets confused. They become erratic before settling down more in line with blood readings. The chances are his blood levels also went up more before they were next tested, but dropped back into range before you saw them. This used to be the norm we saw before Libre, with testing before meals only.
This is why some Type 1 adults stop eating a lot of foods they previously loved. As your son is only six I can well understand his desire to eat Cheerios.

 

[Knikki]

Isn't cereal swimming in...

milk? I can treat a hypo with milk. & stay steady in the zone. However, around "that kind of time...."
Lactose & fat?

Yes it is, which is fine. Think long time ago I used to treat hypos with milk.

This is why some Type 1 adults stop eating a lot of foods they previously loved. As your son is only six I can well understand his desire to eat Cheerios.

Some of us didn't, however didn't like cheerios.

 

[kitedoc]

I assume there is other insulin which is long acting for overnight?
And when is the novorapid and long-acting insulin taken. Why the risk of hypo later?

 

[ringi]

Due to the Libre not measureing blood glocose directly, (it measures glocose in the liquid between cells) there is a delay in the readings it gives. Hence a spike on the Libre would show up on a BG meter something like 15 minutes early. The "direction of change" indicators can have a longer lag, as they are based on multiple readings.

Another factor is thst while blood glocose is changing fast the blood in different parts of the body will have a different BG level.

These high spikes are likely to be harmful and will be very hard to prevent without changing to a breakfast that contains more protein, for example eggs.

 

[Jaylee]

Due to the Libre not measureing blood glocose directly, (it measures glocose in the liquid between cells) there is a delay in the readings it gives. Hence a spike on the Libre would show up on a BG meter something like 15 minutes early. The "direction of change" indicators can have a longer lag, as they are based on multiple readings.

Another factor is thst while blood glocose is changing fast the blood in different parts of the body will have a different BG level.

These high spikes are likely to be harmful and will be very hard to prevent without changing to a breakfast that contains more protein, for example eggs.

@ringi , there are many factors that could cause a spike when bolusing for food. Timing, insulin absorption rate pending a particular injection site, the efectivnes of a certain batch of insulin, to name a few..
I've knocked my Libre or constricted it with many layers of clothing in the cold weather putting pressure on the unit, causing some strange results not tallying with my meter?

To draw an analogy; there are "bedroom musicians" & there are those actively experienced playing in a "band."
The "gig" was breakfast, the request was for Cheerios.

Though I love them myself.
The topic in this case does not merit throwing eggs at the stage.

 

[therower]

@Joesdad . Pleased to meet you. An interesting post which has led to some interesting replies.
This is how I see it.....feel free to ignore anything and everything I say.
First and foremost your son has got to be a 6 yr old little man and all that it entails. Fun, laughter, learning, carefree and normal like all his friends. Unfortunately and in some respect luckily he is also T1. With a sensible approach to incorporating diabetes in to his life he will thrive as a happy, clever, carefree but cautious and normal young boy. Plus , as a T1 a sensible diet we most likely make him far healthier than a lot of his friends, T1 will make him a far stronger individual in years to come.
Cheerios??????? If that’s what he wants and it’s what makes him happy then go for it. I personally love a bowl of the **** things, so moreish though. Stick to the RDA, it’s very easy to overload the bowl.
Point I really want to make though is this..........don’t become dependent on technology. When a lot of us older ones were diagnosed we didn’t have the techno stuff. We were in the dark and developed a gut feeling for things, we knew and still know the little signs which give a great indicator of our levels. I always second guess what my sugars are before I actually do a finger prick. Very seldom am I far off. I use a CGM and it’s a great device but I always go a week or so when it expires without a CGM purely to keep myself able to understand and listen to what my body is telling me.
I appreciate that your son would struggle with this and you wouldn’t be comfortable flying blind with such a precious cargo but in time I really would suggest you try going a few days without the libre and try looking for the other signs that give a marker of BS levels, personally I think it leads to a far greater feeling of being the master and controller of the beast.
As your post highlights the techno stuff isn’t perfect don’t become reliant on it. See it as a tool and remember you and your son are the craftsmen.
Sorry I’ve started waffling. Hopefully you get my drift.

Post edited for language by mod

 

[kitedoc]

@ringi , there are many factors that could cause a spike when bolusing for food. Timing, insulin absorption rate pending a particular injection site, the efectivnes of a certain batch of insulin, to name a few..
I've knocked my Libre or constricted it with many layers of clothing in the cold weather putting pressure on the unit, causing some strange results not tallying with my meter?

To draw an analogy; there are "bedroom musicians" & there are those actively experienced playing in a "band."
The "gig" was breakfast, the request was for Cheerios.

Though I love them myself.
The topic in this case does not merit throwing eggs at the stage.

It is not egg throwing. The processed cereals are deleterious for teeth, blood sugar etc. Protein from eggs for growth, little mild gradual effect on BSL no question.

 

[kitedoc]

In cautioning about cereals we now know more about the effect of processed food on health and the influences regarding it than in the past.
Cereals are not real food. They have vitamins added and their eating is prompted by false advertising.
Saying that it is OK to eat the stuff is forgetting that the pros and cons have been biased is irresponsible unless one had read up and fully 'digested' accurate, unbiased by advertising, info then that is not OK.
What a child needs and can tolerate is not the same as an adult - so saying that it is OK is not wise and in fact comes under giving inappropriate advice.

 

[Jaylee]

It is not egg throwing. The processed cereals are deleterious for teeth, blood sugar etc. Protein from eggs for growth, little mild gradual effect on BSL no question.

Our own preferences for eggs has no bearing on this thread.

Because he's 6 years old and wants Cheerios. We have insulin

@kitedoc . "Exhibit A."

 

[Joesdad]

@Joesdad . Pleased to meet you. An interesting post which has led to some interesting replies.
This is how I see it.....feel free to ignore anything and everything I say.
First and foremost your son has got to be a 6 yr old little man and all that it entails. Fun, laughter, learning, carefree and normal like all his friends. Unfortunately and in some respect luckily he is also T1. With a sensible approach to incorporating diabetes in to his life he will thrive as a happy, clever, carefree but cautious and normal young boy. Plus , as a T1 a sensible diet we most likely make him far healthier than a lot of his friends, T1 will make him a far stronger individual in years to come.
Cheerios??????? If that’s what he wants and it’s what makes him happy then go for it. I personally love a bowl of the **** things, so moreish though. Stick to the RDA, it’s very easy to overload the bowl.
Point I really want to make though is this..........don’t become dependent on technology. When a lot of us older ones were diagnosed we didn’t have the techno stuff. We were in the dark and developed a gut feeling for things, we knew and still know the little signs which give a great indicator of our levels. I always second guess what my sugars are before I actually do a finger prick. Very seldom am I far off. I use a CGM and it’s a great device but I always go a week or so when it expires without a CGM purely to keep myself able to understand and listen to what my body is telling me.
I appreciate that your son would struggle with this and you wouldn’t be comfortable flying blind with such a precious cargo but in time I really would suggest you try going a few days without the libre and try looking for the other signs that give a marker of BS levels, personally I think it leads to a far greater feeling of being the master and controller of the beast.
As your post highlights the techno stuff isn’t perfect don’t become reliant on it. See it as a tool and remember you and your son are the craftsmen.
Sorry I’ve started waffling. Hopefully you get my drift.

@therower Thank you very much for that advice. It's hugely appreciated.
Our diabetes team always tell us not to make him crazy and he can have whatever other 6 year olds have. Obviously in time this will change as he grows up and sees what's happening to his body.
Actually he is becoming sensitive to how he feels and we've asked him a few times what number do you think you are before scanning or pricking. Interestingly he only says a low number when it is actually on the lower end of the scale.
I'm going to read this again later when I can take it in properly.

 

[kitedoc]

Our own preferences for eggs has no bearing on this thread.



@kitedoc . "Exhibit A."

I refuse to be 'baited "!!!!!

 

[kitedoc]

@Joesdad . Pleased to meet you. An interesting post which has led to some interesting replies.
This is how I see it.....feel free to ignore anything and everything I say.
First and foremost your son has got to be a 6 yr old little man and all that it entails. Fun, laughter, learning, carefree and normal like all his friends. Unfortunately and in some respect luckily he is also T1. With a sensible approach to incorporating diabetes in to his life he will thrive as a happy, clever, carefree but cautious and normal young boy. Plus , as a T1 a sensible diet we most likely make him far healthier than a lot of his friends, T1 will make him a far stronger individual in years to come.
Cheerios??????? If that’s what he wants and it’s what makes him happy then go for it. I personally love a bowl of the **** things, so moreish though. Stick to the RDA, it’s very easy to overload the bowl.
Point I really want to make though is this..........don’t become dependent on technology. When a lot of us older ones were diagnosed we didn’t have the techno stuff. We were in the dark and developed a gut feeling for things, we knew and still know the little signs which give a great indicator of our levels. I always second guess what my sugars are before I actually do a finger prick. Very seldom am I far off. I use a CGM and it’s a great device but I always go a week or so when it expires without a CGM purely to keep myself able to understand and listen to what my body is telling me.
I appreciate that your son would struggle with this and you wouldn’t be comfortable flying blind with such a precious cargo but in time I really would suggest you try going a few days without the libre and try looking for the other signs that give a marker of BS levels, personally I think it leads to a far greater feeling of being the master and controller of the beast.
As your post highlights the techno stuff isn’t perfect don’t become reliant on it. See it as a tool and remember you and your son are the craftsmen.
Sorry I’ve started waffling. Hopefully you get my drift.

Post edited for language by mod

You are a prodigy @therower! I certainly cannot guess what my BSL is or how it is trending even with 52 years of trying.
But how safe is it for a child or parent of that child to try guessing ?? As brutal as the finger pricking may appear to be, using a meter which is say within +/- 5% is the safest option, is it not?? Who says Cheerios are part of a healthy diet!!

 

[Diakat]

Hi all,
Just to say that if a newly diagnosed kid wants Cheerios for breakfast I’m letting him have them - his world is already upside down without ruining breakfast.
No one asked about the health aspect of cereal so please stop derailment or else deletions will be necessary.
If there are valid responses regarding the technology aspect please continue.

 

[Listlad]

I just want to say to the OP @Joesdad that I appreciate the thread. I have a young 6 yo kid. Whilst she does not have diabetes I am still very interested in how a young person might deal with Diabetes and as a parent one might deal with it. (No derailment intended).

 

[therower]

You are a prodigy @therower! I certainly cannot guess what my BSL is or how it is trending even with 52 years of trying.
But how safe is it for a child or parent of that child to try guessing ?? As brutal as the finger pricking may appear to be, using a meter which is say within +/- 5% is the safest option, is it not?? Who says Cheerios are part of a healthy diet!!

Prodigy????? No.
Good at guessing??????? Maybe
Cheerio eater??????? Most definitely.