Bluetit1802
Legend
Have you done any research on Methotrexate? I have seen what it has done to two of my friends.
https://www.drugs.com/sfx/methotrexate-side-effects.html
https://www.drugs.com/sfx/methotrexate-side-effects.html
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Confused!!
- Thread starter Jackie0022
- Start Date
HSSS
Expert
Not crazy and I can understand the confusion on your part. In reality few of us type 2 get checked for which type we are. Assumptions are made and occasionally corrected later. So in a sense you’ve been lucky to get it confirmed one way or other at the beginning. Finding it all difficult to accept is also common, with or without the confusion. It passes in time so be kind to yourself. As for recommending metformin, that’s because it’s the first line (after diet) for most type 2 and others are only used of that isn’t producing the results desired or has side effects etc.
Jackie0022
Well-Known Member
I have done some research and have an app with the dermatologist July 5th so will know more then. What has it done to your friends? Good or bad things? I have only heard bad thing from people who have used it for arthritis
Bluetit1802
Legend
It has done "bad things" to my friends. It suppressed their immune systems, causing a lot of issues with infections, some serious. They were using it for arthritis, and were long time users of it.
Jackie0022
Well-Known Member
That’s what I’ve heard too, so sticking with the insulin gives me reassurance and comfort knowing that one of the diseases is under control. Is this wrong?
Then once I know how the methotrexate makes me feel, I’ll think about changing. But again this is something I need to speak to the GP about as unfortunately the dr hadn’t got any notes from dermatology. I know these are all questions I should have asked the diabetic doctor but I didn’t have them as questions when I saw him
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Bluetit1802
Legend
Whatever you decide, make sure it is your decision. Not ours. Not the doctors. We can only speak from experience. Doctors can only offer medications.
HSSS
Expert
I’m not sure I’d see it as a one then the other scenario. Perhaps the dr and specialist can explain why you can only act on one at a time rather than address both issues.
Nor in your shoes right now would I see the insulin as “diabetes under control”. First aid applied more like whilst long term action to be decided.
Nor in your shoes right now would I see the insulin as “diabetes under control”. First aid applied more like whilst long term action to be decided.
Jackie0022
Well-Known Member
So although treated first with insulin to bring levels down quickly because of how high they were and the ketones, over time the insulin will make the diabetes worse quicker than the tablets and diet over time? Why haven’t the nurses or doctors told me this? I suppose this is another question for Wednesday visit!!
I know I’m harping on a bit but each one of you is shedding more light on things of questions that I feel should have already been answered! Thank you
HSSS
Expert
Because some drs and nurses don’t know this, even those in diabetes care! They think type 2 is progressive and there’s nothing to be done other than take drugs. This is how it used to be seen. As progressive. This is outdated.
The nhs now support low carb eating as an effective strategy, either alone or with medications, to control and even put type 2 into remission. There are support courses they can prescribe such as those run by this website, there are training packages for gp’s written by gps (Dr Unwin) but they are all voluntary. There are research papers aplenty supporting it too. But again it all depends how current the medic in question chooses to keep their training on the subject.
They don’t know also how a blood glucose meter can be used effectively for type 2 not on insulin to identify safe foods. Or to meal and exercise plan and adjust to maintain good levels.
kokhongw
Well-Known Member
Newly diagnosed T2D with insulin resistance will likely produce too much insulin 2-3x normal, but still not enough to handle the amount of carbs typically taken per meal. So if we do not adjust the amount of carbs taken per meal, we will simply need exercise, medication or more insulin to help move the excess glucose some where, eg burn it, pee it out of the system, store it as fats etc.
This is what researchers observed.... Glucose AND Insulin levels are higher than normal for up to 10 years after diagnosis.
Here is Dr Jospeh Krafts view on the issue...
kokhongw
Well-Known Member
Also I find that Diabetes UK reversing T2D page gives a good summary...
https://www.diabetes.co.uk/reversing-diabetes.html
https://www.diabetes.co.uk/reversing-diabetes.html
Jackie - I have to say, Methotrexate wouldn't be my drug of choice, but then I'm not living with the underlying condition either, so I do understand the desire for some relief and improvement.
You might find this thread here to be an elightening read.
http://www.diabetes.co.uk/forum/threads/my-life-since-discovering-lchf.66929/
Bluetit1802
Legend
I imagine you were treated first with insulin because your levels were very high at the time and they needed to act quickly. This is normal procedure and fine.
However, for someone with T2 that has insulin resistance (most of us have/did when diagnosed) insulin as an ongoing treatment is not always the best choice. Most T2s in this category already have too much circulating insulin. So much so that their bodies have become resistant to it so it can't do its job properly. A vicious circle then starts - the more circulating insulin we have the more insulin resistant we become, and the more resistant we become, the more insulin we secrete. (or inject). The more insulin resistant we are, the harder it becomes to keep T2 under control, and the more insulin we have circulating, the tendency is to gain weight.
It would make sense for doctors to do an insulin test on T2s before prescribing ongoing insulin or tablets such as Gliclazide that force the pancreas to produce more insulin. If the person is shown to have plenty of natural insulin, then why does that person need injected insulin or drugs such as Gliclazide? It just increases the large amount of insulin already being secreted and causes more resistance.
Of course, there are T2s that do not produce enough of their own insulin, and this situation is completely different.
Do you know if you had any tests to determine how much insulin you produce naturally? That is a question you could ask.
Jackie0022
Well-Known Member
Ok so I spoke to the DN at the hospital and she has shed some light on things!! Yay!! I am producing some insulin and when the doctor said I was producing too much she seems to think he meant producing too much to be type 1. I asked if I could have the C-peptide test result which is 370! Does this mean anything to anyone?? I phoned the GP and he hasn’t had any referral letter from the hospital so as yet can’t advise on anything. Another question which I’m thinking in advance. Obviously I will have a review in 6 months or a years time who will that be with as I’m in insulin? GP or hospital??
Jackie0022
Well-Known Member
Not sure as I had some bloods fasting and more taken at hospital which weren’t so not sure if this test was from the first or the second batch!!
Bluetit1802
Legend
It seems to make a difference whether it is fasting or random. Can you find out?
Jackie0022
Well-Known Member
I’ll ask when I next speak to them next. I also had a GAD65 test which came back negative (this was not a fasting as this was done separately)
I’m feeling more positive today as the GP agreed with me when I explained the reasons behind staying on the insulin. I feel I can now start looking forward to concentrate on starting the methotrexate! (Until tomorrow when I have another melt down!!!!).
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Jackie0022
Well-Known Member
I have just found this, should I be worried? I have been prescribed metformin to work along side the insulin. Dermatology what me to change from cyclosporin to methotrexate. Does anyone out there know anything until I see the GP in the morning??
HSSS
Expert
It looks like if you want any medication beyond diet change for your diabetes it is going to need to be considered in light of whichever psoriasis drugs you take. There are other options than metformin and insulin, they may be options.
Why not discuss with your gp trying the drastic carb dropping as a means of diabetes control for a trial period (whilst either stopping or closely monitoring/adjusting insulin) and then there’s no interactions with psoriasis drugs and maybe the diet will also help the psoriasis too.
Why not discuss with your gp trying the drastic carb dropping as a means of diabetes control for a trial period (whilst either stopping or closely monitoring/adjusting insulin) and then there’s no interactions with psoriasis drugs and maybe the diet will also help the psoriasis too.
